Problems with facial fat wasting - Skinny/gaunt face

[Sila]

Would other oils work in this regard? Greeks once bathed in olive oil. Would it be indicated in other areas of cachexia like forearms etc where disease can waste fat?

Not sure about olive oil. I think the oil has to be high in pufa to work.

 

[Zigzag]

This is an interesting picture but I have forehead wrinkles/slight nasolabial folds and my under eye circles are dark which points to IGF-1 and cortisol deficiency. Both of those hormones are high in me

Same issues here. Forehead wrinkles might be from using your eyebrows too much. Folds and dark circles are quite often caused by your predisposition to not store much fat in there OR just bad bone structure. Obviously if we're talking not about someone who is 40+.

 

[baccheion]

Yes, that's understandable. But how does one increase or replace aldosterone?

The one from the link uses hormone replacement (ie, directly supplements it). Aldosterone goes down with weaker adrenals/HPTA. One theory for its decline with age is rising cortisol. Maybe it's to add more salt to meet requirements.

This is an interesting picture but I have forehead wrinkles/slight nasolabial folds and my under eye circles are dark which points to IGF-1 and cortisol deficiency. Both of those hormones are high in me

Do you have adrenal issues? Some have success taking vitamin K for dark circles.

What was high, free IGF-1? What were the actual lab results? Insulin resistance? Maybe there's something about the body losing sensitivity. IGF-1:cortisol matters and so does IGF-1:estradiol.

I can't even help myself. I doubt I'll help you.

 

[johnwester130]

My face has been very skinny for a few years now and recently seems to be losing even more weight. I lost the weight from my face in quite a short period of time in my late twenties. Over maybe a year. Up until then I had a full face. The volume of my face now does not correlate with the weight/mass of my body. Body wise, I am reasonably well built and of around average weight, with a small amount of fat on the belly/chest areas. My face though looks as though I've not eaten in weeks. People often refer to me is skinny or say "there's not much of you is there" when all they are seeing is my face during winter etc, but body wise I am not skinny at all.

The gaunt-looking face absolutely destroys my confidence. I avoid as much social interaction as possible for fear of the reaction from friends and family. My jaw has become extremely pointed/and thin looking. I have yet been unable to find a way to resolve this.

Generally putting on weight, helps to a minor degree but my body would have to become extremely overweight for my face to look anywhere near healthy and not skinny. So this isn't really an option. Starchy carbs/grains can make a subtle difference but I assume this likely water weight and I am currently avoiding these foods.

Has anyone experienced this and managed to improve it?

I've had an issue with the cartilage in my throat and a restriction of the movement of the throat structures when swallowing. Sounds unlikely but to me it feels as though there could be a link between this and the facial weight loss as they began around the same time. Nonetheless, if anyone has any ideas on how to increase weight in the face, please share.

ever considered lysine/proline/glycine - which build collagen? they also positively change your hormones

obviously do not use sunflower oil. this is the only forum on the internet that warns about vegetable oils

 

[ursidae]

The one from the link uses hormone replacement (ie, directly supplements it). Aldosterone goes down with weaker adrenals/HPTA. One theory for its decline with age is rising cortisol. Maybe it's to add more salt to meet requirements.

Do you have adrenal issues? Some have success taking vitamin K for dark circles.

What was high, free IGF-1? What were the actual lab results? Insulin resistance? Maybe there's something about the body losing sensitivity. IGF-1:cortisol matters and so does IGF-1:estradiol.

I can't even help myself. I doubt I'll help you.

Insulin resistance was indicated. the only time In my life I remember my dark circles being slightly better is when I ate a ton of liver

 

[ursidae]

Same issues here. Forehead wrinkles might be from using your eyebrows too much. Folds and dark circles are quite often caused by your predisposition to not store much fat in there OR just bad bone structure. Obviously if we're talking not about someone who is 40+.

True true though I know people my age with just as intense expressions who don’t have those wrinkles. But bone structure is definitely not good, no cheekbones/bad maxilla

 

[Zigzag]

True true though I know people my age with just as intense expressions who don’t have those wrinkles. But bone structure is definitely not good, no cheekbones/bad maxilla

Yeah, my gf and her sister both have skin of a teenager at age of 28. Not a single sign of aging - and no they don't follow low PUFA diets (for all people here who think PUFAs are the main cause of all the bad things), quite the opposite. This is such a conundrum heh.

