Plant Based Diet Was Best For Me. Is Ray Peat A Bunch Of Bs?

[Kartoffel]

I do wish that Peaterians would go on YouTube like athletic and body building vegans and plant based do. Anyone have any clips? And yes I do know that it is difficult to judge entirely by how someone looks because of the stage of illness they were in and how old before quitting SAD.

I also want to add that it is the no sugar salt or oil plant based that has the best results. There are many versions of plant based.

I actually don't want to get into this silly comparison of physical appearances, but let's just say that I would seriously disagree, if someone told me that Dr Colins or John Mcdougal look particularly healthy. JohnMcdougal is 71 according to wikipedia, and in recent videos (2018) he looks very sick/frail and old despite the fact that he is more than ten years younger than Ray (who looks and sounds very healthy and sharp to me).

Were is the evidence that no sugar/salt/oil diets provide the best results?

 

[tankasnowgod]

I was on a plant based diet in 2017 for about 8 months. I never had dhiarrea and my poops were the best.


Ever since I switched back to eating meat I would have dhiarrea once in a while.

Ever since I found out about Ray peat diet I have dhiarrea every week.

I came on here to learn. The only thing I've learned is a lot of the advice given on here is b.s. People say stuff without empirical evidence all the time.

Not too long ago I posted about me being diagnosed with arterial thoracic outlet syndrome, back pain, and eczyma. A majority of responses had to do with me possibly having a low thyroid. How the hell does having a low thyroid have anything to do with said symptoms? I even had tests done checking my t3 and 4 levels which were all fine and people still said I could have a low thyroid. Makes no sense.

If anything at least let this be a reminder to trust no one. Maybe it's just me but the whole Ray peat stuff just ain't working. I showed much more energy and pooped much better while on plant based diet.

Well, which is it? Are you listening to Ray Peat? Or, are you listening to individuals posting on the Ray Peat Forum? Sounds like the later.

 

[Mary Lyn]

I actually don't want to get into this silly comparison of physical appearances, but let's just say that I would seriously disagree, if someone told me that Dr Colins or John Mcdougal look particularly healthy. JohnMcdougal is 71 according to wikipedia, and in recent videos (2018) he looks very sick/frail and old despite the fact that he is more than ten years younger than Ray (who looks and sounds very healthy and sharp to me).

Were is the evidence that no sugar/salt/oil diets provide the best results?

Well, we have to take into account that people may be sick when they appear on videos, but agreed I don't want to get into an argument about it, though you cannot argue with the condition of Seventh Day Adventists but I had no videos of them..

I am afraid there are no clinical trials to show that no SOS is better and have only my anecdotes about the various plant based groups and the astounding recoveries from obesity and diabetes. Go on iThrive to find out.

 

[Dobbler]

This is Ray Peat forum, not a vegan forum. If RPs philosophies dont work on you then there is other forums you can go rant. It is unnecessary to call it "bs". There are literally people who have gone from verge of suicide to functional happy human beings following teachings of RP, Haidut etc.
That being said, i dont see any reason why a primal human being would have gone vegan back in caveman times. When you have clean meat and seafood around you, why the **** would have they eaten only plants?

 

[Douglas Ek]

I actually don't want to get into this silly comparison of physical appearances, but let's just say that I would seriously disagree, if someone told me that Dr Colins or John Mcdougal look particularly healthy. JohnMcdougal is 71 according to wikipedia, and in recent videos (2018) he looks very sick/frail and old despite the fact that he is more than ten years younger than Ray (who looks and sounds very healthy and sharp to me).

Were is the evidence that no sugar/salt/oil diets provide the best results?

Besides a person that is 80+ like ray doesn't have that same metabolism as 20-40 years old. You can get away eating a lot less as 80 and probably eating mostly sugar sources, good protein etc and be in better shape than most 80+ year old who eats sandwiches and biscuits. There's some sort of bell curve to age how much you need to eat as young people usually need to eat a lot more to support their growth, hormones etc then closer to mid-life your metabolism slows down a bit and people tend to continue eating the same amount as previously they gain a bit of weight and a spare tire around their waste. Then at older age metabolism starts going down even further and old people end up not being hungry anymore so they tend to under eat. At that age, the body tends to need more nutrients again to be able to support their old age so both those factors can lead to a lot of old people losing a lot of weight and looking like skin and bone. This goes for everyone because everyone has different variables they need to account for. Age, gender, activity, metabolic rate, height and weight all play in on what you need to feel your optimal self. There is no diet fits all. And this is why some people don't feel good when they follow "hardcore ray peat". And Ray himself has never recommended anyone to do this either. Ray just suggests food that would be good to consume in your arsenal and foods to avoid. The other gap or void in your diet is for yourself to fill suggested on your disposition of these factors. Ray tends to give guidelines like avoid PUFA, eat nutrient dense food and supply the body with steady glucose for its metabolism. Which in my opinion is a pretty basic and scientific approach. Some people enjoy overanalyzing and going to the extreme. Let them do that if they want to. If you need to follow a perfect schematic of what you need to eat then you're better of following another diet/lifestyle than Peats but that will ultimately lead health consequences in my opinion.

