People With The Lowest Overall Mortality Are Overweight

[Nighteyes]

All we can hope to do with supplements like Niacinamide is to bias these cycles just in time, in just the right amount, to support the required energetic demands placed on the body.

Thanks for ranting - good fun to read. I have also found this to be true; balance is key. Sometimes I just know I did something perfect and feel great, but replicating the scenario is damn difficult due to change in circumstances.

Btw you have an awesome way of writing, kind of like pboy and yet not at all... hmm.. anywho keep it up! More smilies please

 

[Such_Saturation]

Nature is horrible architect ....

The cell is exactly akin to the bloated mess of software you get when some centrally-controlled Government

He's coming out of retirement

 

[Makrosky]

This M.D. from the comment section of your 2nd link has a good response:

"Studies like this will get big press because it perpetuates the myth that thinness is unhealthy and that it's beneficial to be overweight.

It is true that we have better treatment for obesity-related illness, such as hypertension, dyslipidemia, and diabetes, so it's probably not as deadly to be overweight or obese now as it used to be. However, in addition to this, confounding variables may be at work here as well.

There are a number of compounding variables that may give the appearance of increased mortality at lower BMIs in studies of this nature. Among these are smoking, which may result in pulmonary cachexia or an increased risk of cancer, occult malignancies, and other chronic, non-obesity-related illness. All of these conditions result simultaneously in an increased prevalence of lower BMI and increased risk of mortality.

Recently, Aune, Sen, and colleagues conducted a meta-analysis of previous large cohort studies and specifically addressed the issue of these confounding variables. Overall, they examined the data from more than 30 million people!

When they left out smokers, the optimal BMI for never-smokers appeared to be 23-24. When they looked at healthy never-smokers (to remove confounding by illness), the optimal BMI appeared to be 22-23. Lastly, when they looked at healthy, never-smokers with long-term follow-up (to remove confounding by occult illness), the optimal BMI was lower still, at 20-22 [Aune, Sen, et al. BMI and all cause mortality: systematic review and non-linear dose-response meta-analysis of 230 cohort studies with 3.74 million deaths among 30.3 million participants. BMJ 2016;353:i2156. doi: http://dx.doi.org/10.1136/bmj.i2156 (Published 04 May 2016)].

This should be enough to dispell the myth that thinness is unhealthy and that a BMI of 27 should be some sort of goal.

Moreover, much of the so-called obesity paradox can be explained by an interesting study published in the August, 2014 issue of Mayo Clinic Proceedings. This demonstrated that it is MUSCLE MASS that correlates with the risk of mortality, not FAT MASS, and that the apparent increased risk of death in thin people is not from not having enough fat, but from not having muscle, and that the mortality benefit seen in overweight folks was not from their fat, but because they tended to have a normal amount of muscle. [De Schutter, Lavie CJ, et al. Body composition and mortality in a large cohort with preserved ejection fraction: untangling the obesity paradox. Mayo Clin Proc. 2014 Aug;89(8):1072-9. doi: 10.1016/j.mayocp.2014.04.025. Epub 2014 Jul 16].

There is no danger in being thin per-se. If you're thin because you have sarcopenia (not enough muscle), that's a problem. If you're thin because you have emphysema, cancer, poorly controlled type-1 diabetes, chronic kidney disease, and so on, that's a problem. The studies I've noted should be a reality check for those who have read "BMI 27: The New Normal?" and conclude (or believe) that thinness itself is unhealthy."

Thanks for the discussion.

This is the danger of picking up pubmed studies and using them as hard proof to reinforce an idea.

 

[Morning Star]

If anything, Protein + Carb is more ANABOLIK to ensure ur gains stayz loyal

To be saluted, on a daily.

 

[haidut]

TL;DR -- When daylight, METABOLISM TO THE MAX . When darkness, Go to sleep

I think this is pretty much what Peat said when somebody asked him about supplementing with melatonin. Aside from saying how dangerous exogenous melatonin is, Peat also said that if metabolism has been kept really high during the day then melatonin will naturally be high at night and allows to sort of close our eyes and open them them again at sunrise. Deep sleep without interruptions and need sot supplements.

 

[tyw]

Thanks for ranting - good fun to read. I have also found this to be true; balance is key. Sometimes I just know I did something perfect and feel great, but replicating the scenario is damn difficult due to change in circumstances.

Btw you have an awesome way of writing, kind of like pboy and yet not at all... hmm.. anywho keep it up! More smilies please

I just write whatever suits the present mood . It's going to be more common to find hard logic and reasoned speculation from me.

