Outbreak of common colds after 17 weeks of complete isolation

Giraffe

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Sucharit Bhakdi in a recent interview said something along the lines that he got a cold, and this does not mean that someone infected him. He had spent time outside when it was cold, and he got cold, and this caused the symptoms. People need to understand, that the viruses are in us, and we start getting symptoms after we got cold.

.....

An outbreak of common colds at an Antarctic base after seventeen weeks of complete isolation

SUMMARY

Six of 12 men wintering at an isolated Antarctic base sequentially developed symptoms and signs of a common cold after 17 weeks of complete isolation. Examination of specimens taken from the men in relation to the outbreak has not revealed a causative agent.

Twelve men were left at the Base, and on 14 July 1969 one man presented with respiratory symptoms closely resembling those of a mild to moderately severe cold as described by Tyrrell (1965). During the next 2 weeks, eight out of the 12 men at the Base suffered similar respiratory symptoms, and a further two had attacks of sneezing. The symptoms and signs were charted (Fig. 1).

They have been taking serum and nasal samples all the time during their stay at the base. It was sent to a lab, but a causative agent could not be identified. An allergic reaction to something was ruled out.

Virus might have persisted in the respiratory tract of one or more men at the Base. If such were the case it would be necessary to postulate a triggering mechanism to precipitate symptoms, and it is interesting to note that symptoms occurred 4 days after a precipitous fall in outside temperature, and during one of the coldest months of the year, which Hope-Simpson (1958) and Lidwell, Morgan & Williams (1965) have correlated with increased incidence of respiratory disease. There is disagreement about whether the viruses which cause common colds can be carried by adults, and how important this is in epidemiology. The pattern of virus infection revealed by long-term studies, such as the virus watch programme (Elveback et al. 1966), is of a series of short infections with different viruses, and in the case of influenza virus disappearance of the current strain when a new serotype appears. On the other hand, adenoviruses may be shed by children for periods of months and recovered from the tonsils in a high proportion of cases, without evidence of acute respiratory infection, and non-respiratory viruses such as those of the herpes group often persist for the lifetime of a man. Furthermore, observations in animals have shown that pigs can carry swine influenza and transmit infection to other pigs 3 months later (Blaskovic et al. 1970), turkeys may carry and shed influenza virus A after apparent recovery (Robinson, Easterday & Tumova, 1972), and cattle which have recovered from foot and mouth disease still reproduce virus in the pharynx, and can initiate epidemics on contact with non-immune cattle (Graves et al. 1971). There are thus precedents in both children and animals for persistence of respiratory viruses, but in adults the laboratory evidence for carriage and reactivation of common cold viruses is weak. It may be that such evidence can only be found in rather unusual conditions of isolation and stress, such as occur in Antarctica. It is likely to be a rare phenomenon, but it might well be important in explaining the persistence of the large number of rhinovirus serotypes which make an appearance in many areas when the temperature falls.
 

schultz

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This is slightly off topic, but some people may also get sick from using a humidifier, or just being inside too much. I've been going through studies on endotoxin and it just seems to be everywhere. One of my favourite studies talked about the effect jumping on a bed has on endotoxin being released into the air. Yes, it is a source of endotoxin! Dogs were another big source, assuming you keep a dog inside. Cats were not a source apparently. Humidifiers though commonly contain endotoxin and seem to be a problem unless there is an effort made to use water that has had most of the stuff removed. Reverse osmosis seemed to remove a lot of it and is practical. Another source was from tatami mats, the floor mats used in Japanese homes. It's possible then that jute rugs, or sisal, could also be a source? I haven't looked into it. Concrete floors apparently too, especially if moist. And the steam from a shower would contain endotoxin most likely. Farm dust definitely.

I think air purifiers can help assuming the filters are changed regularly because apparently endotoxin can build up in a filter and then all of a sudden a bunch of it can be released all at once.

I suspect HVAC systems are a source of endotoxin. I guarantee my vents haven't been cleaned ever which is why I stopped using them. They are filled with dust and vermin droppings, it's disgusting. I may remove them all, or put new ones in. I like the old radiator systems. Seems a lot cleaner. I dream of installing a brand new radiator system.

Is it possible this Antarctic base had a humidifier system?

Sorry for going a bit off topic. Once I started typing I couldn't stop lol. I was just trying to make the point that being inside in the winter without fresh air can cause flu or cold symptoms that are probably unrelated to viruses.
 

