Progesterone Periods & PMS

[CosmicDancer444]

Progesterone, Periods & PMS:
I have heard many good things about women incorporating progesterone to ease PMS symptoms.
Seeing as decrease in progesterone indicates start of mensuration, I have been reluctant to use it as I have been worried it may prolong/delay/stop or mess with my period (especially if there has been potentially fertilising intercourse & I don’t use contraception/ birth control. I have strong & clear intentions & I’m quite in tune with my body, but being young & living at home, I can in no way afford to become Pregnant)...
I understand people have different opinions & POVs but for me & my current situation, All I can be is grateful when I receive my period each month.
I would say my periods are regular (average cycle length is about 31 days) - I always get my period directly on/very close to the New Moon & Ovulate around the Full Moon...
I appreciate any advice about progesterone, periods & PMS <3

 

[Birdie]

I cycle it the way Ray advises. I did that when I still had my period. There was a time I took it full time, but usually cycling helps keep your period more regular and helps with PMS.

I am off now, Jan 1 to Jan 6. Then I will go back to my 4 drop dose. The stuff makes me choke unless i drink tea (warm liquid anything) with it.

Was just thinking we needed a new thread on all this. Good work !!

 

[CosmicDancer444]

I cycle it the way Ray advises. I did that when I still had my period. There was a time I took it full time, but usually cycling helps keep your period more regular and helps with PMS.

I am off now, Jan 1 to Jan 6. Then I will go back to my 4 drop dose. The stuff makes me choke unless i drink tea (warm liquid anything) with it.

Was just thinking we needed a new thread on all this. Good work !!

Hi, thanks for your reply! :)
Please may you share or link the way to cycle progesterone in this way?
I would say my periods are regular (average cycle length is about 31 days) - I always get my period directly on/very close to the New Moon & Ovulate around the Full Moon...
I really don’t have any experience with progesterone, I’m young & I was worried about the potential impact on my period & what would happen if I were to take higher doses than I’d get naturally from food...

 

[InChristAlone]

Hi, thanks for your reply! :)
Please may you share or link the way to cycle progesterone in this way?
I would say my periods are regular (average cycle length is about 31 days) - I always get my period directly on/very close to the New Moon & Ovulate around the Full Moon...
I really don’t have any experience with progesterone, I’m young & I was worried about the potential impact on my period & what would happen if I were to take higher doses than I’d get naturally from food...

I think just a change up with what you are doing regarding meal timing and food selection could help the symptoms of estrogen dominance. You have regular periods and that's a very good sign. I agree with @Peatful that you can quickly change this around without hormones.

 

[I'm.No.One]

Just as a thought: Have you considered looking at your diet to see what you can adjust to relieve some of your symptoms?

With you being relatively young sounding I'd hate for you to have to jump on progesterone so quickly.

Yes it can help with symptoms but it's important we don't use things, especially hormones, as a bandaid.

Do you know how much you're eating in a day calorie wise? Are you getting no less than 2500 cals a day? That's the minimum amount a relatively inactive female needs.

Do you eat liver? Other organ meats?

Are you eating animal based fats/proteins?

Dairy?

Carbohydrates?

Anyhow when I began eating much more often/mindfully in a few months my period became much less painful & my mood stabilized.

You might already be doing all of these things but if not I thought it might be helpful to bring up, especially if you're cycling perfectly as that's not really what one would expect if your hormones are out of whack.

 

[CosmicDancer444]

I think just a change up with what you are doing regarding meal timing and food selection could help the symptoms of estrogen dominance. You have regular periods and that's a very good sign. I agree with @Peatful that you can quickly change this around without hormones.

Thanks!
Do you have any recommendations in particular or can you point me towards some info?
I sometimes have late dinners but always have home cooked, whole food meals, ususlly meat, veg, carbs, dairy.
I try to avoid pasta & non-sourdough bread as I usually don’t feel good after or I get bloated.
I notice if I eat pasta for dinner I’m also super hungry when I wake up, is there a reason for this or just coincidence?

 

[I'm.No.One]

Thanks!
Do you have any recommendations in particular or can you point me towards some info?
I sometimes have late dinners but always have home cooked, whole food meals, ususlly meat, veg, carbs, dairy.
I try to avoid pasta & non-sourdough bread as I usually don’t feel good after or I get bloated.
I notice if I eat pasta for dinner I’m also super hungry when I wake up, is there a reason for this or just coincidence?

