Peat + Old School Bodybuilding? An Experimental Quest

[OccamzRazer]

Are you taking your temperature and pulse? Which are?

I've been meaning to - thanks for the reminder! Need to get a new thermometer today.

I'm almost certain my temps are high. Since trying to eat 5000 cals/day, I've felt very warm. Like on the verge of overheating.

Pulse, however...not so sure that's as important. Years of endurance sports means my resting heart rate is low and my max heart rate is high.

 

[Sefton10]

Daily long, slow walks

I definitely think this is a key point. I always feel off if I don't get in two decent walks a day. I think it's to do with keeping the lymphatic system moving. Eating and sitting all day with just a workout as movement is not a good recipe!

Love this time of the year in the UK as the mornings are so light now to get out and about early with the dog.

 

[OccamzRazer]

This is a great idea from @OccamzRazer We could open our own logs and share a bunch of interesting things.

In fact I've been "Peatybuilding" - as I like to call it - for the past year+ and have been documenting the progress with video footage.

One thing I’ve noticed is to not train if I'm stressed, hungry or tired... Else it takes me days to recover properly.

Great idea! Let's do it. Hopefully the info exchange can benefit everyone.

'Peatybuilding' - haha nice. How's your progress been?

That's a good point. Training should not trigger or add to the stress response. Ultra-important to listen to your body!

 

[OccamzRazer]

Looking good, very lean bro. Are you able to stay in a relaxed androgenic state at this low body fat%?

Thanks so much brother! I've always been really thin, so the current physique is 'big' for me.

Androgenic...I think so. Especially since trying to eat more. My muscles feel 'pumped' much of the time. And the girls at the coffee shop look cuter than usual.

Assuming these are positive signs. ?

 

[Sefton10]

I've been meaning to - thanks for the reminder! Need to get a new thermometer today.

I'm almost certain my temps are high. Since trying to eat 5000 cals/day, I've felt very warm. Like on the verge of overheating.

Pulse, however...not so sure that's as important. Years of endurance sports means my resting heart rate is low and my max heart rate is high.

Have you thought about trying T3 and dropping calories a bit if you're having to force them in?

 

[OccamzRazer]

I definitely think this is a key point. I always feel off if I don't get in two decent walks a day. I think it's to do with keeping the lymphatic system moving. Eating and sitting all day with just a workout as movement is not a good recipe!

Love this time of the year in the UK as the mornings are so light now to get out and about early with the dog.

Yes...walking is sooo underrated. I feel downright gross if I don't walk at least a mile or two, it makes all the difference. Wish I had a dog to walk with tho!

You've probably heard that Asian saying, "if you take 100 steps after each meal, you’ll live to 99."

 

[OccamzRazer]

Have you thought about trying T3 and dropping calories a bit if you're having to force them in?

Hm, interesting idea. Isn't that what Dr. Peat did when he was young? Is the idea that thyroid supplementation would allow for better calorie utilization?

 

[Sefton10]

Hm, interesting idea. Isn't that what Dr. Peat did when he was young? Is the idea that thyroid supplementation would allow for better calorie utilization?

That's what made me think of it. I can't remember the number but he said he was eating something ridiculous in terms of calories but that came right down when he took thyroid. Just seems inherently wrong to me to be forcing yourself to go beyond appetite to hit a certain number of calories.

 

[OccamzRazer]

That's what made me think of it. I can't remember the number but he said he was eating something ridiculous in terms of calories but that came right down when he took thyroid. Just seems inherently wrong to me to be forcing yourself to go beyond appetite to hit a certain number of calories.

Yeah I think he said he was eating 8,000 before thyroid! Thanks, I will look into this. Eating above appetite for more than a meal or two is not very fun...probably not great for longevity either.

 

[Sefton10]

Yeah I think he said he was eating 8,000 before thyroid! Thanks, I will look into this. Eating above appetite for more than a meal or two is not very fun...probably not great for longevity either.

Yeah I think overeating can become a stressor in and of itself pretty quick once you're forcing food down. I haven't tried T3 but I'm thinking of getting some to try once winter comes back around and we're back to dark days.

 

[Jonnie]

Great idea! Let's do it. Hopefully the info exchange can benefit everyone.