Perry Staltic

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This is slightly off topic, but some people may also get sick from using a humidifier, or just being inside too much. I've been going through studies on endotoxin and it just seems to be everywhere. One of my favourite studies talked about the effect jumping on a bed has on endotoxin being released into the air. Yes, it is a source of endotoxin! Dogs were another big source, assuming you keep a dog inside. Cats were not a source apparently. Humidifiers though commonly contain endotoxin and seem to be a problem unless there is an effort made to use water that has had most of the stuff removed. Reverse osmosis seemed to remove a lot of it and is practical. Another source was from tatami mats, the floor mats used in Japanese homes. It's possible then that jute rugs, or sisal, could also be a source? I haven't looked into it. Concrete floors apparently too, especially if moist. And the steam from a shower would contain endotoxin most likely. Farm dust definitely.

I think air purifiers can help assuming the filters are changed regularly because apparently endotoxin can build up in a filter and then all of a sudden a bunch of it can be released all at once.

I suspect HVAC systems are a source of endotoxin. I guarantee my vents haven't been cleaned ever which is why I stopped using them. They are filled with dust and vermin droppings, it's disgusting. I may remove them all, or put new ones in. I like the old radiator systems. Seems a lot cleaner. I dream of installing a brand new radiator system.

Is it possible this Antarctic base had a humidifier system?

Sorry for going a bit off topic. Once I started typing I couldn't stop lol. I was just trying to make the point that being inside in the winter without fresh air can cause flu or cold symptoms that are probably unrelated to viruses.

I don't think it's off-topic at all. Highly relevant, in fact. I suspect there was minimal air exchange at that Antarctica base at that time (late 1960s) in order to conserve heat. They slept in a fiberglass hut which probably had no outdoor air exchange. In times of extreme cold they used supplemental paraffin stoves which would have introduced potent airborne toxins, and didn't have access to fresh vegetables; they took vitamin supplements, but were certainly lacking in phytonutrients. Additionally, the increased living density necessitated by everyone constantly having to stay indoors certainly increased stress levels. The cold symptoms may have had nothing to do with a virus.
 

blob69

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Sucharit Bhakdi in a recent interview said something along the lines that he got a cold, and this does not mean that someone infected him. He had spent time outside when it was cold, and he got cold, and this caused the symptoms. People need to understand, that the viruses are in us, and we start getting symptoms after we got cold.

.....

An outbreak of common colds at an Antarctic base after seventeen weeks of complete isolation





They have been taking serum and nasal samples all the time during their stay at the base. It was sent to a lab, but a causative agent could not be identified. An allergic reaction to something was ruled out.

Thanks for sharing this, @Giraffe! I've seen this study a while ago, then lost the link to it and couldn't find it again. I think it illustrates nicely the absurdity of blaming exogenous viruses for diseases.

What do you guys think of Stefan Lanka's ideas - is it possible that the whole virology would be so misguided? I wonder about the studies that have shown pretty conclusively that the Spanish flu wasn't contagious at all, plus this quote from a standard textbook:

"Transmission experiments from people infected with a rhinovirus to susceptibles sitting opposite at a table proved singularly unsuccessful. Equally unsuccessful was the transmission of influenza from a naturally infected husband/wife to his/her spouse." - Introduction to Modern Virology, N. Dimmock and S. Primrose

I think it's very difficult to separate the effects of common environment from contagiousness as it is usually understood (pathogens). For example, I've been reading extensively about Black Death, where it was clear that people who came into contact with the diseased very often got sick too. However, there's the (in my opinion very plausible) theory that Black Death was caused by severely poisoned atmosphere that likely came from a cometary impact, which can contaminate the air with toxic substances including radioactivity, VOCs, heavy metals, ammonia etc. And we all know that a person who has had radiation "treatment" can harm people who are in close contact with them. With Black Death people seemed so badly poisoned by something that they died in a matter of days, sometimes even hours, and the smell they emitted was horrendous, so obviously it was something much worse than radiation treatment. So it's not hard to imagine that they could transfer the poisons to the people around them, no bacteria or virus required.

By the way, the official theory about Black Death (rats and fleas) is so full of holes it's amazing it still passes as some sort of a fact...
 
