Peat Very Wrong On Lactic Acid / Yogurt?

tankasnowgod

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Well there is a thing, cheese is a RP staple and traditionally made cheese is lactofermented too. Lactic acid content of fermented cheese is up to 2% lactic acid. It translates to 2 grams per 100 grams vs ±1 gram of lactic acid in yougurt per 100 grams.

Most cheese today (at least commercially) is made with rennet, not lactofermentation. This is one reason specifically that Peat has mentioned a preference for cheese.
 

Quelsatron

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The use of traditional foods and other evolutionary conditions have to be analysed in terms of their alternatives and their costs. In the end, even PUFA is better than starving, and having adapted to being injured doesn't mean that injury is good for you.
 
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The use of traditional foods and other evolutionary conditions have to be analysed in terms of their alternatives and their costs. In the end, even PUFA is better than starving, and having adapted to being injured doesn't mean that injury is good for you.

Good point! If some traditional food was beneficial 1000 years ago it doesn't mean it possess benefits in modern environment.

Fermented foods can negate lack of hygiene and food safety in early ages. Well-established bacteria/yeast cultures in fermented foods outcompete harmful bacteria from unhigiene conditions. Lesser evil. Does one really need these less harmful bacteria in the age of clean food, fridge and hands washed 20+ times a day?
 

Jam

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Good point! If some traditional food was beneficial 1000 years ago it doesn't mean it possess benefits in modern environment.

Fermented foods can negate lack of hygiene and food safety in early ages. Well-established bacteria/yeast cultures in fermented foods outcompete harmful bacteria from unhigiene conditions. Lesser evil. Does one really need these less harmful bacteria in the age of clean food, fridge and hands washed 20+ times a day?

Yes, even more so. Otherwise, as the boy living in a soap bubble discovered, you're toast on every encounter with harmful bacteria, which is bound to happen sooner or later.
 
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I used to be Mr. Pickler with kefirs, pickled veggies, etc. etc., and I found that I didn’t feel any better and there was no improvement in any area.

I now feel that fermented products are not healthy and I avoid them and suggests others avoid them. There are some products such as sourdough bread or soy sauce that I think are fine fermented. Sourdough bread has the bugs killed off, and soy sauce is used in minimal quantities anyway.

There is a study that shows cooking the yogurt and killing the bugs has benefit against inflammation, so they do not have to be alive. I’m not really interested in cooking yogurt, and the bad form of lactic acid discourages me.
 
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Gone Peating

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I started getting acne after eating however much Greek yogurt gets you 16 g protein a day for a week so I stopped eating it. Didn’t notice anything else really
 

Nemo

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Back in days before refrigeration almost all milk was consumed in soured state.

Even this point is likely untrue. A friend who raises goats has to milk them every day. Almost all the milk she and her family consume is fresh. Even milk left out isn't very sour by the end of the day.
 

Nemo

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Some of those cultures did in fact store milk in goat skin, to ferment, turn into yogurt or kefir, and was used on long journeys with their yaks, or in other areas with their camels. The process of taking milk on their journeys, and then subsequently turning into a fermented product was how they discovered they could preserve dairy for long journeys, etc. Not every culture ate it as soon as it was made.

Preserving it for a long journey is not the same as routinely fermenting the day's milk. They probably ate it fresh except for a certain amount needed for long journeys, when daily milking wasn't available.
 

Dave Clark

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Preserving it for a long journey is not the same as routinely fermenting the day's milk. They probably ate it fresh except for a certain amount needed for long journeys, when daily milking wasn't available.
That is how they discovered it, put milk in goat skin bags, and along the journey they saw that the milk changed, but in a good way that was a natural preserving fashion. This provided a way for them to preserve a milk product without refrigeration. They didn't intentionally, at least in the beginning, ferment it for long journeys, it just happened that way. Natural preserving methods using salt, air drying, fermenting, etc. were much needed in those days, it wasn't about what was scientifically the most healthy, it was born out of necessity.
 

