New here: Coming from carnivore

[fr@]

I'd be cautious with copper supplements. From what I've heard it's pretty easy to throw your copper : zinc ratio out of whack.

Liver is pretty loaded (9.755 mg of copper per 100g, from Beef liver, raw corresponds to 488% of the copper RDA. For a typical serving size of 1 liver (or 589 g) the amount of Copper is 57.46 mg. This corresponds to an RDA percentage of 2873%.)

I'll keep that in mind.

As with the Liver, I only eat 1 teaspoon a day -- as I might over do it (or is there no such thing as overdoing it?).

As with my other sources of Copper, I get it from Potatoes & Oranges.

So far I'm okay with the ratios I'm getting with Cronometer.

But at the same time maybe it's not that accurate ('cause of the Soil Conditions of those Potatoes & Oranges grown in).

I tend to follow what Georgi says...his video with Danny was the first one that really introduced me to these ideas. I watched "A Bioenergetic View of Autoimmunity" multiple times because what he was saying was so counter to what I thought autoimmune disease was. I was like released from this prison-like paradigm that my body was attacking itself because it was confused by proteins I was eating.

Actually I even messaged Paul Saladino back in 2017 and told him to reach out to Danny and debate on things, and I remember saying to Paul "they're hurting people"... hahaha.

Y'know, I don't know what cheating looks like with Peatisms. PUFAs I guess? I haven't eaten out since the end of April...I did cheat on some sunflower seeds last month too.

I don't even know as well what a cheat meal looks like in the Ray Peat community, but yeah I guess it's the: PUFAs, Emulsifiers (or any Processed Chemicals used in Food), Resistant Starches, Vegetables (Goitergenic/Estrogenic/etc), Spices, using Microwave to heat-up your food (lol)... so far those are the only things I can remember on top of my head.

[I also don't know if there's such a thing as a cheat meal in the Ray Peat community, I think reaching the pinnacle of 'Peatism' is not being Orthorexic -- just like hearing on one of Danny's Podcasts that Ray Peat was craving/eating Tacos.]

But I've regretted the Cheat Meal I had yesterday, pretty basic:

- Burrito
- Nachos
- Burger & Fries

[I also took some Digestive Enzymes with it, especially the DPP IV for the Gluten that's in those foods.]

And that event kind of brought me 7 or 19 steps back (metaphorically speaking) in regards to my tolerance to Milk.

'Cause before my Cheat Meal, I could already handle Milk on an empty stomach -- except the farts (and they're not smelly).

And now after a few hours of drinking Milk, I get some mild diarrhea w/ loose stools.

And my farts smells bad (asides from that it got me slightly bloated from that Cheat Meal).

I guess it skewed up my 'Gut Bacteria', probably I'll be back to my current normal after 3 to 4 days.

But since you mentioned Sunflower Seeds, I'd rather go with that than what I had yesterday... I think it has enough Vitamin-E to counter act its own PUFAs.

I tried oatmeal at the beginning but cut it as I had some issues.

Also I think that Oatmeal is high in Resistant Starches (probably depends if it's Fermented or Not?).

I eat...
-white rice (not fortified) like 1/2 dry cup every second/third day

I eat 3 cups of it, just so I could see on my Cronometer that I've hit my B1 to at least 100%... not really sure if it makes a difference though.

-potatoes and beets sometimes (not as often as rice lately)

I'm not sure if Beets is 'Peaty' as it raises Nitric Oxide.

I eat Potatoes though, hoping that it increases my Copper (assuming that it's grown in good farming conditions).

-corn tortilla (dunno if this is Peat approved but I seem to digest it ok, may be problematic as they probably have glyphosphate >.>) - every second day

Maybe the fancy ones are okay, like the Heirloom versions of it -- haven't tried it yet though.

-onions, garlic, ginger and mushrooms
-carrot salad with olive oil, salt and ACV

I get Histamine Reactions to ACV.

-fruit - lots everyday (I do tend to like the berries which I know Ray thinks have too many seeds), recently bought some melons, usually have oranges too
-some fruit juice but not really a staple (recently I was trying cranberry and now pomegranate)

Nice! But I doesn't fit my budget yet, except for Citrus Fruits like Oranges.

-ground beef

I only choose Top Round since it's the cheapest that has less fat.

-lean pork and chicken (I like making whole chicken soups, then skim off the fat)

I get minor pimples from Pork and Chicken, so I normally skip those meats.

Maybe if it's pasture raised, I'll give it a shot.

