Peat Eating And Weight Gain

[trialrun]

trialrun, what are your sources and overall consumption of fat? also, something you might want to try:

"When a person wants to lose excess fat, limiting the diet to low fat milk, eggs, orange juice, and a daily carrot or two, will provide the essential nutrients without excess calories."
- Ray Peat

source: I think it's the first page of this thread.

Hey J. I've cut back on fats from paleo days, and current sources are saturated fats from grass fed beef, butter, milk, cheese, and sometimes fatty fish when I splurge for sushi. I've taken the PUFA warnings to heart, in the light of the higher sugars, and avoid nuts, avocados, grain fed meat as much as I can, and don't use oils. (I use coconut oil only rarely, as it has a tendency to get me anxious and overly hyped up, and nauseous).

 

[j.]

have you tried having coconut oil after food, and not on an empty stomach? i'm not sure this is something Peat recommends or not, i'm just curious.

also, are you drinking 2 quarts of whole milk per day? i read Peat say that amount could be fattening.

 

[Birdie]

I've gotten cynoplus from mymexicandrugstore.com.

 

[Koniec]

Hello all, new to forum.
About 1 1/2 weeks into "diet Peat eating" hopefully to lose a little around the waste.

I've transitioned from paleo to Peat though not taking any thyroid.

Here's my plan:

9am 1 pint of OJ w/ gelatin (Great Lakes 2 servings)
11am 1 pint 2% Milk w/gelatin (4 servings) sugar salt and coffee
1pm 1 pint Milk (same) w/gelatin sugar salt and coffee
3pm 1 pint OJ w/ gelatin
5pm carrot salad
7pm *2 eggs cooked w/coconut oil and 1.5 pint of OJ (no gelatin)
9pm glass of sugared salted milk
11pm glass of OJ with magnesium powder

* substitute 6oz trimmed steak, 4oz beef liver, or a dozen oysters once every 2 weeks or so

I'm doing 3 sets of push ups - maxing out each set. (2 full days of rest and recovery in between workout days).

My emphasis is on timing of meals (every two hours) and caloric restriction just about 2000 per day.

I'm 6'6 and currently 198lbs.
Not a bad place to be, but was leaner with paleo and gained 15-20 going off paleo onto "full/excess Peat" and on and off SAD a few times to boot.

I'll let you know how it's going...I'm doing rather severe caloric restriction...it typically takes about 4 weeks..but we'll see.

ps. this place is cool

 

[Birdie]

Hi Koniec. Welcome. I'm pretty new on this forum. Have been following Peat since last Oct. Gained 10 lbs. But had already gained 20 following MDA and PHD. I was on my own created plan but decided I needed support with my weird ways. Unfortunately, with support, I began to eat more... Anyway, the good news is I've lost 10 in the past 5 months.

When I started back in Oct, I began to eat too much ice cream... With the PHD influence I went back on rice which I'd been away from for years. For me, it's important to limit starch and be more low fat. The starch is gone except for occas tortilla chips made in my oven. I'm not counting calories because that makes me too nuts. But I do count calories and keep track of my ratios every couple of months to see where I stand.

For me a lot of it is the mental thing. When I keep reading recipes and listening (FB etc) to those who eat for entertainment, I'm sorry to say I lose my focus.

I am eating: 1 egg, 1/2 pc bacon, fruit, oj, ricotta cheese, jarlsburg cheese, coffee, milk, oj jello, more fruit.. Sugar/honey(yes, light) in coffee milk. Sometimes a little beef. Aiming for 1 oz liver 2Xweek... Not eating seafood. Should be. Supplements.

I find it difficult to remember to see if I am full when I eat. I think that stopping when full is important. Also important to eat often enough so I try to do that. Also muy importante to keep with the winners. I need to keep reading good advice. <3

 

[Koniec]

Thanks for the kind words.

I know how you feel about cal counting, I'm the same way, every once in a while I'll kind of do an audit, but I have to feel up for it. Beyond that it can become rather consuming. (If only I could burn calories from all the math ).

That mental factor can get the best of me too. If I see food blogs or TV shows my stomach will start to rumble. Yet I like the feeling of nourishment I get with the Peat set of foods.

I'm playing around with different ways I guess.
This is the first time I'm attempting the frequent meals approach.

It somewhat relates to the "feeling full quandary" you mentioned - in that if I'm not sure if I think I feel full, I go ahead and stop with what seems like the right portion. I shrug my shoulders knowing I'll eat again soon.

Agreed that it is important to eat enough, getting too low will probably tip the hormonal scales out of whack and at worst introduce a little toxicity.


Yay for the winners.
Thanks again.

 

[nwo2012]

Hello all, new to forum.
About 1 1/2 weeks into "diet Peat eating" hopefully to lose a little around the waste.

I've transitioned from paleo to Peat though not taking any thyroid.