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bk_

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This is slightly off topic, but some people may also get sick from using a humidifier, or just being inside too much. I've been going through studies on endotoxin and it just seems to be everywhere. One of my favourite studies talked about the effect jumping on a bed has on endotoxin being released into the air. Yes, it is a source of endotoxin! Dogs were another big source, assuming you keep a dog inside. Cats were not a source apparently. Humidifiers though commonly contain endotoxin and seem to be a problem unless there is an effort made to use water that has had most of the stuff removed. Reverse osmosis seemed to remove a lot of it and is practical. Another source was from tatami mats, the floor mats used in Japanese homes. It's possible then that jute rugs, or sisal, could also be a source? I haven't looked into it. Concrete floors apparently too, especially if moist. And the steam from a shower would contain endotoxin most likely. Farm dust definitely.

I think air purifiers can help assuming the filters are changed regularly because apparently endotoxin can build up in a filter and then all of a sudden a bunch of it can be released all at once.

I suspect HVAC systems are a source of endotoxin. I guarantee my vents haven't been cleaned ever which is why I stopped using them. They are filled with dust and vermin droppings, it's disgusting. I may remove them all, or put new ones in. I like the old radiator systems. Seems a lot cleaner. I dream of installing a brand new radiator system.

Is it possible this Antarctic base had a humidifier system?

Sorry for going a bit off topic. Once I started typing I couldn't stop lol. I was just trying to make the point that being inside in the winter without fresh air can cause flu or cold symptoms that are probably unrelated to viruses.
Could you please provide a link to the study about endotoxins from dogs/cats/jumping on beds? I’d like to show this to my family :laughing:
 

Perry Staltic

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I think it's very difficult to separate the effects of common environment from contagiousness. For example, I've been reading extensively about Black Death, where it was clear that people who came into contact with the diseased very often got sick too. However, there's the (in my opinion very plausible) theory that Black Death was caused by severely poisoned atmosphere that likely came from a cometary impact, which can contaminate the air with toxic substances including radioactivity, VOCs, heavy metals, ammonia etc. And we all know that a person who has had radiation "treatment" can harm people who are in close contact with them. With Black Death people seemed so badly poisoned by something that they died in a matter of days, sometimes even hours, and the smell they emitted was horrendous, so obviously it was something much worse than radiation treatment. So it's not hard to imagine that they could transfer the poisons to the people around them, no bacteria or virus required.

By the way, the official theory about Black Death (rats and fleas) is so full of holes it's amazing it still passes as some sort of a fact...

A lot of mortality during the time of the black plague (1346-53) was probably due to malnutrition from crop failures caused by the climate transition from the Medieval Warm Period (ended about 1300) to the Little Ice Age period, and the Magdalene Flood (1342), as well as other anomalous floods due to climate change, that wiped out significant parts of European agriculture for enduring periods of time.


 

blob69

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A lot of mortality during the time of the black plague (1346-53) was probably due to malnutrition from crop failures caused by the climate transition from the Medieval Warm Period (ended about 1300) to the Little Ice Age period, and the Magdalene Flood (1342), as well as other anomalous floods due to the climate change, that wiped out significant parts of European agriculture for enduring periods of time.


Interesting you would mention that, I'm sure low temperatures contributed too. It seems to have been a combination of negative things, with floods, earthquakes, comets, corrupted atmosphere etc. all mentioned in writings from those times.

The little ice age was at the time of a solar minimum, however, these minimums are also connected to flu outbreaks. I even found scientists who predicted an epidemic as a consequence of a solar minimum that happened in December 2019 (the deepest in 100 years). They explain it as cosmic rays causing viruses to mutate to new aggressive forms, but one could also explain it without invoking viruses. Perhaps solar minimums simply allow more toxic cosmic influence to enter the Earth's atmosphere?

As you probably know, these solar minimums are predicted to intensify in the future, which could cause another little ice age. This winter we had more snow here than we've seen in half a century.
 

Perry Staltic

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Interesting you would mention that, I'm sure low temperatures contributed too. It seems to have been a combination of negative things, with floods, earthquakes, comets, corrupted atmosphere etc. all mentioned in writings from those times.

The little ice age was at the time of a solar minimum, however, these minimums are also connected to flu outbreaks. I even found scientists who predicted an epidemic as a consequence of a solar minimum that happened in December 2019 (the deepest in 100 years). They explain it as cosmic rays causing viruses to mutate to new aggressive forms, but one could also explain it without invoking viruses. Perhaps solar minimums simply allow more toxic cosmic influence to enter the Earth's atmosphere?