To be saluted, on a daily.

Propaahh!!!!!

I think this is pretty much what Peat said when somebody asked him about supplementing with melatonin. Aside from saying how dangerous exogenous melatonin is, Peat also said that if metabolism has been kept really high during the day then melatonin will naturally be high at night and allows to sort of close our eyes and open them them again at sunrise. Deep sleep without interruptions and need sot supplements.

Agree

We can even track specifics like Total Adenine Nucleotides, and show their accumulation through the day and relevant circadian signalling effects. (One example of generic nucleotide treatment, in rats, but the idea is the same -- http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2211124712000721)

But in any case, I think it's easy enough for anyone to understand that if you work (your metabolism) like a dog, you sleep like a log.

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[m_arch]

If anything, Protein + Carb is more ANABOLIK to ensure ur gains stayz loyal . (Just means that building and holding on to lean tissue is probably better with protein + carbs). I won't discuss mechanics here, search all the physique-obsessed sites for info.

----
TL;DR -- When daylight, METABOLISM TO THE MAX . When darkness, Go to sleep.


Regarding Aspirin, this is a bit of a wild card. It's mechanical effects are basically unknown -- you have Aspirin on cell membrane => some side effects happens (like metabolic uncoupling).

All we can do is observe those side effects and then test it on ourselves.

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I'm inspired to write up a 'gainz brah' bio-energetic plan.
Full natty juicing using; protein (gain n hold), cholesterol (steroid synthesis), vitamin A (steroid synthesis) and carbs (thyroid).
Maybe i'll try it and track my body weight vs fat % with a new diet plan high in carbs and protein while applying peat principles (like gelatin to balance aminos, calcium to balance phosphate etc) ... hmm

 

[Westside PUFAs]

Well, Walter Kempner (creator of the rice diet) said himself that his diet was "a monotonous and tasteless diet which would never become popular...."

But what it shows is that white rice, white sugar and fruit juice resulted in excess adipose tissue lost and reversal of insulin resistance in almost everyone in the study. You can then apply that in a similar way but with allowed no oil condiments, i.e. rice and salsa, one of my favorites.

 

[m_arch]

But what it shows is that white rice, white sugar and fruit juice resulted in excess adipose tissue lost and reversal of insulin resistance in almost everyone in the study. You can then apply that in a similar way but with allowed no oil condiments, i.e. rice and salsa, one of my favorites.

Cool idea. What other combos do you have?

 

[tyw]

I'm inspired to write up a 'gainz brah' bio-energetic plan.
Full natty juicing using; protein (gain n hold), cholesterol (steroid synthesis), vitamin A (steroid synthesis) and carbs (thyroid).
Maybe i'll try it and track my body weight vs fat % with a new diet plan high in carbs and protein while applying peat principles (like gelatin to balance aminos, calcium to balance phosphate etc) ... hmm

You better hurry up to market @haidut will get dere 1st with MTHLN BRU -- your daily dose of methylene blue, B-vitamins, proteenz, and miscellaneous MAGIC. Hand-crafted in a HARDCORE non-descript can for convenient consumption .

(this is obviously just for the Lulz)
....

 

[Westside PUFAs]

Cool idea. What other combos do you have?

The possibilities are endless. Small things change the flavor of something so easily, for example cumin. Green Mountain Gringo brand salsa uses cumin so it makes it different than one that doesn't. I don't like cilantro so I usually get the 365 brand no cilantro salsa. I've started eating more long grain germinated sprouted brown rice. It's not that different from white. Homemade, oil free condiments are the best. Usually a tomato base, tomato paste is good too. Maple syrup, mustard and ACV is a good baked potato wedge dip. This book has good condiment recipes, you just add the amount of salt thats right for you: Bravo!: Health Promoting Meals from the TrueNorth Health Kitchen: Ramses Bravo, Alan Goldhamer: 9781570672699: Amazon.com: Books

 

[Westside PUFAs]

Cool idea. What other combos do you have?

Sorry I just realized that you're an auzzie so you won't know the salsa brands I was saying. One of my favorite auzzie products are Corn Thins, the sesame ones, they have no oil and are like popcorn without the hard shells that get stuck in your gums. A great quick snack with either salsa when craving salt or fruit jam/jelly when craving sweet.

 

[milk_lover]

You better hurry up to market @haidut will get dere 1st with MTHLN BRU -- your daily dose of methylene blue, B-vitamins, proteenz, and miscellaneous MAGIC. Hand-crafted in a HARDCORE non-descript can for convenient consumption .