Here's my plan:

9am 1 pint of OJ w/ gelatin (Great Lakes 2 servings)
11am 1 pint 2% Milk w/gelatin (4 servings) sugar salt and coffee
1pm 1 pint Milk (same) w/gelatin sugar salt and coffee
3pm 1 pint OJ w/ gelatin
5pm carrot salad
7pm *2 eggs cooked w/coconut oil and 1.5 pint of OJ (no gelatin)
9pm glass of sugared salted milk
11pm glass of OJ with magnesium powder

* substitute 6oz trimmed steak, 4oz beef liver, or a dozen oysters once every 2 weeks or so

I'm doing 3 sets of push ups - maxing out each set. (2 full days of rest and recovery in between workout days).

My emphasis is on timing of meals (every two hours) and caloric restriction just about 2000 per day.

I'm 6'6 and currently 198lbs.
Not a bad place to be, but was leaner with paleo and gained 15-20 going off paleo onto "full/excess Peat" and on and off SAD a few times to boot.

I'll let you know how it's going...I'm doing rather severe caloric restriction...it typically takes about 4 weeks..but we'll see.

ps. this place is cool

Diet looks good. What are your goals, just improved thyroid/health or mass gain?

Are you polish by any chance?

 

[Koniec]

Goals are improved health.
Chronic stress and insomnia longstanding issues.
Had severe acid reflux but kicked that after cutting out gluten and other processed foods.
Building a little strength back after hernia surgery last year as well.

Ray Peat served as destination after a low carb paleo journey for half a year.

Working with polish genes, so can't be too bad. :P

 

[nwo2012]

Goals are improved health.
Chronic stress and insomnia longstanding issues.
Had severe acid reflux but kicked that after cutting out gluten and other processed foods.
Building a little strength back after hernia surgery last year as well.

Ray Peat served as destination after a low carb paleo journey for half a year.

Working with polish genes, so can't be too bad. :P

Then the diet is very good. Are you charting your oral temps and pulses? How do they stack up? Not considering thyroid supps at all?
Yes we also have similar genes.

 

[Koniec]

Haven't applied that scrutiny yet.

I get about 2 cups of coffee in with my milk per glass.
So about 4-6 cups a day is as close as I get to thyroid supp.

My main bio markers are how I handle stress and sleep for now.
I need to get a better handle on the pulse and temp to see if anything is severe there...
Need to do the research, (pulse needs to be 80+ and temp should be 98.6+ ?)

My guess is I was slightly hypo thyroid due to many years typical american diet plus half year of paleo.

 

[charlie]

Temps should be in the range of 97.8-98.2 on waking before getting out of bed. By lunch time you should be pushing 98.6 at least.

Please someone correct me if I am wrong.

 

[nwo2012]

Temps should be in the range of 97.8-98.2 on waking before getting out of bed. By lunch time you should be pushing 98.6 at least.

Please someone correct me if I am wrong.

Correct, ideally nearer 99 for around 10 waking hours (sunlight hours). And pulse 85-90. Both can be lower, similar to waking, before bed.

 

[Koniec]

Ah, thank you both for this.
Maybe I pick up oral digital thermometer soon.

 

[nwo2012]

Ah, thank you both for this.
Maybe I pick up oral digital thermometer soon.

Make sure you get a BBT (usually used by women trying to conceive) as more accurate.
You're welcome.

 

[Koniec]

Appreciate the help/guidance.
Will follow up if anything of interest warrants as such.

 

[nwo2012]

Appreciate the help/guidance.
Will follow up if anything of interest warrants as such.

You're welcome as always.

 

[Birdie]

A couple of pages back there was discussion about vine ripened fruit and that it stops the production of natural pesticides in the fruit. This sounds interesting and I'd like to know more about it.

I did read some more about watermelon and it's interesting that it ripens only on the vine. It will not continue to ripen after it's picked. So, that would be one fruit without the natural pesticides if we are following that theory.

I think it would be impossible to buy many fruits if they were ripened completely on the vine/tree. They would be rotten by the time we bought them, even if we were able to buy locally. I'm thinking of melons since they are abundant just now.

As for Ray's using the word sugar, I've also been thinking about the way it was used in my biology/chemistry classes. It referred to the molecule. Whether the sugar was in fruit was incidental. In other words, we might consider that Peat, as a scientist, is using the word in the way a scientist, biologist, chemist might use it. Of course, he might not be using it this way. He might be using it in a way to communicate with non-scientists. So, I'm not sure but I think it is something we should consider.

On the serotonin in certain fruits, you can't cook it out. It's there. This is a reason that RP does not recommend bananas. The other reason is that they are highly industrialized. To me, it doesn't mean you can never have one but it isn't a main food to emphasize.

On honey and maple syrup, as others have said, the lighter ones are better, since they are less likely to develop dangerous compounds from over heating. Before reading Peat, I'd stopped both. I think with honey and maple syrup, we have a gray area, where we can choose to use them if they seem to work for us. It's certainly not a main part of Peat Eating or our metabolic diet.

