Propranolol vs Clonidine?

[Jinzo]

I am trying to get my body to run on thyroid instead of adrenaline. I was hoping to use one of these two medications for two weeks or so while I supplement with NDT. However, I do not know which one would be more beneficial. Its my understanding that propranolol blocks adrenaline at the receptors, while clonidine lowers overall adrenaline in the body. In addition to all the high adrenaline symptoms: high anxiety, shaking, palpitations, panic, freezing etc...I also have a lot of muscle tension which I am really looking to fix. Can anybody offer some insight as to which medication would be better for all this? Any personal experiences?

 

[Michael Mohn]

I used Propranolol and it was life changing. I used to struggle with aggressiveness, cold sweat, shaking in stressful situations and propranolol almost completely eliminated it. I took it for 10 days, starting with 20 mg per day (2x10mg per day), the fifths day I went down to 10mg but by then I think I could have stopped. It's good to take some thyroid with it as propranolol blocks the uptake of iodine into the gland. Take only as much propranolol as necessary, some people had dramatic effects with a one time dose of 40mg.

 

[laleto12]

I used Propranolol and it was life changing. I used to struggle with aggressiveness, cold sweat, shaking in stressful situations and propranolol almost completely eliminated it. I took it for 10 days, starting with 20 mg per day (2x10mg per day), the fifths day I went down to 10mg but by then I think I could have stopped. It's good to take some thyroid with it as propranolol blocks the uptake of iodine into the gland. Take only as much propranolol as necessary, some people had dramatic effects with a one time dose of 40mg.

Hi, did the results stay when you stopped the medication? I have the exact symptoms OP mentioned. I tried propanolol but never took continously. Maybe I should try that?

Cold sweats, shaking in stressfull situations are my nightmare literally. How did you manage to solve them? Thanks.

 

[Jinzo]

I used Propranolol and it was life changing. I used to struggle with aggressiveness, cold sweat, shaking in stressful situations and propranolol almost completely eliminated it. I took it for 10 days, starting with 20 mg per day (2x10mg per day), the fifths day I went down to 10mg but by then I think I could have stopped. It's good to take some thyroid with it as propranolol blocks the uptake of iodine into the gland. Take only as much propranolol as necessary, some people had dramatic effects with a one time dose of 40mg.

Amazing. Do you know if you can take cyproheptadine and propranolol at the same time?

 

[Michael Mohn]

Hi, did the results stay when you stopped the medication? I have the exact symptoms OP mentioned. I tried propanolol but never took continously. Maybe I should try that?

Cold sweats, shaking in stressfull situations are my nightmare literally. How did you manage to solve them? Thanks.

When I do sports or work continuously I still get cold sweat but much less and a quick warm shower turns me around instantly. My problem was that I wanted to yell people heads off when stressed and I couldn't think clearly anymore. This has completely disappeared. I think if you don't feel anything after the first or second dose propranolol it's probably not going to help you but there're people who take it as a blood pressure medication for decades without problem. A one time 40mg dose of propranolol is becoming the standard treatment for stage fright, it helps that quickly and decisively or not at all.
I'd started peating 6 years before I took propranolol, with aspirin, thyroid, pregnenolone, dhea, k2, cypro and what not but nothing changed my personality more than 100mg of propranolol. The peaty stuff might have paved the way though. I grew up with lots of stress and I was skipping breakfast for decades. My first 2 years of peating focused on force feeding me breakfast. Keeping blood sugar high is the most important step in lowering high adrenaline plus enough salt and protein (+gelatin!). Low pufa, saturated fats, sunshine and enough calcium obviously help too.

 

[Michael Mohn]

Amazing. Do you know if you can take cyproheptadine and propranolol at the same time?

I don't see why not. Throw in some losartan or progesterone too. Play around, experiment, all the peaty stuff is safe but always listen to your body. If a supp dose nothing then stop it. If you overreact go slowly or you must adresse another issue first. This works only with stuff Peat recommends. Other supps might be helpful too but it can have much stronger side effects.

 

[Jinzo]

Is long acting propranolol okay? Or is it best to just go with the regular in your experience? @Michael Mohn

 

[Michael Mohn]

Is long acting propranolol okay? Or is it best to just go with the regular in your experience? @Michael Mohn

If propranolol works on you, you want a quick action, if it has no effect on you you want the crap out of your system. Half life is 8-12 hours, take a dose every 12 hours. Some people take a one time dose of 40mg against anxiety and have great results. Propranolol blocks iodine uptake into the thyroid you don't want to take it more than a week, the shorter the better and take thyroid. This long acting stuff is for permanent use in hypertensive people, which is madness.