Nemo

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That is how they discovered it, put milk in goat skin bags, and along the journey they saw that the milk changed, but in a good way that was a natural preserving fashion. This provided a way for them to preserve a milk product without refrigeration. They didn't intentionally, at least in the beginning, ferment it for long journeys, it just happened that way. Natural preserving methods using salt, air drying, fermenting, etc. were much needed in those days, it wasn't about what was scientifically the most healthy, it was born out of necessity.

Yes, I understand. But if you're actually milking animals, you'll have more fresh milk every day. And my point is you'll probably just continue drinking the fresh stuff the way my friend does, if for no other reason than that it's easier, unless you know you'll be facing a period where you can't milk your animals every day.

I've made clabbered milk and yogurt. Humans can get used to anything, but both basically suck compared to fresh milk.

People who glorify clabbered milk remind me of people who glorify grits. Grits are tasteless and disgusting but people develop a sentimental attachment.
 

Elize

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I make my own yoghurt and kefir. Hubby can have it but with me it triggers a histamine response. My eyes become puffy, red and itchy. Become bloated and constipated.
 

Dave Clark

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Yes, I understand. But if you're actually milking animals, you'll have more fresh milk every day. And my point is you'll probably just continue drinking the fresh stuff the way my friend does, if for no other reason than that it's easier, unless you know you'll be facing a period where you can't milk your animals every day.

I've made clabbered milk and yogurt. Humans can get used to anything, but both basically suck compared to fresh milk.

People who glorify clabbered milk remind me of people who glorify grits. Grits are tasteless and disgusting but people develop a sentimental attachment.
You make it sound like anything that is aged sucks. Aged beef, aged wine, aged cheeses, etc., etc. Fresh is good, so is aged stuff, taste wise anyway. There may be no argument that fermented foods could possibly 'not' be good for you, but there is a whole big eclectic world out there that says aged foods taste good.
 

Elize

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Many aged foods will impact on some of us who have issues with histamine and mast cell activation. It's good for many but bad for me and others
 

pauljacob

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I'm 75 and I'm a vegetarian. I've been eating Yogurt all my life, and whole-milk Kefir off and on for the past 10 years. I make both of them at home. I don't drink plain milk. I do use evaporated milk in my morning Coffee. My bowel movement have always been normal, but I do always have a bloated abdomen, especially on both sides of the belly which I suspect could well be a Wheat Belly. I never attributed this distention to Yogurt and Kefir. According to old medical wisdom Yogurt and Kefir maintain gut bacteria balance, and consume/kill harmful Bacteria. I always refrained from microwaving Yogurt because I didn't want to kill any good Bacteria, because to me Yogurt without Bacteria is just milk. I find it difficult to accept Dr. Peat's advise to heat the Yogurt and kill the Bacteria and being dead will do their job anyway.
 

Marcine

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Hey Ben, I see you are a new member. just keep reading Peat and listening to Lives with Giorgi and Danny Roddy. Matesz is just trying to cash in but he's another wannabe, like Matt Blackburn who sells supplements. Once you heal, be free of orthorexia and whatever doesn't hurt you in your particular environment.
 

Forsythia

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Peat says greek yogurt is fine as most of the lactic acid has been strained out. He says greek yogurt is almost the same as cottage cheese.
 

Forsythia

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Here is a quote from Peat. The "strained" type he says is safe is greek yogurt:

"A spoonful or two of acidic yogurt isn't harmful, but a cupful of the
acidic type can be enough to deplete the liver's energy stores,

because lactic acid is converted to glucose in the liver, requiring
energy. The "strained" type that isn't acidic is similar to cottage
cheese and is safe." – Ray Peat (Email advice)
 

JudiBlueHen

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Is it OK to substitute sour cream for yogurt in food prep? I'm talking about a few tablespoons per serving.
 

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