 

[nwo2012]

A couple of pages back there was discussion about vine ripened fruit and that it stops the production of natural pesticides in the fruit. This sounds interesting and I'd like to know more about it.

I did read some more about watermelon and it's interesting that it ripens only on the vine. It will not continue to ripen after it's picked. So, that would be one fruit without the natural pesticides if we are following that theory.

I think it would be impossible to buy many fruits if they were ripened completely on the vine/tree. They would be rotten by the time we bought them, even if we were able to buy locally. I'm thinking of melons since they are abundant just now.

As for Ray's using the word sugar, I've also been thinking about the way it was used in my biology/chemistry classes. It referred to the molecule. Whether the sugar was in fruit was incidental. In other words, we might consider that Peat, as a scientist, is using the word in the way a scientist, biologist, chemist might use it. Of course, he might not be using it this way. He might be using it in a way to communicate with non-scientists. So, I'm not sure but I think it is something we should consider.

On the serotonin in certain fruits, you can't cook it out. It's there. This is a reason that RP does not recommend bananas. The other reason is that they are highly industrialized. To me, it doesn't mean you can never have one but it isn't a main food to emphasize.

On honey and maple syrup, as others have said, the lighter ones are better, since they are less likely to develop dangerous compounds from over heating. Before reading Peat, I'd stopped both. I think with honey and maple syrup, we have a gray area, where we can choose to use them if they seem to work for us. It's certainly not a main part of Peat Eating or our metabolic diet.

Peat does not like maple syrup for sure. Same goes for rapadura or brown sugar. Too many impurities.

 

[narouz]

Detangling Peat's Views on Syrups vs. Plain White Sugar

A couple of pages back there was discussion about vine ripened fruit and that it stops the production of natural pesticides in the fruit. This sounds interesting and I'd like to know more about it.

I did read some more about watermelon and it's interesting that it ripens only on the vine. It will not continue to ripen after it's picked. So, that would be one fruit without the natural pesticides if we are following that theory.

I think it would be impossible to buy many fruits if they were ripened completely on the vine/tree. They would be rotten by the time we bought them, even if we were able to buy locally. I'm thinking of melons since they are abundant just now.

As for Ray's using the word sugar, I've also been thinking about the way it was used in my biology/chemistry classes. It referred to the molecule. Whether the sugar was in fruit was incidental. In other words, we might consider that Peat, as a scientist, is using the word in the way a scientist, biologist, chemist might use it. Of course, he might not be using it this way. He might be using it in a way to communicate with non-scientists. So, I'm not sure but I think it is something we should consider.

On the serotonin in certain fruits, you can't cook it out. It's there. This is a reason that RP does not recommend bananas. The other reason is that they are highly industrialized. To me, it doesn't mean you can never have one but it isn't a main food to emphasize.

On honey and maple syrup, as others have said, the lighter ones are better, since they are less likely to develop dangerous compounds from over heating. Before reading Peat, I'd stopped both. I think with honey and maple syrup, we have a gray area, where we can choose to use them if they seem to work for us. It's certainly not a main part of Peat Eating or our metabolic diet.

Peat does not like maple syrup for sure. Same goes for rapadura or brown sugar. Too many impurities.

As I was saying earlier in the thread,
Peat is a little hard to pin down on sugar sources.
Most of the time he makes a pretty strong push for honey (at least) over plain sugar
as a regular part of the diet,
and he does so because of the nutrient contents.

In the 2011 interview
Glycemia, Starch and SUGAR in context!
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/eastwe...ray-peat-glycemia-starch-and-sugar-in-context
Peat praises maple syrup
for its high potassium and magnesium content.

But then he goes on to say that maple syrup,
and other plant syrups that are subjected to high heat
in the boiling down/concentrating process,
are thereby made potentially allergenic.
He includes agave syrup and molasses there.
But he does seem to say that the lighter syrups,
which may not be processed and concentrated with such high heat,
are okay.
Here's the quote from the interview:

"Maple sugar is probably, chemically, more nutritious than honey,
has a very good potassium and a pretty good magnesium content,
but the problem is--as with agave or molasses--when boiled down to dark concentrate
it can be potentially allergenic."

So, sorting through Peat's views,
I think it's fair to say,
that most of the time,
Peat will say that--
if one isn't bothered by allergenicity--
honey and (the lighter) syrups are preferable to plain, white sugar.

But just to make thing more complicated,
in that same interview Peat says:
"Honey is almost all pure sugar with some minerals,
so it's a good food.
It isn't all that much greater than plain white sugar,
but it's slightly nutritious."

That interview is from 2011, so it represents Peat's fairly recent views.

 

[Birdie]

Agreed, narouz. That's why I said I use the lighter maple syrup. Here, we have a choice. No syrup or the light. As I see it. I love maple syrup. Thanks for the reminder about the extra Mg and other nutrients. I do avoid brown sugar. Completely agree with nwo12 there.

I've been substituting honey for white sugar at times. I like it in a latte. I don't like it as much as white sug in brewed coffee...