'Peatybuilding' - haha nice. How's your progress been?

That's a good point. Training should not trigger or add to the stress response. Ultra-important to listen to your body!

Progress has been good. Trying to take it slow as I've f'd up a lot over the past decade with stupid diets untill I found Dr. Ray Peat and the likes (thank god).

Started at 77kg-ish beginning of 2020. Currently at 88kg at 5'11...
But I might be a bit on the fluffy side right now, my theory is that it serves as a "protective layer" from stress and it does feel like it's easier to put on muscle mass.

I'll try to cut down more towards your bodyfat level once I reach 90kg, see if I'll be able to do that without shooting into stressmode.

 

[Vins7]

Haha it's worth stating that I was eating 4-5000 calories/day up til those pics were taken, averaging probably ~4,400.

I've only been eating (trying to eat) 5,000 calories a day for a few days now.

Actually, bloating has been a problem in the past. Too many carbs - especially starches - tend to just make me skinnyfat. For me animal products seem most anabolic.

Here are some things that seem to help me avoid bloating:

Avoiding starches completely
Daily carrots/mushrooms
Daily long, slow walks
Raw milk
Coffee!!

It might also be 'genetic.' I'm Polish so my face gets bloated long before my abs do lol.

Well, I was meaning bloating not fat, I always had a flat belly but I have a bloated belly (not fat) since last four years.

Do you know how is your macronutrient ratio?

 

[Ben.]

Hey man, good luck with your endevours.

Since you are going for health/longevity in this, you probably know that slow healthy progress beats fast stressfull growth.
I am actually surprised how much they knew back then. Considering the insane misinformation with the early ages of the internet and early 2010ish (looking at the mike cheng and similar youtube channels), anabolic window etc. it is crazy that so much good information that is surfacing/becoming more mainstream right now, was something they did 50 years ago already. From avoiding endocrine disruptors to special excercises. What was i even doing when i started 10 years ago?

May i ask what you do for regeneration? Breathing excercises/meditation? Mobility/Stretch routines? Specific Supplements/Foods?
I guess nothing beats simple things like taking walks in nature.

Using heat (thinking of sauna or warm baths) on training days is helpful.

The only thing is, 5k+ calories sounds like way to much for longevity/health imo. Even if it is good/nutritious ... that sounds like alot of work the body has to do there to digest, absorb and expell.

Optimising digestion/assimilation, fascia/mobility and the social live is something thats so important in this equation too.

Maybe it comes from a sick persons perspective, but to me it looks like you do an insane amount of training within a week. Hope that doesn't backfire, but the body will tell you and it won't be unhealthy aslong as you listen to it when it starts to become to much.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I like the looks of the plan! I would take out the yogurt for lactic acid reasons. Maybe if he had weight to lose adding more fat could be problematic, but being it is all natural without added oils i am betting he should be fine. Why the spinach though when it is high in iron and not Peat recommended?

 

[OccamzRazer]

Well, I was meaning bloating not fat, I always had a flat belly but I have a bloated belly (not fat) since last four years.

Do you know how is your macronutrient ratio?

Ah I see. Have never had that problem, but it seems like carrot salad might help. Unless you've tried that already?

You could also look into colonic hydrotherapy. Very powerful stuff.

My macros are about 50/25/25 F/P/C on average. Attached is yesterday's cronometer (cals are conservative here).

 

[OccamzRazer]

I like the looks of the plan! I would take out the yogurt for lactic acid reasons. Maybe if he had weight to lose adding more fat could be problematic, but being it is all natural without added oils i am betting he should be fine. Why the spinach though when it is high in iron and not Peat recommended?

Thanks so much, Rinse & rePeat!

Good point about the yogurt. Sometimes I swap it out for ice cream, but the sugar in the ice cream makes my teeth feel bad. Tough to find an ultra-palatable, high-calorie, Peaty food with no downsides lol. Searching for authentic cheesecake now but haven't found it yet.

Spinach...it's an attempt to balance out pH a little. There are probably better choices. I cook the spinach well because I know Dr. Peat is okay with spinach water...but yeah, more fruit might just be better.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Thanks so much, Rinse & rePeat!