 

[Mary Lyn]

I agree with you.

 

[Makrosky]

Don't feed the troll

 

[tankasnowgod]

Well, we have to take into account that people may be sick when they appear on videos, but agreed I don't want to get into an argument about it, though you cannot argue with the condition of Seventh Day Adventists but I had no videos of them.

Well then, you also can't argue with the condition of Mormons, who have similar practices to Seventh Day Adventists, like a tight community, no smoking or drinking and such, but who DO eat meat, unlike Seventh Day Adventists, and have an average lifespan a few months longer than Seventh Day Adventists.

Esseltyn does look and sound really good for 85, no doubt, but there are other plant based doctors who don't. Micheal Greger is starting to look really sickly and frail, and he's only in his mid 40s.

One of my favorite figures in health ever, Bernarr MacFadden, lived to be 87, with a great physique into his 70's. He recommended a largely vegetarian diet....... but, he didn't follow one himself (at least according to his biography). He was at least as big a fan of milk as Ray Peat is- The Milk Diet: Macfadden Book

Julia Child lived to be 93, and was actively working into her 70's. Linus Pauling, also 93, Abram Hoffer, 92.

As for Ray Peat, he still sounds incredibly sharp on every interview I hear with him.

 

[Mary Lyn]

There's another thing - you don't know whether people are practising what they preach. Whether they are breaking their eating plans at times. I'll have a read of that book thanks.

Yes I thought Peat sounded sharp but his voice sounds frail.

 

[Soundios]

Well then, you also can't argue with the condition of Mormons, who have similar practices to Seventh Day Adventists, like a tight community, no smoking or drinking and such, but who DO eat meat, unlike Seventh Day Adventists, and have an average lifespan a few months longer than Seventh Day Adventists.

Esseltyn does look and sound really good for 85, no doubt, but there are other plant based doctors who don't. Micheal Greger is starting to look really sickly and frail, and he's only in his mid 40s.

One of my favorite figures in health ever, Bernarr MacFadden, lived to be 87, with a great physique into his 70's. He recommended a largely vegetarian diet....... but, he didn't follow one himself (at least according to his biography). He was at least as big a fan of milk as Ray Peat is- The Milk Diet: Macfadden Book

Julia Child lived to be 93, and was actively working into her 70's. Linus Pauling, also 93, Abram Hoffer, 92.

As for Ray Peat, he still sounds incredibly sharp on every interview I hear with him.

Greger isn't criticised enough imho. He's published works like 'How not to die' and gives advice on how not to age, all the while looking frail and 20 years older than he is.

 

[Mary Lyn]

It is only recently that he is looking older. Maybe he has been doing a lot of travelling. I do agree though that the vegan men do not look as good as the women do. Maybe too much PUFA as they need to eat more.

 

[tankasnowgod]

It is only recently that he is looking older. Maybe he has been doing a lot of travelling. I do agree though that the vegan men do not look as good as the women do. Maybe too much PUFA as they need to eat more.

What kind of defense is this? As a general rule, people look older as they get older. Still, Greger is only 46, and looks worse even that the general population at the same age. Ray Peat in his 70's looked and sounded far, far better than Greger does now.

 

[Mary Lyn]

Well the diet did not work for me so maybe he is the same.

 

[Forsythia]

The fact that Peat himself lives mainly off milk and orange juice says a lot but yes I know that he does not say that his diet is for everyone.

Milk and orange juice are important parts of Peat's recommendations. But don't forget his other important recommendations: ruminant meat/liver, gelatin, broth, cheese, butter, ice cream, eggs, shellfish, fish (non-fatty), fruit (without seeds), vegetables (cooked potatoes, squashes, mushrooms, raw carrots)...and more.

On a per calorie basis, if Peat consumes 2 quarts of 1% milk and 1 quart of orange juice per day, these probably aren't more than 1/2 his calories in a day.

