Possible To Achieve Drunkeness State Without Alcohol?

[haidut]

In the 1970s a one of the Big Pharma 5 invented a chemical that (in animal studies of rodents and monkeys) fully replicated alcohol's effects. A few of the researchers tried it on themselves and said it works the same. The chemical goes by the plain name of DS1, but keep in mind that it has very limited safety data on humans.
DS1 D0446

Short of getting yourself some DS1 and freaking out your friends in the bar by dropping it in your water and starting to act all drunk, I think regular alcohol can be pretty benign if combined with a decent dose anti-serotonin, which negates most of the harmful effects. Without endotoxin (and iron) and in doses that do no lead to acetaldehyde buildup, alcohol seems relatively benign (for the liver) and gets metabolized similar to sugar.
Alcohol Mostly Benign For The Liver, Causing Injury Requires Endotoxin (LPS)

 

[Vinero]

In the 1970s a one of the Big Pharma 5 invented a chemical that (in animal studies of rodents and monkeys) fully replicated alcohol's effects. A few of the researchers tried it on themselves and said it works the same. The chemical goes by the plain name of DS1, but keep in mind that it has very limited safety data on humans.
DS1 D0446

Short of getting yourself some DS1 and freaking out your friends in the bar by dropping it in your water and starting to act all drunk, I think regular alcohol can be pretty benign if combined with a decent dose anti-serotonin, which negates most of the harmful effects. Without endotoxin (and iron) and in doses that do no lead to acetaldehyde buildup, alcohol seems relatively benign (for the liver) and gets metabolized similar to sugar.
Alcohol Mostly Benign For The Liver, Causing Injury Requires Endotoxin (LPS)

New Idealabs product?
If that chemical doesn't cause a hangover like alcohol does, this can be huge..

 

[haidut]

New Idealabs product?
If that chemical doesn't cause a hangover like alcohol does, this can be huge..

Unfortunately, it is too dangerous legally. That is why it was no marketed back in the 1970s as there was immediate backlash over possible "moral hazard" that would make people OD on this like crazy. But I am about to release a product that helps detox alcohol and its associated liver effects.

 

[Arnold Grape]

New Idealabs product?
If that chemical doesn't cause a hangover like alcohol does, this can be huge..

I have noted this here before, and I do not take it regularly, but Theanine for me worked wonders for hangover. Even when it was particularly bad, this seemed to neutralize ill effects.

 

[ddjd]

I have noted this here before, and I do not take it regularly, but Theanine for me worked wonders for hangover. Even when it was particularly bad, this seemed to neutralize ill effects.

Possibly thanks to its cortisol lowering effects?

 

[ddjd]

@Soybean @cyclops
It's been a while since I started this thread but I've experimented with phenibut a little and very very positive effects. It's made me realize that all the amazing social benefits of alcohol come from its pro GABA effects.

The only issue is that after the first 4-5 times I took it (which were amazing!!) It's just stopped having any effect. I waited 2-3 weeks and it still didn't have any effect. I'm gutted.

 

[cyclops]

The only issue is that after the first 4-5 times I took it (which were amazing!!) It's just stopped having any effect

Sucks to be you bro! lol, phen is the best!

 

[tankasnowgod]

For people that feel that much better on alcohol than sober, I would check out the gut. Since many people are medicating various overgrowths using alcohol.

Flowers of Sulfur maybe?

I'm giving this a try soon.....

 

[Julles]

"Everything that one can experience on a drug is, at some level, an expression of the brain’s potential." - Sam Harris

A++++++

 

[Runenight201]

A++++++

Every time I catch myself thinking about bio hacking or doing some other substance to maximize my potential, I think to the great thinkers of antiquity. What was the neurochemical composition of Michael Angelo’s brain, and why is it that he was so stimulated consistently and I’m not? Are some people just born chronic high dopamine, low serotonin, low prolactin, etc... so that they are consistently able to engage at every waking moment and thus never cease developing and exploring?

Were their gut microbiome so robust that it never once was disrupted through improper food consumption, or did they have a very specific diet which perfectly supported their endeavors?