As you probably know, these solar minimums are predicted to intensify in the future, which could cause another little ice age. This winter we had more snow here than we've seen in half a century.

Decreased solar activity during solar minimums allows more cosmic rays to penetrate earth's atmosphere, which destabilizes the jet stream causing it to meander and allow warm air to move further north in places (like Alaska and the northern Atlantic) and colder arctic air to move further south in other places (like Europe and the eastern US). This disrupts established agricultural practices and shortens growing seasons in impacted areas. What effect cosmic rays have on other factors I have no idea, except for increased volcanic activity, which causes atmospheric cooling.

NASA is predicting that solar cycle 25 (just now beginning) will be on the order of magnitude of the Dalton Minimum in which "the year without a summer" occurred.
 

schultz

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Could you please provide a link to the study about endotoxins from dogs/cats/jumping on beds? I’d like to show this to my family :laughing:

Oh sure. The study I was specifically thinking of regarding dogs is this one...

"The presence of pets (especially dogs) was extremely strongly associated with endotoxin concentrations in indoor air."

...and one about humidifiers and drinking water:

"A theoretical assessment of the inhalation of aerosolized endotoxin showed that while the likelihood of an acute response while showering is minimal, the same is not true for humidifiers. Ultrasonic and impeller (cool mist) humidifiers efficiently produce large numbers of respirable particles. It is predicted that airway inflammation can occur if humidifier reservoirs are filled with tap water, sometimes even at typical drinking-water distribution-system endotoxin concentrations. Higher endotoxin levels occasionally found in drinking water (>1,000 EU/ml) are very likely to induce symptoms such as chills and fever if used as humidifier feed water. While it is unlikely that treated drinking water would contain extremely high endotoxin levels occasionally observed in cyanobacterial blooms (>35,000 EU/ml), the potential for serious acute health consequences exist if used in humidifiers."

It's not all bad though. I wouldn't necessarily get rid of a dog because of that. Some studies suggest keeping clean can be a more important factor. Another study said that the airborne endotoxin was at the same level for houses with dogs and without, but that there was more endotoxin in the settled dust of houses with pets. That could mean that keeping clean would help prevent the increased endotoxin associated with dogs. You'd want to keep all types of fabric furnishings clean though (curtains, sofa, beds, etc.) A suppose something like a leather sofa would be healthier, wood floors instead of carpet, etc.

Here are a few more papers on pets and endotoxin, each with slightly different conclusions:


Here is the paper on bed jumping (lol) -- The bit about opening the window is quite relevant
"For making the bed, lower airborne fungi was found in houses using essential oils rather than no essential oils using. The airborne endotoxin concentrations were positively associated with furry pets and smokers in the homes and negatively correlated to the home with window opening with a statistical significance during the periods of jumping on the bed and making the bed. In conclusion, significant increases of PM and bioaerosols during jumping on the bed and making the bed may need to be concerned."


There are also a lot of studies on humidifiers, and "humidifier lung", which can cause fever, chills, tightness in the chest, etc. I suspect when winter comes, people turn on the HVAC, close their windows and stay inside for longer periods and thus are breathing in a lot more endotoxin than during the summer. A lot of people also use humidifiers during the winter because of the dryness. I wouldn't say its the only cause of winter sickness, but it's definitely a contributing factor (also light exposure, vitamin D, various indoor pollutants like formaldehyde, etc.)

I have yet to delve deeply into this subject though. I'd like to know the effects of something like having plants in the house has, or air purifiers, or even ionizers.
 

bk_

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Oh sure. The study I was specifically thinking of regarding dogs is this one...

"The presence of pets (especially dogs) was extremely strongly associated with endotoxin concentrations in indoor air."

...and one about humidifiers and drinking water:

"A theoretical assessment of the inhalation of aerosolized endotoxin showed that while the likelihood of an acute response while showering is minimal, the same is not true for humidifiers. Ultrasonic and impeller (cool mist) humidifiers efficiently produce large numbers of respirable particles. It is predicted that airway inflammation can occur if humidifier reservoirs are filled with tap water, sometimes even at typical drinking-water distribution-system endotoxin concentrations. Higher endotoxin levels occasionally found in drinking water (>1,000 EU/ml) are very likely to induce symptoms such as chills and fever if used as humidifier feed water. While it is unlikely that treated drinking water would contain extremely high endotoxin levels occasionally observed in cyanobacterial blooms (>35,000 EU/ml), the potential for serious acute health consequences exist if used in humidifiers."