 

[Waremu]

I actually don't want to get into this silly comparison of physical appearances, but let's just say that I would seriously disagree, if someone told me that Dr Colins or John Mcdougal look particularly healthy. JohnMcdougal is 71 according to wikipedia, and in recent videos (2018) he looks very sick/frail and old despite the fact that he is more than ten years younger than Ray (who looks and sounds very healthy and sharp to me).

Were is the evidence that no sugar/salt/oil diets provide the best results?

Funny you pointed that out about Mcdougal. I thought the exact same thing. He decided to show a video or Mcdougal from years ago instead of his most recent one probably for that reason.

But I am convinced Mcdougal suffered at the very least a stroke of one kind or another. He looks very much like he had one to me, as someone who worked with people who had strokes as well as other issues in my past. It was very obvious to me. I could be wrong, but I don’t think I am.

I don’t at all think he looks as good as Ray does as well. I am amazed at how sharp Ray is at his age.

 

[Waremu]

Plant based vegan diets are very low or deficient in quality zinc. The body has high demands for zinc and most if not all vegan sources of zinc are poorly absorbed due to plant anti-nutrients.

I was vegan and vegetarian for years and it did well for me at first, but then I went down and I went down fast after the ‘glory phase.’ This is common for people who are vegan/vegetarian. I was in connection with a lot of them too and most of the ones I knew have aged much fast compared to me. I am glad I got out when I did. I had a severe zinc deficiency by the time I gave up on it.

 

[Waremu]

Milk and orange juice are important parts of Peat's recommendations. But don't forget his other important recommendations: ruminant meat/liver, gelatin, broth, cheese, butter, ice cream, eggs, shellfish, fish (non-fatty), fruit (without seeds), vegetables (cooked potatoes, squashes, mushrooms, raw carrots)...and more.

On a per calorie basis, if Peat consumes 2 quarts of 1% milk and 1 quart of orange juice per day, these probably aren't more than 1/2 his calories in a day.

Potatoes/starch is not part of his top recommendation. He says it’s an okay food, thinks fruit is better. Ideally, he thinks starch is second to fruit. So starch is a less safe alternative to fruit that he recommends for those who don’t want to just do fruit. But he himself doesn’t eat starch anymore, for the most part. He sees starch a spade more problematic than fruit. Everything else he does recommend as regularly staples.

I don’t think Peat consumes a quart of milk per day. I have heard him say many times that he has been consuming a gallon of milk per day for the the last 50 years. And at least a quart of orange juice. By that measure, yes, orange juice and milk probably make up a large part if not the majority of his calories. He only eats liver weekly and shellfish weekly. So the calorie diet from those foods olds wouldn’t be part of his daily calories. I personally eat oysters more than once per week remnants though. But in tiny amounts.

 

[Mary Lyn]

I suspect that I have as well though I got plenty when I was AIP paleo with a dozen oysters a week. Must buy some. Bit worried to face the fishmonger though as I told him I was now vegan lol

 

[Waremu]

What kind of defense is this? As a general rule, people look older as they get older. Still, Greger is only 46, and looks worse even that the general population at the same age. Ray Peat in his 70's looked and sounded far, far better than Greger does now.

I agreee. McGregor is supposed to be a top example of health that vegans have and the guy looks like walking death. He has deep discoloration under his eyes and a gaunt and frail look. I am willing to bet that he is zinc deficient. I think Ray is now in his 80’s. Wasn’t he in his late 70’s when the ‘on the back of a tiger’ documentary was filmed years ago? If I recall, he was. Could be wrong on that though. But he does look great for his age either way, for sure.

 

[tankasnowgod]

I agreee. McGregor is supposed to be a top example of health that vegans have and the guy looks like walking death. He has deep discoloration under his eyes and a gaunt and frail look. I am willing to bet that he is zinc deficient. I think Ray is now in his 80’s. Wasn’t he in his late 70’s when the ‘on the back of a tiger’ documentary was filmed years ago? If I recall, he was. Could be wrong on that though. But he does look great for his age either way, for sure.

Yeah, I think he's 82 now, so it would be late 70's when they filmed "On The Back Of A Tiger." The only things that really make him look older in that video are his wild hair, and his teeth. The teeth issue stems from an experiment decades ago when he only ate Wheat Germ, I believe. And the hair, that just makes him have that sort of "Mad Scientist" look, similar to Doc Brown in Back to the Future. But really, he looks and sounds great for a man in 80s, regardless.