Peat + Old School Bodybuilding? An Experimental Quest

AndrogenicJB

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Return of eating like a little piggy


View attachment 30218

Also eating liver, oysters, clams, and salmon roe occasionally.

Was feeling a little doubtful about the high fat intake til Rinse&rePeat posted this quote:

"Sugar helps the liver to make cholesterol, switching from starchy vegetables to sweet fruits will usually bring cholesterol levels up to normal. If the fat is mostly saturated, from milk, cheese, butter, beef, lamb or coconut oil, I think it's usually o.k. to get about 50% of the calories from fat, but since those natural fats typically contain around 2% polyunsaturated fats, I try to minimize my PUFA intake by having more fruit, and a little less fat, maybe 30 to 35%." - Ray Peat
Have you experienced any benefits from the high sat fat intake -- libido, hormones, anything -- my macro split currently is quite similar to yours
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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Have you experienced any benefits from the high sat fat intake -- libido, hormones, anything -- my macro split currently is quite similar to yours
Lots of benefits! Yeah higher libido, feeling bigger/more 'durable,' very stable mood, no brain fog after meals, etc.

Eating lots of sat fat is pretty much the only way I personally am able to eat so much without bloating.

Best of luck with your own macro split!
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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Wow, I wonder why that is? I know you don't do much starch either so that would be almost all sugar-based carbs?
No idea...was hoping thyroid would increase my carb tolerance but so far it hasn't really.

Yeah, pretty much all sugar in the form of fruit, fruit juices, honey, dark choc, ice cream, etc. Might eat starch (potatoes) a few times a month at restaurants.
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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At least with regards to physique development but I "feel" good on that breakdown too.
It seems like the diet that makes one feel the best also leads to the most long-term benefits!
 

AndrogenicJB

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Lots of benefits! Yeah higher libido, feeling bigger/more 'durable,' very stable mood, no brain fog after meals, etc.

Eating lots of sat fat is pretty much the only way I personally am able to eat so much without bloating.

Best of luck with your own macro split!
Do you think high fat can cause blood flow problems to regions of the body
 

76er

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No idea...was hoping thyroid would increase my carb tolerance but so far it hasn't really.

Yeah, pretty much all sugar in the form of fruit, fruit juices, honey, dark choc, ice cream, etc. Might eat starch (potatoes) a few times a month at restaurants.
Not that it is a big deal in fact that "problem" is more of the ideal since fat is preferred taste macro after all.

I guess you really don't want to go too much below 33% carb, however, as you could be missing on key fruit micros, stress reduction,
fructose benefits, etc., etc.
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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I guess you really don't want to go too much below 33% carb, however, as you could be missing on key fruit micros, stress reduction,
fructose benefits, etc., etc.
Exactly, it kind of requires walking a fine line! In addition to everything you mentioned, the fruit is probably important for pH as it's a primary source of alkalinity in my diet.
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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Do you think high fat can cause blood flow problems to regions of the body
I don't think so...some people seem to be concerned about this, but haven't experienced it so far.

In fact stearic acid seems to increase warmth (and blood flow?) to extremities.
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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A place for occasional ultra-intense exercise?

It seems like most things in nature are stochastic. There are cycles of growth, cycles of cutting back, cycles of light, cycles of darkness, etc etc.

I think reaching one's highest fitness levels might require some built-in stochasticity, too.

Of course, how much variability - and how much intensity - one can handle will depend largely on their health. Everyone has a different threshold for what constitutes 'hormetic' stress and what does not.

But I think a young, healthy person may actually benefit from very occasional ultra-intense workouts.

I used to hike up this mountain near my house carrying an 80lb kettlebell on my shoulder. Man, it was brutal! Lots of pain and gasping for air lol. But my mind was clearer, and my outlook on life brighter, in the week or two following such a workout.

Another time I biked 10+ hours a day for three days straight carrying a 40lb backpack. The final day felt like a near-death experience, but it opened up my mind to concepts I might not have thought of otherwise.

Going to experiment with occasionally overdoing it on the trail/in the gym/on the slopes this fall and winter. Something like a 50-rep squat workout or long-distance snowshoeing trek should do the trick!
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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A delectable dessert

Anyone who's trying to gain weight may want to try raw honey + 10% greek yogurt. Add in some berries, coconut shreds, or propolis for extra texture. Delicious and calorific!

yogurtcrono.jpg
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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Update: Got COVID, lost 15 pounds

Big setback here. I had something like COVID and was unable to eat for 3 days...then ate very lightly for another 5 days. As a result I've lost 15+ pounds. Down to 158-160 in the morning. :(

Could be a long road back. Sense of smell and strength are still recovering. I've been taking 2.5mg of THC per day to stimulate appetite.

Will be interesting to see what the future holds...
 

Dave_Fit

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Update 4

AM Workout: Standard 20 breathing squats + 20 pullovers. My squat technique, once horrible, is really getting better. Holding the bar for the full duration of the 20 squats is also getting easier. Will probably keep the same weight for these 2 exercises for the next week or two. Felt good afterwards, as always!


PM Workout: Push day today! Worked up to some near-max singles on the bench press, then set a new PR for 2 in the overhead squat. Then did weighted dips for the first time ever. Tough! Followed this up with some standing tricep presses.

At this point I try to set a PR of some sort everyday...still new enough to lifting that this seems doable.