 

[ursidae]

Yeah, my gf and her sister both have skin of a teenager at age of 28. Not a single sign of aging - and no they don't follow low PUFA diets (for all people here who think PUFAs are the main cause of all the bad things), quite the opposite. This is such a conundrum heh.

Nuts/fish type of pufa or seed oils?

 

[Zigzag]

Nuts/fish type of pufa or seed oils?

Fish, nuts, chips, vegetable oils in general. Processed food like cookies as well.

 

[Callmestar]

Fish, nuts, chips, vegetable oils in general. Processed food like cookies as well.

I have mates that eat Mcdonalds/fries/sweets as the main staple of their diets. Early 30s and faces baby smooth. Then others who think they've done it all right and look haggard by 30. It's genetics.

 

[Zigzag]

I have mates that eat Mcdonalds/fries/sweets as the main staple of their diets. Early 30s and faces baby smooth. Then others who think they've done it all right and look haggard by 30. It's genetics.

Yep

 

[ursidae]

I have mates that eat Mcdonalds/fries/sweets as the main staple of their diets. Early 30s and faces baby smooth. Then others who think they've done it all right and look haggard by 30. It's genetics.

what aspect of genetics is the question, genetically strong thyroid? Also conditions during prenatal and infancy stage are more important IMO

 

[Zigzag]

what aspect of genetics is the question, genetically strong thyroid? Also conditions during prenatal and infancy stage are more important IMO

Semantics at this point. Can't be changed with diet/supplementation/etc

 

[Ben.]

I have mates that eat Mcdonalds/fries/sweets as the main staple of their diets. Early 30s and faces baby smooth. Then others who think they've done it all right and look haggard by 30. It's genetics.

Genetics is such a cheap excuse to these observations. It not only undervalues any research in science and the complex mechanisms affecting every cell in our body around the clock and the adaption it is capable off, it also craps on the very effort many are trying to make to better themself and their health.

It also discredits every hard work that people had put into their lifes, those who were not naturally gifted but managed to "make it" despite the odds.
It is the excuse when the established science nor the observation seems to make sense. If we would believe in genetics being this bad luck draw we made from the minute we were born we might aswell not bother even trying anything ....

---

There is one thing people eating "unhealthy food" but still having smooth skin and great hair have in common ... they don't obsess over their food and the ingredients and do not have this pathological fear towards it, constantly triggering some traumatic subconscious response whenever there is something in the food that is not ideal ...

Stress in all its forms is much more likely to cause accelerated aging and malfunctioning of the body/organs ... in w/e shape or form it comes from is another, bigger topic ... Food is one of many many variables in the equation.

 

[Callmestar]

Genetics is such a cheap excuse to these observations. It not only undervalues any research in science and the complex mechanisms affecting every cell in our body around the clock and the adaption it is capable off, it also craps on the very effort many are trying to make to better themself and their health.

It also discredits every hard work that people had put into their lifes, those who were not naturally gifted but managed to "make it" despite the odds.
It is the excuse when the established science nor the observation seems to make sense. If we would believe in genetics being this bad luck draw we made from the minute we were born we might aswell not bother even trying anything ....

---

There is one thing people eating "unhealthy food" but still having smooth skin and great hair have in common ... they don't obsess over their food and the ingredients and do not have this pathological fear towards it, constantly triggering some traumatic subconscious response whenever there is something in the food that is not ideal ...

Stress in all its forms is much more likely to cause accelerated aging and malfunctioning of the body/organs ... in w/e shape or form it comes from is another, bigger topic ... Food is one of many many variables in the equation.

Genetics is the main component. That doesn't mean I disregard the impact of biohacking the body, dietary changes, supplementation, stress reduction etc. They all have an impact and I attempt to partake in them. But the perfect lifestyle choices made by somebody with bad genetics in terms of skin, will not allow them to reach the level of the person with great genetics even if that person had a diet of Mcdonalds 3 times a day.

 

[Ledo]

Stress in all its forms is much more likely to cause accelerated aging and malfunctioning of the body/organs ... in w/e shape or form it comes from is another, bigger topic ... Food is one of many many variables in the equation.