View attachment 2733

(this is obviously just for the Lulz)
....

If you sketch that, I have to say well done. Nice drawing :) tyw, you are a man of many talents, good for you.

 

[tyw]

If you sketch that, I have to say well done. Nice drawing :) tyw, you are a man of many talents, good for you.

Random 3 minute sketch I am to be taken as a conjuror of cheap tricks.

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[CoolTweetPete]

You better hurry up to market @haidut will get dere 1st with MTHLN BRU -- your daily dose of methylene blue, B-vitamins, proteenz, and miscellaneous MAGIC. Hand-crafted in a HARDCORE non-descript can for convenient consumption

(this is obviously just for the Lulz)
....

Wow.

 

[haidut]

You better hurry up to market @haidut will get dere 1st with MTHLN BRU -- your daily dose of methylene blue, B-vitamins, proteenz, and miscellaneous MAGIC. Hand-crafted in a HARDCORE non-descript can for convenient consumption .

View attachment 2733

(this is obviously just for the Lulz)
....

Lol, wow, this drawing is amazing! Now, I'll go get some proteenz and two orders of magic

 

[Jarman]

Again, everything works in cycles. Estrogen needs to be high at times for cell growth. Nitric Oxide needs to be high at times to deposit cholesterol and heal arteries. Mitochondria cycle between Complex 1 and Complex 2 activity all the time, etc ....

Since Peat always recommend to lower estrogen, can you please clarify why estrogen needs to be high at times for cell growth? And what is your view of Asians consuming lots of estrogenic food like soy sauce, Tamari sauce and tofu?

 

[tara]

Since Peat always recommend to lower estrogen, can you please clarify why estrogen needs to be high at times for cell growth?

I'm sure tyw can explain it in more detail than I can. But my take is that Peat has said that estrogen is needed in very short bursts, and should then be quickly countered by progesterone. I imagine he tends to focus on lowering estrogen because it is common for it to be chronically elevated, which is where the trouble commonly arises. AIUI, estrogen has a role in cell growth and in the female reproductive cycle allowing conception, and maybe other things.

 

[tyw]

Since Peat always recommend to lower estrogen, can you please clarify why estrogen needs to be high at times for cell growth? And what is your view of Asians consuming lots of estrogenic food like soy sauce, Tamari sauce and tofu?

Systemic estrogen should be low. Estrogen is a growth-inducing hormone. Biologic systems can be seen as "restraints placed on excess growth".

NOTE: to be more specific, activation of the "estrogen receptor", which can be done by many (many!) more compounds than estrogen, is what stimulates the cellular growth programs -- Cellular functions of plasma membrane estrogen receptors. - PubMed - NCBI
​

But what happens when you get a cut on your finger? What happens if the gut is transiently inflammed from a particular food toxin? You need growth and repair. You can say that there is a requirement for "elevated estrogenic activity". If the body can't do this, it can grow new cells, heal injured tissue, recycle cells, etc ....

This had better be transient -- disappearing once the inflammation has receded.

NOTE: of course, "chronic stress" => chronic inflammation => chronic growth and repair response (also described as "too much estrogenic activity").​

"Estrogen activity" should be seen as a generic switch, that tells a cell to grow. The coherent organism will then have all components communicating well between each other, so as to only allow for exactly the right amount of growth, and no more.

"Coherence" may sound like a fuzzy term, but again, Guenther Albretch-Buehller's work shows that the red light that is produced as a product of metabolism directly leads to Cell communication and "more Intelligent" decision-making -- http://www.basic.northwestern.edu/g-buehler/cellint0.htm . We can also scale this up to body-wide signalling via the collagen meridian system.

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Note: "Tamari" is basically soy sauce produced through a slightly different process. Soy sauce generally refers to fermented and brewed liquid, which has a couple of different methods of production. Whereas Tamari is the concentrated remnants of the Miso (fermented soybean paste) making process, which is then diluted into a sauce. Tamari is supposedly gluten free, and contains less soy solids.

Personally, I do not support Soy product consumption of any form. This part of the "Asian diet" (which really is limited to China, Japan, and Korea) I do not support.

Soy sauce and Tamari obviously contains much less soy solids, and is thus likely less problematic than products like Tofu. I'll use them in small amounts every now and then

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[Mjhl85]

So it feels like the swank elephant in the room hasn't been properly addressed.
I see a couple of answers here and there thru out the forum but nothing really substantial.
Why did swank's omega 6/pufa protocol help his patients?