I have noticed that my tastebuds have become more specific over this entire venture, with them specifically going after foods that alter my brain chemistry for the better, higher, more positive states. I remember I use to drink matcha tea all the time in college, where as I had a sip today and it was absolutely revolting!

Perhaps when all has been exhausted through dietary manipulations, the only option is to resort to drug interventions, but I do admit that it feels like a failure. Michael Angelo surely didn’t need to supplement taurine on top of caffeine, b-vitamins, and then microdose LSD to become so great!

 

[Hugh Johnson]

I'm guessing the issue for OP is acetylcholine. Too much of it is a problem, it's feels like a brake on the mind. I'd look into substances that can reduce it and test not eating potatoes. Some substances can also increase cholinestrase, and that could also work.

Huge amounts of progest-e do get me a nice drunken euphoric high too.

 

[Julles]

...What was the neurochemical composition of Michael Angelo’s brain, and why is it that he was so stimulated consistently and I’m not? Are some people just born chronic high dopamine, low serotonin, low prolactin, etc... so that they are consistently able to engage at every waking moment and thus never cease developing and exploring?
[...]
I have noticed that my tastebuds have become more specific over this entire venture, with them specifically going after foods that alter my brain chemistry for the better, higher, more positive states. I remember I use to drink matcha tea all the time in college, where as I had a sip today and it was absolutely revolting!
[...]
Perhaps when all has been exhausted through dietary manipulations, the only option is to resort to drug interventions, but I do admit that it feels like a failure. Michael Angelo surely didn’t need to supplement taurine on top of caffeine, b-vitamins, and then microdose LSD to become so great!

Its wonderful that we came to this point of thinking. I am pretty sure that if we combined all the knowledge from all the diet and nutrition gurus (whatever alignment: veg., carnivor, high carb, keto, paleo) alive today (and Peat included) we would still have only a tiny fraction of knowledge about what it is that we are looking for!

For now I am very aligned with Ray Peat, and it is working perfectly for me! What I want to share is that probably there are more invisible and unmeasurable variables that affect the health of a conscious being than we (as mankind) are presently aware of.

My main questions are Does conscienceness affects the food we ingest? and if so How does conscienceness affect the processing of food by the body?

If there should be a fraction of truth in a positive answer to these questions its easy to see how great minds could keep being optimally fed.

Just to add: Some studies have been done about the way conscience affects water molecules. Studies about the placebo effect are very known and placebo effect seems real. So the mind affects something real in the body.

If an animal consumes food it will affect him in a natural way. But if he could form a belief about that particular food, could it affect him in a different way? like we humans have so many beliefs (true or not doesnt matter) about food, how that translates into the way we digest that food?

Is this idea a pandora box? I hope so!

 

[Runenight201]

Its wonderful that we came to this point of thinking. I am pretty sure that if we combined all the knowledge from all the diet and nutrition gurus (whatever alignment: veg., carnivor, high carb, keto, paleo) alive today (and Peat included) we would still have only a tiny fraction of knowledge about what it is that we are looking for!

For now I am very aligned with Ray Peat, and it is working perfectly for me! What I want to share is that probably there are more invisible and unmeasurable variables that affect the health of a conscious being than we (as mankind) are presently aware of.

My main questions are Does conscienceness affects the food we ingest? and if so How does conscienceness affect the processing of food by the body?

If there should be a fraction of truth in a positive answer to these questions its easy to see how great minds could keep being optimally fed.

Just to add: Some studies have been done about the way conscience affects water molecules. Studies about the placebo effect are very known and placebo effect seems real. So the mind affects something real in the body.

If an animal consumes food it will affect him in a natural way. But if he could form a belief about that particular food, could it affect him in a different way? like we humans have so many beliefs (true or not doesnt matter) about food, how that translates into the way we digest that food?

Is this idea a pandora box? I hope so!

That's certainly an interesting train of thought. The skeptic in me believes that what we believe a food may or may not do doesn't ultimately effect what the actual physiological outcome is in the body, for the average individual. Now, the placebo effect is a well-documented phenomena, and so perhaps if one does believe in a food hard enough than perhaps it could very well have positive effects on the body.