Nutrition: I've gotten accustomed to eating ~4400 cals per day, but consistently stepping things up to 5000 is going to be a challenge! So far today I have eaten well in excess of hunger cues and have been very warm all day. Hopefully 5000 cals will be enough to guarantee continued muscle gain.

On the hunt for an authentic cheesecake, as most of the ones at the grocery store seem pretty toxic.


If anyone has any high-calorie, not-so-filling Peaty foods to recommend, feel free to mention them!
I make a Jello with sweetened condensed milk, OJ, and unflavored knox gelatin. 2 cans sweetened condensed milk, roughly 40 oz OJ, 1/3 cup gelatin (2.5 oz). This makes 6 servings for me at about 500 cal a serving. The trick is to heat the OJ and condensed milk slowly stirring often or else the condensed milk will burn in the pot. makes a great on the go snack, lots of calcium 381 mg, potassium 872 mg, 22 g protein, 101 g carbs, 1 g fat.
peat_gelatin.png
 

Dave_Fit

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"Sugar helps the liver to make cholesterol, switching from starchy vegetables to sweet fruits will usually bring cholesterol levels up to normal. If the fat is mostly saturated, from milk, cheese, butter, beef, lamb or coconut oil, I think it's usually o.k. to get about 50% of the calories from fat, but since those natural fats typically contain around 2% polyunsaturated fats, I try to minimize my PUFA intake by having more fruit, and a little less fat, maybe 30 to 35%." - Ray Peat
This quote summarizes my current diet! Love the post.
 

Tomb.

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Very interesting thread. I have been on a very similar journey myself the past few years.

Former semi professional cyclist who quit the sport and turned to bodybuilding. I feel like it is quite hard to break free from the more is better mindset of endurance sports and embrace the less is more approach required from bodybuilding / hypertrophy.

The only major difference between our situations is that I came from being obese into cycling. I think all the fat protected me from the detrimental effect is it for a while but once I was down to race weight (67kg at 185cm) the cortisol really came on fast and stripped all my muscle away.

I have struggled to get over 75kg and while my body composition has significantly improved and I am eating far more than I ever did cycling I can definitely feel you pain if not being able to get to a desired weight.

Out of interest do you still do any cycling or have you completely thrown it away. I feel like 45 - 60 mins of very easy Z1 cycling can actually be quite regenerative as long as fueled properly. The residual fitness though means the calorie burn can be quite high which is problematic.

Anyway enjoying reading about your progress. Kinda inspiring me to start my own peaty building log.

✌️
 
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OccamzRazer

OccamzRazer

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Very interesting thread. I have been on a very similar journey myself the past few years.

Former semi professional cyclist who quit the sport and turned to bodybuilding. I feel like it is quite hard to break free from the more is better mindset of endurance sports and embrace the less is more approach required from bodybuilding / hypertrophy.

The only major difference between our situations is that I came from being obese into cycling. I think all the fat protected me from the detrimental effect is it for a while but once I was down to race weight (67kg at 185cm) the cortisol really came on fast and stripped all my muscle away.

I have struggled to get over 75kg and while my body composition has significantly improved and I am eating far more than I ever did cycling I can definitely feel you pain if not being able to get to a desired weight.

Out of interest do you still do any cycling or have you completely thrown it away. I feel like 45 - 60 mins of very easy Z1 cycling can actually be quite regenerative as long as fueled properly. The residual fitness though means the calorie burn can be quite high which is problematic.

Anyway enjoying reading about your progress. Kinda inspiring me to start my own peaty building log.

✌️
Hey thanks for the kind words! It's an interesting journey, for sure.

I still bike for fun if the weather is nice. How about you?

No longer have any fancy racing bikes...I just take my commuter bike to the coffee shop or grocery store. I try to breathe thru my mouth the entire time - staying in zone 2. But, as you said, cycling does make it (even) harder to gain weight.

Starting a log...that'd be cool!! If you do I'll follow along. I'm pretty much done with this log. Lost a lot of weight due to sickness and don't feel like stuffing myself with food for months just to gain it back.
 

Dave_Fit

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Hey thanks so much for the support, and the recipe you shared!
Sure thing. I heard a new one I want to try, mangoes, chocolate, and gelatin, with egg yolks oh yeah! Sounds like heaven
 

Tomb.

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Hey thanks for the kind words! It's an interesting journey, for sure.

I still bike for fun if the weather is nice. How about you?

No longer have any fancy racing bikes...I just take my commuter bike to the coffee shop or grocery store. I try to breathe thru my mouth the entire time - staying in zone 2. But, as you said, cycling does make it (even) harder to gain weight.

Starting a log...that'd be cool!! If you do I'll follow along. I'm pretty much done with this log. Lost a lot of weight due to sickness and don't feel like stuffing myself with food for months just to gain it back.

Don't give up on the size goals, you seemed to progress extremely well in a very short time period, I truly believe that having as much musle mass as you can naturally sustain for your life time is one of the best things anybody can ever do for themselves. As they say you are either growing or dying.

Have you ever considered adjusting your approach and going extremely minimal with how many exercises set you do to limit the calorie burn / requirement. The stimulus you can creatre from one all out set per excercise is so great that often it can be enough to create a response and allow progression.

I think keeping the social connections cycling created for me is the main reason I keep up the little I still do. It really is only on days off the gym and Z1 only, it is nice to get outside and get some fresh air and clear the mind.
 

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