Pregnant Cows = High Estrogen Dairy Fat?

[cyclops]

I read somewhere that farmers keep cows pregnant 24/7 (to make more money) and that makes the fat they these cows produce in dairy products very high in estrogen, unnaturally so. Meaning dairy fat should normally be good for us to consume hormonally, but it is effectively bad because they are kept unnaturally pregnant all year round. Should we be concerned about consuming dairy fat for this reason?

 

[Elephanto]

Exposure to exogenous estrogen through intake of commercial milk produced from pregnant cows. - PubMed - NCBI

After the intake of cow milk, serum estrone (E1) and progesterone concentrations significantly increased, and serum luteinizing hormone, follicle-stimulating hormone and testosterone significantly decreased in men.

 

[cyclops]

Thanks for posting this. Below is the entire thing. I find this very concerning. I know many on here drink low-fat milk as commonly recommended by Peat.

BACKGROUND:
Modern genetically improved dairy cows continue to lactate throughout almost the entire pregnancy. Therefore, recent commercial cow's milk contains large amounts of estrogens and progesterone. With regard to the exposure of prepubertal children to exogenous estrogens, the authors are particularly concerned about commercial milk produced from pregnant cows. The purpose of the present study was therefore to examine concentrations of serum and urine sex hormones after the intake of cow milk.

METHODS:
Subjects were seven men, six prepubertal children, and five women. The men and children drank 600 mL/m(2) of cow milk. Urine samples were collected 1 h before the milk intake and four times every hour after intake. In men the serum samples were obtained before and 15, 30, 45, 60, 90 and 120 min after milk intake. Women drank 500 mL of cow's milk every night for 21 days beginning on the first day of the second menstruation. In three successive menstrual cycles, the day of ovulation was examined using an ovulation checker.

RESULTS:
After the intake of cow milk, serum estrone (E1) and progesterone concentrations significantly increased, and serum luteinizing hormone, follicle-stimulating hormone and testosterone significantly decreased in men. Urine concentrations of E1, estradiol, estriol and pregnanediol significantly increased in all adults and children. In four out of five women, ovulation occurred during the milk intake, and the timing of ovulation was similar among the three menstrual cycles.

CONCLUSIONS:
The present data on men and children indicate that estrogens in milk were absorbed, and gonadotropin secretion was suppressed, followed by a decrease in testosterone secretion. Sexual maturation of prepubertal children could be affected by the ordinary intake of cow milk.

 

[cyclops]

This seems especially concerning for those who have young children.

Also, I rely heavily on dairy as a real food source of calcium as I do not like the idea of supplementing, even eggshells (I take too much supplements already) and I don't really like greens. I think it would be hard to get enough calcium from vegetables.

 

[postman]

Yeah the milk can have 30x the normal amount of estrogen and progesterone if the cow is milked by the end of its pregnancy. I don't eat dairy anymore. It either caused gynocomastia for me or at least made it a lot more noticable. There is a study where they gave gave schoolkids milk that was milked in a traditional manner, from steppe cows in China somewhere, and then compared it to regular commercial milk. The traditional milk didn't cause any issue but the commercial milk decreased everyones testosterone levels.

 

[cyclops]

Wow. Does anyone have a defense for milk on this? I know many here drink it, as do I. But I'm thinking I have to give it up if this is fact.

Or is it just the fat portion of dairy doing this? Meaning skim dairy products will not have any of these negative effects?

 

[Elephanto]

It's also ironic how young alt-right activists have coined the term "soyboy" but when you look at pictures of their meet-ups where they carry plastic milk jugs with pride they all, without exception, fit the description of a numale/manchild, visibly very low in testosterone. I think the term milkboy should exist too.

Hormones are stored in fat, this effect probably would not happen with 0% milk. Nothing you'd miss on that you can't get from other sources (good fats from Coconut Oil and pure stearic acid, cholesterol and Vitamin A from caviar, liver etc). Personally I avoid dairy also for the opioid receptors-triggering peptides it contains but not everyone may be equally sensitive to their effects.

 

[Markus]

I don't consume dairy products from cows but maybe goat can be a safe alternative without the estrogenic effect.

 

[cyclops]

Ironically enough I remember reading that butter is somehow still great and unaffected by this from the same source. Figure that out! I forget where I was reading this though, it was some days ago.

 

[postman]

Wow. Does anyone have a defense for milk on this? I know many here drink it, as do I. But I'm thinking I have to give it up if this is fact.

Or is it just the fat portion of dairy doing this? Meaning skim dairy products will not have any of these negative effects?

The hormones are concentrated in the fat so low fat dairy products should not be as bad.

It's also ironic how young alt-right activists have coined the term "soyboy" but when you look at pictures of their meet-ups where they carry plastic milk jugs with pride they all, without exception, fit the description of a numale/manchild, visibly very low in testosterone. I think the term milkboy should exist too.

It's very ironic. I definitely think dairy is the most feminizing food, way more than soy. I also find it ironic how Danny Roddy claims DHT has nothing to do with hairloss and that his regimen is proof of this, meanwhile like 40% of his diet is dairy, full of powerful anti-androgens.

 

[cyclops]

This may be a redundant question, but this would effect cheese too right -- the process of making cheese does not eliminate the negative effects of the dairy fat in it? This is not just in regard to milk, but all dairy products?

