Progestene - Liquid Progesterone (bioidentical)

[haidut]

post 118701 Haidut, I am confused... I just got the progestene I ordered from your Ideal Labs site.

The label on the image on your IdeaLabs site says the ingredients are progesterone, 20mg and other ingredients DMSO, ethanol. And when I click on Progestene on your site it takes me here where the first entry you made on this post says those are the ingredients.

The label on the bottle of progestene I received says the ingredients are progesterone, 20mg and other ingredients Organic olive oil, tocopherols.

I did NOT get what I ordered!!! If you changed the ingredients you should have changed the picture of the bottle on your site and the link to a post here explaining the ingredients of the new formula. I am very disappointed. It's not that I would not have ordered the new formula, but this is so unprofessional to get something I didn't order. How can I trust that the ingredients are what is listed? I put my confidence and trust in you and you let me down.

I already responded to your email. Yes, it is a typo on the label, the product is still DMSO and ethanol based. We must have had some old label left overs from the single batch of Progestene we made in olive oil and tocopherol a few months ago when there was a shortage of high-purity DMSO on the US market. So, actually you did get what you ordered. If you don't believe me, open the bottle and smell the liquid.
As far as the ingredients, no need to trust anyone. Take a few drops of Progestene on your skin and get a blood or saliva progesterone test. That's what everybody should be doing really if they are taking some type of steroid and want to see effects on estrogen, androgens and progesterone.
With that in mind, why don't you tell me what exactly is the issue as I doubt a simple typo would get you so riled up?

 

[treelady]

Haidut, Thank you for your response.

 

[aquaman]

Haidut, the http://www.progesteronetherapy.com/ site says that sometimes males need to take up to 100mg per day to start with to "overcome the effects of estrogen" or something along those lines. They say that Progesterone can trigger Estrogen issues at low doses for men and so sometimes large doses are needed.

Have you seen anything that supports this?

Here is one of the quotes:

Men can also experience oestrogen dominance when first using progesterone.

It is essential to use enough progesterone, about 100-200mg/day, to overcome the excess oestrogen.

.....

Normally men will benefit from 10-20mg/day progesterone, but if a higher than normal amount of oestrogen is present, it's advisable to use up to 100mg/day.

 

[haidut]

post 119026 Haidut, the http://www.progesteronetherapy.com/ site says that sometimes males need to take up to 100mg per day to start with to "overcome the effects of estrogen" or something along those lines. They say that Progesterone can trigger Estrogen issues at low doses for men and so sometimes large doses are needed.

Have you seen anything that supports this?

Here is one of the quotes:

Men can also experience oestrogen dominance when first using progesterone.

It is essential to use enough progesterone, about 100-200mg/day, to overcome the excess oestrogen.

.....

Normally men will benefit from 10-20mg/day progesterone, but if a higher than normal amount of oestrogen is present, it's advisable to use up to 100mg/day.

I have seen the opposite happen actually - i.e. lower dose progesterone convert into androgens through the androstenedione pathway. Animal studies show progesterone can increase even DHT. Remember, taking progesterone and getting higher blood levels of estrogen means not higher but LOWER estrogen in tissues. The true test would be taking low dose progesterone and measuring blood prolactin. If systemic estrogenic activity is higher then prolactin would be higher as well. However, all the studies I have seen with all kinds of progesterone doses show that prolactin goes down. So, it is highly unlikley that progesterone increase estrogen in lower doses.

 

[m_arch]

Hi Haidut,

Is it possible to take multiple supplements at once - say EstroBan, Oxidal and Progestene?
Are there any negative interactions between any of these supplements?
Do you suggest spacing them apart if taking more than one?

Thanks

 

[haidut]

post 119152 Hi Haidut,

Is it possible to take multiple supplements at once - say EstroBan, Oxidal and Progestene?
Are there any negative interactions between any of these supplements?
Do you suggest spacing them apart if taking more than one?

Thanks

Yes, it is possible and many people on the forum do it, often with synergistic results. I am not aware of any interaction between the supplements, but taking high dose Oxidal so that it gives you more than 10mg methylene blue and Pansterone/StressNon can give some people temporary blood pressure spike. But the specific combination of supplements you listed is probably OK to use in combination.

 

[ilovethesea]

Haidut, I wanted to let you (and everyone else) know that I think Progestene works extremely well - for me, it is much better than Progest-E.

I have been rubbing drops of Progestene on my chest or upper arms, not even at the dosage on the bottle, and I can easily see/feel a difference.

Progest-E I was taking by mouth for 2+ years and never felt like I noticed anything from it. I don't know if that's because the Progest-E formula is not as good (I think someone said the company in charge now maybe altered the formula?), or if there is something wrong with how I absorb things orally.

Anyway, have been taking Progestene with a few drops of Pansterone and I feel good from both (not sure which one is doing the most so will have to test later).

So far, I noticed more perfect skin, less rosacea/redness, less oil production, calmer mood. I am really happy with this product! The only issue I have is I get skin irritation from the DMSO, so I have to rotate where I put it or I get rough scaly red patches.

 

[ilovethesea]

One more question Haidut. Do you think Progestene would be useful for cellulite areas? I am very frustrated with cellulite on my upper thighs and they feel cold to the touch. Or would one of your other products - Solban? - be better for treating cellulite?

If cellulite is really stored PUFA then I don't understand how it is not going away, as I haven't eaten PUFA in almost that time... but this area does not budge.

 

[M719]

Has anyone else experienced a bad smelling order when you sweat? It seems to be from the dmso in the progestene that I am taking. I have been taking it for the past 2 weeks. Will it eventually go away?