What I have noted, and which I've already alluded to in my previous post with taste buds, but which I'd like to expand on more, is that it's not just my taste buds that are being altered and refined, but it's my sense of what's actually good for me. I have a shaky memory but if I were to estimate, I'd say I seriously began paying attention to food and my conscious states about a year ago, but I would say that I didn't have a full, confident grasp on how to properly eat for optimal health until as late as even a couple days ago. There are so many variables to take into account, such as what foods to consume when, how dehydration affects things, how different foods affect the digestion, and how certain foods "prepare" the way for other foods. In my most unsure times, I'd lie awake hungry, utterly unsure of what to eat because it seemed like nothing made me feel good, to where I stand now, with a firm grasp on what my body needs when. What's even better, is I can tell almost right away when something is bad or is going to have negative effects. Take today for instance, there was a work meeting that I had to attend and that I had to consume food at. It was Chinese, and so I helped myself to some noodles with veggies. While eating the noodles, I literally felt the anxiety start to accumulate in response to the noodles being consumed, and I stopped consuming them and switched to just pure veggies instead. The anxiety alleviated itself, and following a large helping of soda, I felt energized and focused for the meeting. Had this been me a couple years ago, I would have consumed far too many noodles, been left an anxious wreck, and then been completely incapable of being present at the meeting.

So there certainly is something to having a firm grasp on one's own conscious states and how foods can affect them. Certainly, the wise one would consistently consume the foods that provide the most optimal states that are conducive towards good health.

 

[SonOfEurope]

As Frankdee20 said alcohol is unique.

I discovered not incidentally but with more than two years of use that progesterone (progest E or Haidut's products in gums) gives me the same verbal dexterity and freedom.

Makes me think p4 is the reason for women's higher verbal intelligence (and of course children's great mental plasticity) and combined with some oral androsterone it's quite close, but not as strong, as alcohol, it's macho bliss has almost no equal.

I wonder how massively high T (without much aromatization) would make one feel.... Quite strangely I've experienced the same verbal dexterity and alpha confidence right after sprints or max deadlift.

My 2 cents to an old thread.

 

[SonOfEurope]

Every time I catch myself thinking about bio hacking or doing some other substance to maximize my potential, I think to the great thinkers of antiquity. What was the neurochemical composition of Michael Angelo’s brain, and why is it that he was so stimulated consistently and I’m not? Are some people just born chronic high dopamine, low serotonin, low prolactin, etc... so that they are consistently able to engage at every waking moment and thus never cease developing and exploring?

Were their gut microbiome so robust that it never once was disrupted through improper food consumption, or did they have a very specific diet which perfectly supported their endeavors?

I have noticed that my tastebuds have become more specific over this entire venture, with them specifically going after foods that alter my brain chemistry for the better, higher, more positive states. I remember I use to drink matcha tea all the time in college, where as I had a sip today and it was absolutely revolting!

Perhaps when all has been exhausted through dietary manipulations, the only option is to resort to drug interventions, but I do admit that it feels like a failure. Michael Angelo surely didn’t need to supplement taurine on top of caffeine, b-vitamins, and then microdose LSD to become so great!

I think perhaps letting go of yourself (your ego) absolutely and engaging the world/universe that surrounds you might have something to do with that... Other than some epigenetic gifts of course....

It's very difficult for 99% of man... But as Peat says the purpose of life is to experience itself and grow... Wether left or right.... I think geniuses of Michael Angelo's class were by nature fully released from ego - and engaged the surrounding senses with great genius therefore building a path of dopaminergic, gaba-ergic, progesterone and androgenic unchained creativity.

It would be amazing to know about the diet and life of Ángelo's fathers and grandfathers, as well as those of other great geniuses (even more mechanically centered ones like Sir Isaac Newton)

 

[OccamzRazer]

"And do not be drunk with wine, in which is dissipation; but be filled with the Spirit..."

It seems there are both good and bad types of dis-inhibition.

Spiritual bliss > drunkeness

That being said, what's wrong with a little bit of organic natural wine?

 

[BestSinceDAYONE]

I am sick and tired of being sick and tired. I hate my drinking, I hate my habits, I hate my obsessions, I hate myself

?