Also has ray ever mentioned pregnant cows and the negative effects? I can't find him discussing this, but I'd think its something he must be aware of, that they keep these cows pregnant year round.

 

[Elephanto]

Ironically enough I remember reading that butter is somehow still great and unaffected by this from the same source. Figure that out! I forget where I was reading this though, it was some days ago.

Butter is by far the highest source of mammalian estrogen on Earth. I don't know if it would have the same effect on testosterone since other mechanisms may be at play (opioids are known to decrease testosterone and butter lacks casein & whey which both contain opioid-triggering peptides).

Estrone and 17beta-estradiol concentrations in pasteurized-homogenized milk and commercial dairy products. - PubMed - NCBI

Estrone concentrations averaged 2.9, 4.2, 5.7, 7.9, 20.4, 54.1 pg/mL, and 118.9 pg/g in skim, 1%, 2%, and whole milks, half-and-half, cream, and butter samples, respectively. 17Beta-estradiol concentrations averaged 0.4, 0.6, 0.9, 1.1, 1.9, 6.0 pg/mL, and 15.8 pg/g in skim, 1%, 2%, whole milks, half-and-half, cream, and butter samples, respectively.

Can't really find studies on butter regarding testosterone but Olive Oil has reliably and significantly increased testosterone in several studies, despite its MUFA content but it's from a substance called oleuropein.

 

[Elephanto]

@postman
This is very subjective, but I think that Roddy has the vibe/looks of someone high on Opioids on most of his pics/videos. Like a low-energy, sedated, pockets under the eyes look and definitely no signs of high androgen levels.

 

[Aymen]

[ESTROGEN IN MILK] High estrogen, relative to progesterone, interferes with lactation, and the enzymes that convert estradiol to the less active estrone and estriol are increased by progesterone. The amount of estradiol in milk is usually much less than one microgram per liter, and it's concentrated in the cream, so low-fat milk has very little estrogen. The cow's diet is probably a more important factor in the estrogen content of milk than pregnancy. The information in that abstract isn't enough to tell whether the study was done properly.

 

[Aymen]

Consumption of Natural Estrogens in Cow’s Milk Does Not Affect Blood Levels or Reproductive Health

 

[cyclops]

[ESTROGEN IN MILK] High estrogen, relative to progesterone, interferes with lactation, and the enzymes that convert estradiol to the less active estrone and estriol are increased by progesterone. The amount of estradiol in milk is usually much less than one microgram per liter, and it's concentrated in the cream, so low-fat milk has very little estrogen. The cow's diet is probably a more important factor in the estrogen content of milk than pregnancy. The information in that abstract isn't enough to tell whether the study was done properly.

This is great, thanks. Ray shows he is aware of pregnant cows but says the amount of estradiol is very small and mostly in the fat. I know he uses cream and butter sometimes so he must think it is low enough to not be a concern. I think he mainly drinks low fat milk, but not because he is concerned with estrogen in higher fat milk, but because it would just be too much dietary fat for him personally in his diet.

 

[postman]

[ESTROGEN IN MILK] High estrogen, relative to progesterone, interferes with lactation, and the enzymes that convert estradiol to the less active estrone and estriol are increased by progesterone. The amount of estradiol in milk is usually much less than one microgram per liter, and it's concentrated in the cream, so low-fat milk has very little estrogen. The cow's diet is probably a more important factor in the estrogen content of milk than pregnancy. The information in that abstract isn't enough to tell whether the study was done properly.

There is about 20x more progesterone than estrogen in milk. So you're not likely to get estrogen dominant on dairy, quite the opposite. But progesterone is an anti-androgen, it lowers testosterone. There are plenty of studies showing massively increased levels of sex hormones in milk from pregnant cows, it's not just a one off thing. Both estrogen and progesterone levels are increased in the milk

 

[cyclops]

There is about 20x more progesterone than estrogen in milk. So you're not likely to get estrogen dominant on dairy, quite the opposite. But progesterone is an anti-androgen, it lowers testosterone. There are plenty of studies showing massively increased levels of sex hormones in milk from pregnant cows, it's not just a one off thing. Both estrogen and progesterone levels are increased in the milk

But what are the total amounts? I think a man can take a little progesterone and be ok. Many men on here take 1 or two drops a day of a progesterone supplement so like 3-6mg. I think the total amounts are important.

 

[Aymen]

There is about 20x more progesterone than estrogen in milk. So you're not likely to get estrogen dominant on dairy, quite the opposite. But progesterone is an anti-androgen, it lowers testosterone. There are plenty of studies showing massively increased levels of sex hormones in milk from pregnant cows, it's not just a one off thing. Both estrogen and progesterone levels are increased in the milk

milk contains androgens too , the hormones in milk would balance the bad effect of estrogen

 

[Aymen]

This is great, thanks. Ray shows he is aware of pregnant cows but says the amount of estradiol is very small and mostly in the fat. I know he uses cream and butter sometimes so he must think it is low enough to not be a concern. I think he mainly drinks low fat milk, but not because he is concerned with estrogen in higher fat milk, but because it would just be too much dietary fat for him personally in his diet.

exactly .