PQQ

[miquelangeles]

I’ve taken 1-4mg once daily before bed on and off for three years, probably slightly less than a year ‘on’ cumulative. When I first tried it I took it the morning and I very quickly noticed that it made me quite sleepy, and thereafter I noticed an improvement in morning wakefulness when I took it before bed. I’m currently on my longest ‘on’ stint of ~5 months, and I will be doing regular bloodwork in October which will inform my decision whethet to continue using pqq. The sleep aid effect persists for me, and while it is hard to point to any other effects with certainty I do feel that I have improved fitness maintenance with deconditioning.

How do you split such a small dose? Are you dissolving it in olive oil or something? I know both CoQ10 and PQQ are fat soluble.
What are you looking to see from bloodwork? Whether supplementation had a detrimental effect which will make you discontinue?

 

[Dr. B]

How do you split such a small dose? Are you dissolving it in olive oil or something? I know both CoQ10 and PQQ are fat soluble.
What are you looking to see from bloodwork? Whether supplementation had a detrimental effect which will make you discontinue?

@TobyBjorn how does pqq impact things like the overall metabolic rate, hydrogen peroxide, glutathione, etc...?

 

[TobyBjorn]

How do you split such a small dose? Are you dissolving it in olive oil or something? I know both CoQ10 and PQQ are fat soluble.
What are you looking to see from bloodwork? Whether supplementation had a detrimental effect which will make you discontinue?

Indeed, I mix it into MCT oil. The four fold margin of error is my calculated uncertainty for this method of dosing.
I will be primarily looking for any signal of kidney changes in the bloodwork. I have no doubt that acute pqq use is generally safe, but I regularly check bloodwork whenever I am experimenting with chronic use of something like this.

 

[TobyBjorn]

@TobyBjorn how does pqq impact things like the overall metabolic rate, hydrogen peroxide, glutathione, etc...?

I don’t expect much net change in metabolic rate after homeostasis is reached. I certainly haven’t experienced any increase in body temps or heart rate. I have seen a lot of data suggesting pqq can stongly induce the superoxide __ase enzymes, but the studies I have seen are neither in humans or in chronic clinical use. But as a redox agent it should be a pretty potent antioxidant, which is part of my reason to cycle off from time to time at least until I learn more.

 

[Makrosky]

I am resurrecting this old post to see if anyone else can provide their experience with this substance.

A June 21, 2021 post by @Mr.Bollox in the Email Advice Repository mentions Ray's comment on PQQ:
"PQQ is probably safe, but I think much more research is needed to be sure"

I've been taking Jarrow 20mg PQQ for a few days and from day 1 I felt a noticeable increase in energy and alertness, both mental and physical.
In the past I've taken both ubiquinol and ubiquinone but the effects were much more subtle, nothing like what PQQ feels like.
It just feels too good that now I'm skeptical about its safety. Anyone here that can share their experience?

I am having very good results with 10mg plain cheap PQQ+15 drops of energin in the morning. Also wondering about its safety but it does so much good. I haven't read any negatives about it yet.

 

[Makrosky]

I don’t expect much net change in metabolic rate after homeostasis is reached. I certainly haven’t experienced any increase in body temps or heart rate. I have seen a lot of data suggesting pqq can stongly induce the superoxide __ase enzymes, but the studies I have seen are neither in humans or in chronic clinical use. But as a redox agent it should be a pretty potent antioxidant, which is part of my reason to cycle off from time to time at least until I learn more.

Apparently the better benefits come for prolonged use, since it regenerates mitochondria. With sporadic use you might be getting just half the benefits?

 

[Dr. B]

I am having very good results with 10mg plain cheap PQQ+15 drops of energin in the morning. Also wondering about its safety but it does so much good. I haven't read any negatives about it yet.

i use 20mg once a week, doctors best patented "biopqq"

what do you mean "10mg plain cheap pqq" which brand is it. i havent seen cheap ones.

what effects are you getting? i dont notice anything

 

[Makrosky]

i use 20mg once a week, doctors best patented "biopqq"

what do you mean "10mg plain cheap pqq" which brand is it. i havent seen cheap ones.

what effects are you getting? i dont notice anything

The cheapest one I could find in iherb.com without nasty additives. No BioPQQ fancy one (might be better but I haven't tried it).

Clean, calmed sustained energy through the day. More clear headed. Less anxiety. Less disturbances by toxic ppl environment/EMF. Seems too good to be true. I'll see how it goes.

 

[TobyBjorn]

Apparently the better benefits come for prolonged use, since it regenerates mitochondria. With sporadic use you might be getting just half the benefits?

Could be. I’m on a good couple months span now, after seeing nothing but positives.

 

[Makrosky]

Could be. I’m on a good couple months span now, after seeing nothing but positives.

Glad to hear that! How much do you take x day?

 

[TobyBjorn]

Glad to hear that! How much do you take x day?

2-4mg before bed. It makes me dopey sleepy if I take it during the day.
Tangential detail:
I take a wackload of stuff, and I frequently have experienced inverted reactions to drugs, particularly chiral isomers. I haven’t encountered anyone else who says PQQ makes them sleepy, but that doesn’t surprize me.
30mg pseudoephedrine will keep be buzzed for six hours, while 20mg ephedrine will put me to sleep. R-modafinil has no perceptible effect on me, while S-modafinil is powerful and long lasting.
Caffiene isn’t chiral, as a planar heterocyclic aromatic molecule, but nevertheless it gives me pronounced euphoria while theanine gives me dysphoria. I think those reactions aren’t too uncommon, and I don’t want to overstate the relevance of chirality.
When this chiral drug effect has been studied it seems to generally fall between 80/20 and 60/40 in the drug effects on the study population. What I’m experiencing isn’t that unique. Anyway, pqq plays a chemical role that could ilicit different reactions in the same person under different circumstances.

English isn’t my first language. I frequently make spelling errors.

 

[RealNeat]

Found this thread after seeing this product release CoQ10 & BioPQQ® with Shilajit which seems like a good combo. I was first exposed to pqq through Dave Asprey then decided to try it after the book Head Strong made a case for it.

Don't remember how it went as I worked at a supplement store and tried many things over the years. Will report on this supp when attained.

 

[Kray]

I asked ray peat what he thought of PQQ he replied no interest
he liked vitamin k-2
he wrote about coenzyme q10 in 1976 newsletter believe or not
I am using idebenone (150 mgs per day)
loved it very much I think it is better than PQQ and other forms of q10
paul

Hi @astral

Can you update on your idebenone experience? Are you still taking, what brand, how much, and what are your findings?

Thank you!

 

[Dr. B]

Found this thread after seeing this product release CoQ10 & BioPQQ® with Shilajit which seems like a good combo. I was first exposed to pqq through Dave Asprey then decided to try it after the book Head Strong made a case for it.

Don't remember how it went as I worked at a supplement store and tried many things over the years. Will report on this supp when attained.

What does pqq do exactly, benefis and side effects? Doctors best sells a 20mg biopqq

Ray doesnt like shilajit, thinks its too risky for heavy metals. But hes said pqq is likely safe but more research is needed

 

[RealNeat]

What does pqq do exactly, benefis and side effects? Doctors best sells a 20mg biopqq

Ray doesnt like shilajit, thinks its too risky for heavy metals. But hes said pqq is likely safe but more research is needed

I know, but there are purer versions of shilajit where the humic and fulvic acids greatly benefit many people, one such product is Primavie.