There is one thing people eating "unhealthy food" but still having smooth skin and great hair have in common ... they don't obsess over their food and the ingredients and do not have this pathological fear towards it, constantly triggering some traumatic subconscious response whenever there is something in the food that is not ideal ...

I think this is very much true and in addition to neurotic self imposed stress as you point out, I will add its polar opposite which keeps some people looking good despite their diet.

A supreme confidence (narcissistic) in one self even to the extent much delusion is present and/or the state of just being not that smart...dumb even or more nicely put, laid back and blissfully unaware of the sharks and alligators all around.

Actually if the personality type is not type A in the extreme, very successful people seem to have a major health benefit as well.

I think we have the negative stress hormones vs. steroid hormones of high metabolism being triggered by personality and environment.

 

[Ben.]

Genetics is the main component. That doesn't mean I disregard the impact of biohacking the body, dietary changes, supplementation, stress reduction etc. They all have an impact and I attempt to partake in them. But the perfect lifestyle choices made by somebody with bad genetics in terms of skin, will not allow them to reach the level of the person with great genetics even if that person had a diet of Mcdonalds 3 times a day.

I am not denying that genetics do not play their role or that they influence or determine our lower or upper potential limits, but saying some have these super genes that allows them to eat crap while others do the best they can and just have ***t skin is for me not an observation that i would explain via genetics, but much rather with the people suffering some underlying, unresolved health issue, prolly internally or from the enviroment or both.

The Fitness or Celebtrity industry is a prime example for the genetic narrative to be overblown out of proportion. Skinny guys not worth looking at twice becoming big and/or shredded suddenly get praised by the masses for being genetically superior. The same goes with many athletes, musicians etc. Once they are at the "top" people trowh the words talent/genetics into the room with no basis of reality or appreaciation of biochemistry and the incrediblity of natures possibilities.

Wether one beliefs in evolution or adaption ... either way, having bad eye sight, not being able to eat/digest food, having bad skin, low energy etc. are all disadvantages for basicly all interactions with the environment and are not normal, nor should they be seen as such and i highly doubt that most people come out of their mothers womb with all these chronic health issues people have (sadly some exceptions do ... by man made chemicals... another topic for another day).
The very problem why both scienticsts and doctors often times fail at healing or improving the situation of their patients ... is a distorted perception of normality.

If it is genes than there had to be something, somewhere, somehow down the ancestral line where this mutation happened, or it occured during ones own lifespan trough some sort of stressor caused by a form of trauma, damage or event. If it can mutate into something bad, why not also into something good? I've come across people with the worst skin one could imagine and they ended up having great, soft skin with the necessary changes.

This includes fixing the gut, fixing the enviromental factors, fixing psychological associations, fixing their emotional state, resolving conflicts within relationships etc.
And fixing means you can finally eat something bad and it won't trowh you out of balance and does not instantly lead to flare ups.

I think this is very much true and in addition to neurotic self imposed stress as you point out, I will add its polar opposite which keeps some people looking good despite their diet.

A supreme confidence (narcissistic) in one self even to the extent much delusion is present and/or the state of just being not that smart...dumb even or more nicely put, laid back and blissfully unaware of the sharks and alligators all around.

Actually if the personality type is not type A in the extreme, very successful people seem to have a major health benefit as well.

I think we have the negative stress hormones vs. steroid hormones of high metabolism being triggered by personality and environment.

Ignorance is bliss they say. And there is some truth to that. Knowing all these nutritional stuff is great, but not if it comes with pathological fear. This applys to social or enviromental interactions too.

... damn ... you explained all i wanted to say with one easy last sentence there.

 

[Explorer]

I have high cholesterol according to blood tests. I will check out your thread though.

Maybe you are not converting it enough for some reason so the serum levels stay high, do you know what your Thyroid hormones levels are like?

 

[Callmestar]

Bloods. The results in pink and dark blue indicate the markers most out of range.

View attachment 22132View attachment 22133View attachment 22134

 

[Callmestar]

Maybe you are not converting it enough for some reason so the serum levels stay high, do you know what your Thyroid hormones levels are like?

Bloods attached above. My thyroid markers are in normal range but some on her suspected there might be signs of hypothyroid.