If you're not having fats/proteins alongside the pasta (carbs) you're waking up really hungry because it's digesting rapidly. But also waking up & feeling hungry pretty soon after waking is good!

Hunger cues are our friend, they mean your metabolism is functioning.

 

[CosmicDancer444]

Just as a thought: Have you considered looking at your diet to see what you can adjust to relieve some of your symptoms?

With you being relatively young sounding I'd hate for you to have to jump on progesterone so quickly.

Yes it can help with symptoms but it's important we don't use things, especially hormones, as a bandaid.

Do you know how much you're eating in a day calorie wise? Are you getting no less than 2500 cals a day? That's the minimum amount a relatively inactive female needs.

Do you eat liver? Other organ meats?

Are you eating animal based fats/proteins?

Dairy?

Carbohydrates?

Anyhow when I began eating much more often/mindfully in a few months my period became much less painful & my mood stabilized.

You might already be doing all of these things but if not I thought it might be helpful to bring up, especially if you're cycling perfectly as that's not really what one would expect if your hormones are out of whack.

Yes I am nearly 20.
I always think there must be something I can change in my diet, but I generally eat very healthy, my mother is a Naturopath & we cook everything at home, fresh/whole food, no microwave, no plant oils.
Only thing more healthy would be growing my own food which I can’t really do where we’re living currently.
Maybe soaking veg in ACV to remove pesticides?..

I’ve never counted calories, so I don’t know specifically how much I’m eating; but I usually have a good big breakfast, no cereals & bs, proper eggs, sourdough, salad, ham/bacon, cheese...

I usually eat 2 main meals a day, breakfast & dinner.

Eat mainly animal based fats, except for cooking with coconut oil & having the occasional avocado with breakfast.

Usually have potatoes as biggest source of carbs; I’m not a fan of refined things & pasta.

I’ve eaten less dairy recently as I was worried about relationship of drinking lots of pasteurised milk & on top of that having kefir, lactic acid & feeding bad intestinal bacteria etc... & on top of that I was overdoing everything, essential oils, kefir & sulfur foods & experiencing bad breath...

I suggest I struggle to methylate/process sulfur but despite the bad breath & feeling gassy I know it makes me feel better after. I thought the only way to improve sulfur methylation & women’s health issues like Candida would be to make sulfur foods & compounds like caprylic acid a more regular part of my diet...

We try to eat liver atleast once a week. We cook bone broths & stews but I don’t have other organs very often.

Sometimes I feel I need to eat more but sometimes I find myself eating for the sake of eating when I’m not actually hungry. Christmas especially has been less mindful eating & more pleasure indulgence eating.

Also when I experience bad period symptoms I always have a lower appetite. I think I should have listened when I didn’t feel like eating or taking supplements this morning as I soon after vomited.

But now I feel much better :)

 

[CosmicDancer444]

If you're not having fats/proteins alongside the pasta (carbs) you're waking up really hungry because it's digesting rapidly. But also waking up & feeling hungry pretty soon after waking is good!

Hunger cues are our friend, they mean your metabolism is functioning.

Aha that’s very interesting!
Yes I believe our body is very good at telling us what we should be doing. Including cravings or feeling we need to eat certain foods.
I have had issues with digestion & sensitivity to cold, always craving warm things & I often crave ginger more than anyone in my family...

 

[I'm.No.One]

Aha that’s very interesting!
Yes I believe our body is very good at telling us what we should be doing. Including cravings or feeling we need to eat certain foods.
I have had issues with digestion & sensitivity to cold, always craving warm things & I often crave ginger more than anyone in my family...

So it sounds like, as crazy as this may sound, you might actually be under eating.

I was the same way for years. Ate really healthy, but not actually enough. From what you've said it sounds like you're really only eating breakfast/dinner & dinner is often late.

Try eating 6 times a day. Breakfast/lunch/dinner & 3 snacks between each meal.

Try doing these meals/snacks at the same time every day (within 30 mins at least) & see how you feel after a month.

Potatoes are awesome but maybe work in some more simple carbs alongside your protein/fats such as fruits of any kind really.