Good point about the yogurt. Sometimes I swap it out for ice cream, but the sugar in the ice cream makes my teeth feel bad. Tough to find an ultra-palatable, high-calorie, Peaty food with no downsides lol. Searching for authentic cheesecake now but haven't found it yet.

Spinach...it's an attempt to balance out pH a little. There are probably better choices. I cook the spinach well because I know Dr. Peat is okay with spinach water...but yeah, more fruit might just be better.

I hear you about the sensitive teeth thing, honey sends mine to the moon! What about using a really ripe fruit for smoothies using your milk? I blend milk, fruit and a sweetener (usually sweetened condensed milk) add in a pinch of salt and some vanilla flavoring and throw it in my ice cream maker, a couple times a week! You could even take your milk, add in instant coffee grounds and throw your dried fruit in there for a blended coffee shake. There is a lot to be said about food being a mental thing too, so don't torture yourself

 

[OccamzRazer]

Hey man, good luck with your endevours.

Since you are going for health/longevity in this, you probably know that slow healthy progress beats fast stressfull growth.
I am actually surprised how much they knew back then. Considering the insane misinformation with the early ages of the internet and early 2010ish (looking at the mike cheng and similar youtube channels), anabolic window etc. it is crazy that so much good information that is surfacing/becoming more mainstream right now, was something they did 50 years ago already. From avoiding endocrine disruptors to special excercises. What was i even doing when i started 10 years ago?

May i ask what you do for regeneration? Breathing excercises/meditation? Mobility/Stretch routines? Specific Supplements/Foods?
I guess nothing beats simple things like taking walks in nature.

Using heat (thinking of sauna or warm baths) on training days is helpful.

The only thing is, 5k+ calories sounds like way to much for longevity/health imo. Even if it is good/nutritious ... that sounds like alot of work the body has to do there to digest, absorb and expell.

Optimising digestion/assimilation, fascia/mobility and the social live is something thats so important in this equation too.

Maybe it comes from a sick persons perspective, but to me it looks like you do an insane amount of training within a week. Hope that doesn't backfire, but the body will tell you and it won't be unhealthy aslong as you listen to it when it starts to become to much.

Hey thanks so much Ben!

Yes it's amazing how much the old school guys did right. When I realized how strong they were
...how healthy they looked...how they did it all without drugs...I figured I'd just do my best to emulate!

For regeneration, I:

Stretch a lot (just by feel)
Meditate (on Godly stuff)
Block as much blue light as possible (blu blockers and f.lux)
Use red light for at least a few minutes a day
Eat liver (might go to raw liver)
Walk a few miles a day
Get lots of sun
Wake up very slowly and intentionally

Also planning to begin using cordyceps again. And in several months I plan on adding in DHEA and progesterone.

You're right, it's a lot of calories and may not be ideal for longevity. My maintenance cals seem to have gone up from 4000 to 4400, tho, so in order to gain muscle I've just gotta eat more. (Or try T3 per Sefton's idea.)

Thanks to carrots, bone broth, and raw milk, my digestion is actually really good.

The training may not be as high volume as it seems. The AM workout takes 15 minutes max...the PM workout maybe 45 minutes. I rarely go to the point of total failure and rest between sets so that lactic acid buildup is minimized.

But you're right, I'll definitely back off if things start going sideways!

 

[OccamzRazer]

Progress has been good. Trying to take it slow as I've f'd up a lot over the past decade with stupid diets untill I found Dr. Ray Peat and the likes (thank god).

Started at 77kg-ish beginning of 2020. Currently at 88kg at 5'11...
But I might be a bit on the fluffy side right now, my theory is that it serves as a "protective layer" from stress and it does feel like it's easier to put on muscle mass.

I'll try to cut down more towards your bodyfat level once I reach 90kg, see if I'll be able to do that without shooting into stressmode.

Awesome! That's a pretty impressive weight gain.

Eh, a little fluffiness probably does make it easier to build muscle. Eric Bugenhagen has a good video on this. I plan on getting real fluffy next winter lol.

I do think different people have different set points for bodyweight/bodyfat. If you were really lean as a kid, for example, then it might require less dieting and less stress to get back to that point.

 

[OccamzRazer]

Using heat (thinking of sauna or warm baths) on training days is helpful.

Good stuff, you'd use the sauna after training right?