It's not all bad though. I wouldn't necessarily get rid of a dog because of that. Some studies suggest keeping clean can be a more important factor. Another study said that the airborne endotoxin was at the same level for houses with dogs and without, but that there was more endotoxin in the settled dust of houses with pets. That could mean that keeping clean would help prevent the increased endotoxin associated with dogs. You'd want to keep all types of fabric furnishings clean though (curtains, sofa, beds, etc.) A suppose something like a leather sofa would be healthier, wood floors instead of carpet, etc.

Here are a few more papers on pets and endotoxin, each with slightly different conclusions:


Here is the paper on bed jumping (lol) -- The bit about opening the window is quite relevant
"For making the bed, lower airborne fungi was found in houses using essential oils rather than no essential oils using. The airborne endotoxin concentrations were positively associated with furry pets and smokers in the homes and negatively correlated to the home with window opening with a statistical significance during the periods of jumping on the bed and making the bed. In conclusion, significant increases of PM and bioaerosols during jumping on the bed and making the bed may need to be concerned."


There are also a lot of studies on humidifiers, and "humidifier lung", which can cause fever, chills, tightness in the chest, etc. I suspect when winter comes, people turn on the HVAC, close their windows and stay inside for longer periods and thus are breathing in a lot more endotoxin than during the summer. A lot of people also use humidifiers during the winter because of the dryness. I wouldn't say its the only cause of winter sickness, but it's definitely a contributing factor (also light exposure, vitamin D, various indoor pollutants like formaldehyde, etc.)

I have yet to delve deeply into this subject though. I'd like to know the effects of something like having plants in the house has, or air purifiers, or even ionizers.
Much thanks ? :laughing:
 
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Giraffe

Giraffe

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Decreased solar activity during solar minimums allows more cosmic rays to penetrate earth's atmosphere, which destabilizes the jet stream causing it to meander and allow warm air to move further north in places (like Alaska and the northern Atlantic) and colder arctic air to move further south in other places (like Europe and the eastern US). This disrupts established agricultural practices and shortens growing seasons in impacted areas.
Above all, the weather is becoming more erratic. The likelihood of floods as well as that of droughts is increased. But this is really offtopic in this thread.
 

tankasnowgod

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Sucharit Bhakdi in a recent interview said something along the lines that he got a cold, and this does not mean that someone infected him. He had spent time outside when it was cold, and he got cold, and this caused the symptoms. People need to understand, that the viruses are in us, and we start getting symptoms after we got cold.
True. Anyone who has lived in the "Real World" for any length of time certainly has microbes and viruses within their body. How many..... Thousands, millions, billions, trillions, some other huge number.... is anyone's guess.

It makes sense that something like endotoxin could trigger cold and flu symptoms. That's been discussed on the forum before-


The only case of a human raised in complete sterile isolation that I know of is David Vetter, aka the Bubble Boy. He didn't even get a cold for twelve years he was in the unit, but everything that went into the bubble (including food) underwent a significant sterilization process. So he might have been a very rare example of a complete germ free human.

There were a few babies that spent time in isolators, but this was a limited time, I think under a year or so.
 

InChristAlone

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It is my understanding that the dry air is damaging to our respiratory system that needs to humidify our air before it goes into our lungs. Usually we can do that but with forced heated air I can see this being a cause of winter sickness. Or just being out in cold dry air.
 

Lejeboca

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Thank you so much for sharing. That was an excellent explanation of the dangers of the vaccine, very easy to understand. I think I've gotten my mom to start questioning the mRNA frankenstein treatment, and she was interested in watching the video later. Yay! I'm so happy that she is so open-minded.

Really happy for you! Yay! Some parents can overcome fear in a sensible way. Say "hi" to your mom from us on RPF :):
 

Korven

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Really happy for you! Yay! Some parents can overcome fear in a sensible way. Say "hi" to your mom from us on RPF :):

Haha thanks I will!! I think her previous (pretty horrible) experiences with modern medicine, and the cases of narcolepsy after the 2008 swine flu Pandemrix mass vaccination, and me gently nudging her about doing her own research into potential side effects, is what has made her start doubting the mass hysteria of "Everyone get the jab!!!!".
 

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