Post-SSRI-Symptoms

Athletic

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Apr 3, 2017
Messages
10
Hi ladies and gents,

i'm a 25 year old guy who suffered from social anxiety, mild depression for many years.

Last year in February decided to take Citalopram.
After only a few single doses à 5 mg had an adverse reaction.

Suddenly everything in the world looked cold and lifeless...Everthing that made my heart pound before now turned to a nice to do (music, sexuality, sports,...).

Even my educational and professional goals as a student seem to be senseless....Before the ssri I always was highly motivated.

What I've already tried:

zink, magnesium, ginko biloba, vitamin c and b-complex, mianserin, cannabis,....

It was in the beginning of this year when things started to feel alive again. This came along with enourmes strength in weight-training. However as I saw a psychiatrist again he mentioned that Mirtazapine would be safer blood-wise than Mianserin...After just 7,5 mg all positive changes disappeared again....

Seems like there are lot of similarities to pfs-sufferers, although i'm not sure if it could pharmacological the same...

Just wanted to ask if anyone has some advice to this. Excuse me for my bad english-skills!
 

allblues

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Joined
Oct 30, 2015
Messages
225
Welcome to the forum!

Sorry to hear about your problems. I've had a similar experience with sertraline (Zoloft). How long were you on the citalopram?
If you were just on it a short while, and even up to a year or so, most likely things will return to normal with time.

Figuring out what to do specifically is difficult, theories abound regarding what causes these problems.
It seems most people will improve gradually, rarely have I seen people pointing to particular things that changed them acutely.

It's difficult to tell why you'd feel worse after mirtazapine. It's possible that SSRIs damage/reduce input to serotonergic neuronal systems in the brain, and that using a serotonin antagonist like mirtazapine will not be helpful in that case, since low activity of serotonergic neuronal systems is the reason why things feel lifeless and bleak.

This seems to be the case with MDMA for instance, which is toxic to serotonergic neurons. The overlap with PSSD and the like is interesting; Recreational Ecstasy/MDMA, the serotonin syndrome, and serotonergic neurotoxicity. - PubMed - NCBI
Abstinent regular Ecstasy users often show: reduced cerebrospinal 5-HIAA, reduced density of 5-HT transporters, blunted response to a fenfluramine challenge, memory problems, higher cognitive deficits, various psychiatric disorders, altered appetite, and loss of sexual interest. Functional deficits may remain long after drug use has ceased and are consistent with serotonergic axonal loss in higher brain regions.

I think just keeping a reasonably good diet, and maybe something like pregnenolone could go a long way.
Vitamin E is also interesting if you're having any sexual dysfunction, estrogen problems, or such.

Interestingly, vitamin E inhibits protein kinase C, one of the kinase pathways which downregulates the serotonin transporter;
Evidence for biphasic effects of protein kinase C on serotonin transporter function, endocytosis, and phosphorylation. - PubMed - NCBI
Vitamin E inhibits protein kinase C activity. - PubMed - NCBI
 
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Athletic

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Apr 3, 2017
Messages
10
Hello allblues,

first of all many thanks for your answer!

I was seven days on citalopram in November 15'. All sides disappeared after the same amount of time.

Took it a second time in February 16' for also only a few days (5mg), when things suddenly felt cold and emotionless.

Also my whole body seems to be less sensitive (including genitals) than pre-SSRI, muscles are not that thight and full anymore. Aggression decreased. Whereas resistance-training had an refreshing effect, now i am even more exhausted after it.

But I agree with you that there seems to be many similarities to mdma-neurotoxicity. A PET scan for imaging SERT-density would be helpful to show eventual abnormalities, however this seems to be difficult to get done...
 

Cymatic

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Messages
46
Hi Athletic-

This sounds like you might have a mild case of PSSD (post-ssri sexual dysfuntion). I'm in the same boat with you. I totally agree with Allblues in that sticking to a good diet can only help you. Make sure to do the other obvious things like plenty of rest.

Have you had any hormone tests done such as testosterone, progesterone, androstenedione, TSH, prolactin? If not, these might be a good thing to get done to rule out the obvious. There have been anecdotal reports of elevated progesterone and androstanediol on the PSSD forum. I think that neurosteroids are implicated or playing a huge factor in this condition. What is interesting is that we share very similar symptoms to Post Finasteride Syndrome sufferers. Please check out the links below and let me know if you have any questions I might be able to answer. Hoping you feel better.

What is PSSD?
Why PSSD exists
Successful Treatments
PSSD Collaborative Research • View forum - PSSD related research

You should fill out the following report:
https://rxisk.org/report-a-drug-side-effect-2/
 

Constatine

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Joined
Sep 28, 2016
Messages
1,781
Try taking aspirin, caffeine, and niacinamide. Very effective combo for lowering serotonin.
 
OP
A

Athletic

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Apr 3, 2017
Messages
10
Hi Athletic-


Have you had any hormone tests done such as testosterone, progesterone, androstenedione, TSH, prolactin?

Yes, I already tested most hormones. All were in the normal range. Although progesterone was also within the normal range, it was at the high end.

It seems to be a very complex issue where lots of factors are involved such as neurotransmitters, hormones, transporter-proteins, neurosteroids,...
From what i read epigenetic changes could also play a role.

Hope that this issue will soon get more attention of researchers to find the cause and the cure as soon as possible...
 

Cymatic

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Messages
46
Yes, I already tested most hormones. All were in the normal range. Although progesterone was also within the normal range, it was at the high end.

It seems to be a very complex issue where lots of factors are involved such as neurotransmitters, hormones, transporter-proteins, neurosteroids,...
From what i read epigenetic changes could also play a role.

Hope that this issue will soon get more attention of researchers to find the cause and the cure as soon as possible...

We don't necessarily know what the culprit is. Just because numerous theories can be plausible doesn't mean they are all culprits. Everything is interlinked; steroids modulate transporters modulate transmitters..etc. We just don't know, and yes hopefully researchers become interested.
 
OP
A

Athletic

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Apr 3, 2017
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10
Hi ladies and gents,

just read on the ''pssdforum'' that someone tried 17β-estradiol replacement which resulted in great benefits in all areas of sexuality.

It is based on the following study, in which rats neonatally treated with Clomipramine (which has ssri similiar mechanism of action) restored 100% of their mating behaviour and motivation with 17β-estradiol +dht.

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._in_rats_treated_neonatally_with_clomipramine

It is hypothesized that 17β-estradiol does something very opposite as an SSRI, as it upregulates the SERT (5-HTT) in all areas of the brain, allowing a 'better' reuptake of the extracellular serotonine and finally resensitize all 5-HT receptors.


Just wanted to ask if any of you have an opinion to this...
 

Bassist

Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2017
Messages
8
Anyone tried moclobemide after ssri/snri's?
I couldnt climax after using cymbalta for 10months a few years back until i tried moclobemide which seemed to reverse a few sexual sides.
 
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