 

[golder]

If propranolol works on you, you want a quick action, if it has no effect on you you want the crap out of your system. Half life is 8-12 hours, take a dose every 12 hours. Some people take a one time dose of 40mg against anxiety and have great results. Propranolol blocks iodine uptake into the thyroid you don't want to take it more than a week, the shorter the better and take thyroid. This long acting stuff is for permanent use in hypertensive people, which is madness

Detailed review, thank you. How do you think the normal shorter acting propranolol compares with clonidine?

 

[Michael Mohn]

Detailed review, thank you. How do you think the normal shorter acting propranolol compares with clonidine?

I haven't tried clonidine and can't opine. @haidut introduced clonidine into the Peat O Sphere as a way to reduce adrenaline and recently he sounded cautious about it. Apparently it looks better on paper than in practice. I rarley hear from people getting their hands on it and rarely do I hear success stories with clonidine. Propranolol is thrown around like candy by MDs. Better keep your hands off clonidine.

 

[redsun]

I haven't tried clonidine and can't opine. @haidut introduced clonidine into the Peat O Sphere as a way to reduce adrenaline and recently he sounded cautious about it. Apparently it looks better on paper than in practice. I rarley hear from people getting their hands on it and rarely do I hear success stories with clonidine. Propranolol is thrown around like candy by MDs. Better keep your hands off clonidine.

Increasing acetylcholine, and GABA and feeding properly (more frequently usually) is more effective dealing with these kinds of problems anyway in order to counteract an overactive sympathetic nervous system and overall high stress hormones which in combination lead to these type of symptoms.

 

[Michael Mohn]

Increasing acetylcholine, and GABA and feeding properly (more frequently usually) is more effective dealing with these kinds of problems anyway in order to counteract an overactive sympathetic nervous system and overall high stress hormones which in combination lead to these type of symptoms.

What kinds of problems benefit from higher acetylcholine? I'm confused. Low acetylcholine was considered good from a pro metabolic angle. High acetylcholine means high parasympathetic system activity which is antimetabolic. Overreacting to stress due to excessive effects of adrenaline can be debilitating, if you can fix this with a few doses of propranolol and you have done all peaty interventions without sufficient effect why would you ignore this drug? Adrenaline reacts in the short term to energy deficiency. What is an overactive sympathetic nervous system? Is it causing or reacting to chronic high adrenaline?

 

[redsun]

What kinds of problems benefit from higher acetylcholine? I'm confused. Low acetylcholine was considered good from a pro metabolic angle. High acetylcholine means high parasympathetic system activity which is antimetabolic. Overreacting to stress due to excessive effects of adrenaline can be debilitating, if you can fix this with a few doses of propranolol and you have done all peaty interventions without sufficient effect why would you ignore this drug? Adrenaline reacts in the short term to energy deficiency. What is an overactive sympathetic nervous system? Is it causing or reacting to chronic high adrenaline?

Chronically high acetylcholine is hard to achieve and some people do have that. I am talking about normalizing acetylcholine. If you easily get these high adrenaline symptoms, low acetylcholine is a major reason as it vital for controlling the sympathetic nervous system so it not overactive and causing you to overreact to any form of mental, physical, or emotional stress. GABA is similar. Peaty interventions is not all you can do and some people even experience worse symptoms from the Peat diet. If the problem is low Ach it is better to correct that as it will not only help those symptoms, but optimize other functions dependent on Ach.

Trust me I know what its like to overreact to any kind of stress, raising acetylcholine was necessary to fix it for me. Your right it is debilitating and its also exhausting. You get sympathetic activation from poor feeding (not enough calories, low glycogen, low protein intake). But if you are addressing this decently and you still easily overreact to stress of any kind, then low ACH is highly likely.

As for what benefits from higher acetylcholine. Memory is dependent on it for starters, from long term memory to remembering where you put your keys. It also helps organize our thoughts and reduce behavioral problems related to low acetylcholine, high noradrenaline/adrenaline which includes manic behavior, impulsivity, anxiety, getting easily angered, poor concentration. If Ach is too low, you will be easily fatigued and worn down from exercise and exercise can reduce your mental capacity (since muscular contractions, thinking/concentration, heavily depend on Ach).

Its actual more important for men to obtain choline in their diet since they have less estrogen. Estrogen is what induces the PEMT enzyme that makes endogenous choline. So we cannot make as much of our own choline as women and are more dependent on dietary choline for optimal function.