Get those essential oils (VOCs) out of your life, they're endocrine disruptors & slaughter the bacteria in your gut (good or bad).

If you're always cold that's a pretty good indicator your thyroid isn't happy, which under eating can eventually lead to as your body is always in a stressed out state.

You could have your thyroid looked at but before you jump on the meds they'll throw at you continue eating more/reading about what you can do on this forum to help it/your body.

 

[schultz]

If you take it 2 weeks after the start of your period and stop it when your period starts it probably won't affect the consistency of your cycle. This is how my wife takes it. You'd have to just try it for yourself I suppose.

 

[CosmicDancer444]

So it sounds like, as crazy as this may sound, you might actually be under eating.

I was the same way for years. Ate really healthy, but not actually enough. From what you've said it sounds like you're really only eating breakfast/dinner & dinner is often late.

Try eating 6 times a day. Breakfast/lunch/dinner & 3 snacks between each meal.

Try doing these meals/snacks at the same time every day (within 30 mins at least) & see how you feel after a month.

Potatoes are awesome but maybe work in some more simple carbs alongside your protein/fats such as fruits of any kind really.

Get those essential oils (VOCs) out of your life, they're endocrine disruptors & slaughter the bacteria in your gut (good or bad).

If you're always cold that's a pretty good indicator your thyroid isn't happy, which under eating can eventually lead to as your body is always in a stressed out state.

You could have your thyroid looked at but before you jump on the meds they'll throw at you continue eating more/reading about what you can do on this forum to help it/your body.

Thanks for all your help :)
I definitely can see how I may be under-eating which in turn is revving up cortisol which I don’t want.
I’m still conflicted about essential oils, but I think too much of a good thing isn’t a good thing.
I am aware of potency & anti: viral, bacterial microbial & inflammatory properties of EOs.
They don’t have different compounds than whole herbs, they have same compounds but in much higher dosage.
I am doing more research into history of EOs in ancient medicine that has been successively suppressed. I.e Apothecaries in China, India, Middle East, Israel, Greece, Europe, Ancient literature, religious texts etc...
If I use them, I will use them very carefully to address certain health conditions.
Overdoing it is dangerous & unhealthy because your liver already has to deal with fat & these volatile oils are extra. It will affect liver or intestines the most (including gut micro biome )- Might look at more topical use.

But as with anything danger is really in the dose.

I’m not usually cold, but I tend to prefer things that are warming, including foods. I Usually have a good relatively high basal body temperature, just on first day off my period I had chills, nausea and vomiting which went away after 1hr.

 

[I'm.No.One]

Thanks for all your help :)
I definitely can see how I may be under-eating which in turn is revving up cortisol which I don’t want.
I’m still conflicted about essential oils, but I think too much of a good thing isn’t a good thing.
I am aware of potency & anti: viral, bacterial microbial & inflammatory properties of EOs.
They don’t have different compounds than whole herbs, they have same compounds but in much higher dosage.
I am doing more research into history of EOs in ancient medicine that has been successively suppressed. I.e Apothecaries in China, India, Middle East, Israel, Greece, Europe, Ancient literature, religious texts etc...
If I use them, I will use them very carefully to address certain health conditions.
Overdoing it is dangerous & unhealthy because your liver already has to deal with fat & these volatile oils are extra. It will affect liver or intestines the most (including gut micro biome )- Might look at more topical use.

But as with anything danger is really in the dose.

I’m not usually cold, but I tend to prefer things that are warming, including foods. I Usually have a good relatively high basal body temperature, just on first day off my period I had chills, nausea and vomiting which went away after 1hr.

Yes the plants have the VOCs in parts per million, but what they are missing is everything else that's in a plant that crates balance.

The poison being in the dose notion doesn't really work for EOs, homeopathy works by super tiny amounts of something poisonous being extremely diluted. With EOs a single drop is an extreme concentration that typically needs upwards of 10 gallons of water just to be brought to baseline, not dilution.

Anyhow give upping your calories a try & see what making your body feel more safe does

 

[Birdie]

Hi, thanks for your reply! :)
Please may you share or link the way to cycle progesterone in this way?
I would say my periods are regular (average cycle length is about 31 days) - I always get my period directly on/very close to the New Moon & Ovulate around the Full Moon...
I really don’t have any experience with progesterone, I’m young & I was worried about the potential impact on my period & what would happen if I were to take higher doses than I’d get naturally from food...