 

[haidut]

Has anyone else experienced a bad smelling order when you sweat? It seems to be from the dmso in the progestene that I am taking. I have been taking it for the past 2 weeks. Will it eventually go away?

It is expected side effect from DMSO-based supplements. Most people report that it disappears within 48 hours after stopping usage. As far as I know the DMSO does not build up in the body, so no long term issues are expected.

 

[DesertRat]

I am about to order Progestene. I have been rubbing Progest-E on my gums at night and then putting on a dental guard so that it absorbs through the gums. Can I use Progestene on the gums? Is that considered oral or transdermal?

Second question for any Europeans: I leave 1 February for Rome. Will I be able to order Progest-E in Europe if I don't do well with Progestene? I saw someone mention a European supplier earlier. It is too close to departure to order Progest-E anyway, plus it makes me cough a lot if any gets into the throat, no matter how new the bottle.

 

[Such_Saturation]

I am about to order Progestene. I have been rubbing Progest-E on my gums at night and then putting on a dental guard so that it absorbs through the gums. Can I use Progestene on the gums? Is that considered oral or transdermal?

Second question for any Europeans: I leave 1 February for Rome. Will I be able to order Progest-E in Europe if I don't do well with Progestene? I saw someone mention a European supplier earlier. It is too close to departure to order Progest-E anyway, plus it makes me cough a lot if any gets into the throat, no matter how new the bottle.

I got Progest-E from the United Kingdom a couple years ago, it came out like $50 with shipping. But a small envelope such as that bottle can easily come through from out of Europe, as long as nothing is listed on the outside it will not get stopped.

 

[haidut]

One more question Haidut. Do you think Progestene would be useful for cellulite areas? I am very frustrated with cellulite on my upper thighs and they feel cold to the touch. Or would one of your other products - Solban? - be better for treating cellulite?

If cellulite is really stored PUFA then I don't understand how it is not going away, as I haven't eaten PUFA in almost that time... but this area does not budge.

Thanks for the great feedback!
I think Progestene, SolBan and EstroBan can all be used for cellulite support as they all oppose estrogen and PUFA storage when applied topically. It is just a matter of finding out which one(s) work best for you.

 

[haidut]

I am about to order Progestene. I have been rubbing Progest-E on my gums at night and then putting on a dental guard so that it absorbs through the gums. Can I use Progestene on the gums? Is that considered oral or transdermal?

Second question for any Europeans: I leave 1 February for Rome. Will I be able to order Progest-E in Europe if I don't do well with Progestene? I saw someone mention a European supplier earlier. It is too close to departure to order Progest-E anyway, plus it makes me cough a lot if any gets into the throat, no matter how new the bottle.

Some people put Progestene on their gums. I think that would still be considered topical since it avoids the first pass metabolism. Don't much about ordering Progest-E in Europe but we have been shipping Progestene to Europe without issues.

 

[mayweatherking]

what do you think about progesterone after taking something like finasteride? progesterone is a 5AR inhibitor. i wonder if the 5AR enzymes are damaged from finasteride.. if it would have a positive effect or negative effect. high estrogen and high cortisol are two symptoms i do have and are clear indicators of "post finasteride syndrome". i wonder if the 5AR enzymes are truly damaged... or the hormones are just broken and progesterone would help by supressing the cortisol and estrogen... or cause more damage by further downregulating an all ready downn regulated 5AR2... not sure. just wondering if you thought about it before.

 

[goodandevil]

Poor haidut.

 

[aarfai]

Males, what has your experience and dosage with topical progestene been like? Particularly estrogen and libido.
Thank you in advance

 

[haidut]

what do you think about progesterone after taking something like finasteride? progesterone is a 5AR inhibitor. i wonder if the 5AR enzymes are damaged from finasteride.. if it would have a positive effect or negative effect. high estrogen and high cortisol are two symptoms i do have and are clear indicators of "post finasteride syndrome". i wonder if the 5AR enzymes are truly damaged... or the hormones are just broken and progesterone would help by supressing the cortisol and estrogen... or cause more damage by further downregulating an all ready downn regulated 5AR2... not sure. just wondering if you thought about it before.

I am not sure I buy the whole "progesterone as a 5-AR inhibitor" claim. Lower dose progesterone is used clinically as a pro-drug for raising levels of allopregnanolone and the allopegnanolone is synthesized by 5-AR. So, if progesterone is indeed inhibiting 5-AR it must happen in doses of more than 100mg orally per day. See below.
Oral progesterone increases testosterone and DHT | Ray Peat Forum

 

[mayweatherking]

I am not sure I buy the whole "progesterone as a 5-AR inhibitor" claim. Lower dose progesterone is used clinically as a pro-drug for raising levels of allopregnanolone and the allopegnanolone is synthesized by 5-AR. So, if progesterone is indeed inhibiting 5-AR it must happen in doses of more than 100mg orally per day. See below.
Oral progesterone increases testosterone and DHT | Ray Peat Forum

Cool thanks. Yeah that's a good point.. I've seen the studies too saying that preg increases allopreg levels. I definetely felt the effects of that.. I have never felt emotionally better in a very long time since starting preg (although I did feel sick today from it, not sure what the deal is, could be not enough food related), but I'm hoping progesterone does something similar and enhances that. I bought your progestone off your site, thanks haidut.

 

[Ulla]

I take Progestene topical. On legs, tummy, neck...

Is it safe to take it oral?
Amounts would be the same? Possible effects: better/worse absorbtion?