I think part of the reason for taking a good progesterone is to counteract estrogens and the like. These build up as we age. So starting with a small dose is good even if you have no PMS. Then, when you near menopause a wonderful side effect is that at least in my case I never experienced hot flashes.

Except for the years when I was a struggling science student, I have always eaten home fixed food, following scholars such as Adele Davis and Jonathan Wright until I found Ray Peat. I never thought that diet would give me enough progesterone, but others have their opinions. I find Ray Peat's studies to be extraordinary, and value his opinion and even follow it on some things

I started very low with progesterone as I do every supplement cuz I'm a cautious one. Others are more heroic like charlie and dive right in. I don't remember the protocol I used in my 30s when I started progesterone. I know it was simple.

If you take it 2 weeks after the start of your period and stop it when your period starts it probably won't affect the consistency of your cycle. This is how my wife takes it. You'd have to just try it for yourself I suppose.

This sounds right and is what I would do. Good luck! Buena suerte!

 

[CosmicDancer444]

I think part of the reason for taking a good progesterone is to counteract estrogens and the like. These build up as we age. So starting with a small dose is good even if you have no PMS. Then, when you near menopause a wonderful side effect is that at least in my case I never experienced hot flashes.

Except for the years when I was a struggling science student, I have always eaten home fixed food, following scholars such as Adele Davis and Jonathan Wright until I found Ray Peat. I never thought that diet would give me enough progesterone, but others have their opinions. I find Ray Peat's studies to be extraordinary, and value his opinion and even follow it on some things

I started very low with progesterone as I do every supplement cuz I'm a cautious one. Others are more heroic like charlie and dive right in. I don't remember the protocol I used in my 30s when I started progesterone. I know it was simple.

This sounds right and is what I would do. Good luck! Buena suerte!

Ok great thank you for your help!
I will take a look. I know my mother takes it & she doesn’t experience the typical crazy menopause symptoms; I’m only 19 so I was just sceptical; we eat healthy & apart from the mild or occasional severe PMS where I’ve been vomiting a few times, my cycles are always regular so I didn’t want them to change or other...

I need to start with Ray’s carrot salad again..

Does anyone know why it is mentioned that Ray Peat Nutrition or even Carnivore community can cause Estrogen Dominance in women especially, or perhaps I’ve heard this wrong?... Or why it wouldn’t provide enough progesterone?

¡Muchas Gracias!

 

[CosmicDancer444]

If you take it 2 weeks after the start of your period and stop it when your period starts it probably won't affect the consistency of your cycle. This is how my wife takes it. You'd have to just try it for yourself I suppose.

Thanks for mentioning this.
I would definitely like to try at some point in the future, but I have been reluctant to use it as I am young & still live at home.
Would taking progesterone change when you ovulate/how you ovulate?
Would it impact basal body temperature or other?...
(Fertility awareness Method)
I have been worried about progesterone directly influencing my fertility - Seeing as decrease in progesterone indicates start of mensuration, I was worried that if I increase progesterone it could be a risk* (mainly around potentially fertilising intercourse)...

 

[OccamzRazer]

Would taking progesterone change when you ovulate/how you ovulate?
Would it impact basal body temperature or other?...
(Fertility awareness Method)
I have been worried about progesterone directly influencing my fertility - Seeing as decrease in progesterone indicates start of mensuration, I was worried that if I increase progesterone it could be a risk* (mainly around potentially fertilising intercourse)...

You may want to ask Ray about this directly.

Based on his article Progesterone Summaries, tho, it doesn't sound like mistiming progesterone would increase fertility in that way:

"Since progesterone has none of the harmful side effects of other hormones (except for alteration of the menstrual cycle if it is taken at the wrong time of month), the basic procedure should be to use it in sufficient quantity to make the symptoms disappear, and to time its use so that menstrual cycles are not disrupted. This normally means using it only between ovulation and menstruation unless symptoms are sufficiently serious that a missed period is not important. The basic idea of giving enough to stop the symptoms can be refined by some information on a few of the factors that condition the need for progesterone."