-honey

Doesn't fit my budget in contrast to what I can get from consuming it.

But I'll buy Honey Comb though (if I could find one), 'cause they say it has Policosanols.

-eggs (the less cooked the better)

Now I've decided to really give it a pass.

'Cause when I had my Cheat Meal yesterday and didn't have any Eggs, my Liver felt normal.

But today, I just ate my usual 1 Egg a day (which I just started 2 months ago) and a few hours later I'm getting this Keto Liver again.

Probably I'll stop for 1 month and bring it back for about 2-3 Eggs max a week.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjrxXC3kGf4

-butter and coconut oil to cook in or to air fry with

I get this Keto Liver with Butter, but I use Coconut Oil though.

As for cooking, I only use water... hahaha.

-one big cup of coffee with cream and sugar/day

I'm going to try Decaffeinated and see how it goes.

'Cause the Caffeine gives me a boost, kind of like Creatine that when you stop you really feel that something's missing.

-liver (was like a couple oz a month, if that.... trying to increase this to like 1/2-1oz per day for a bit)

I eat a teaspoon of it everyday (only Beef Liver, since it has more Copper).

-raw milk

My gut feels heavy when I drink Full Cream and the same goes with Raw Milk.

I often make curries with chicken breast and rice, beef chili (usually left overs with eggs in a few corn tortillas)- I often add mushrooms and gelatin to these types of meals. I do not eat a lot veggies, besides starchy tubers. I'll eat broccoli if I'm craving it (the only non-starchy veggie I ever crave).

Sounds tasty, I'll have them on my next Cheat Meal.

I overeat/struggle with portion control on:
-cheese
-ice cream

Definitely a Cheat Meal for me.

I also do eat some fermented foods (I am trying a week without to see if anything changes):
-1 cup of raw milk kefir every day
-some greek yogurt
-some sauerkraut (like a couple times a month)

I think the amount of Lactate Producing Bacteria in Fermented Foods makes it not Peaty.

I also get a bit bloated when consuming some.

As with getting ultra bloated, that's when I drink Kombucha.

I also have cravings for energy drinks which I sometimes indulge (usually red bull).

You probably have high tolerance to Caffeine (even if there's some Taurine) in Red Bull Drinks.

As far as supplements go-
Just started Serrapeptase on an empty stomach.

Adding the Nattokinase and Bromelain is the best, based from my experience.

I'm a bit of a spender for these supplements since the cheap one's like Doctor's Best gets me nauseated.

I usually take one lil' scoop of desiccated thyroid, D+K, a small amount of pregnenolone and an even smaller amount of DHEA.

I don't have any experience yet with Pregnenolone and DHEA.

As with D & K, I've labeled them as my Gray Area Supplement at the moment.

Though I'm micro-dosing (MK-7) again.

At night, I usually take progesterone (rubbed on my gums), magnesium (lysinate glcinate) and sometimes: glass of milk with glycine or a bit more thyroid if I feel like I'm hyped on adrenaline and cold at the same time...which happens a bit.

Maybe the adrenaline comes from the Energy Drinks.

I take others less frequently: methylated B complex, Thiamine mononitrate on its own, niacin on its own, taurine, theanine, creatine (but I haven't used it in a long while), probably more, I'm a bit of an experimenter

Yeah, that's quite a lot and I think it's difficult to assess how it works if it's a complex or like a multi-vitamin.

Me, it's just B3 (Niacinamide) & Taurine.

Soon to follow for me will be B1, but I still have to see it for myself how other forms would feel like (Allithiamine is a pass for me at the moment).

Yes, I highly suggest this for athletes (especially MMA and those who deadlift) and anyone that has back pain. Core stability through stiffening (instead of crunching/bending) is a real game changer that I wish I knew a lot earlier. Helps heal back injury but also prevent injury.

Yeah, I'm actually doing it now with resistance bands (but still figuring out how to optimally use the bands with each movement).

But most likely, I'll just be doing it without the bands as it just takes more time to set things up.

 

[skuabird]

Started a log here - Skua's Weightloss and Health Problems Log

 

[mamakitty]

Thanks for your reply! Yeah, I think that's good advice... I have had estrogen dominance symptoms for a long time too, but I didn't get into it in the op. One of my ovaries was removed early on as it had an enlarged cyst. I looked into taking progesterone a long time ago but it seemed pretty hard to get in Canada, I'd probably have better luck in the US. But yeah, I think focusing on food first is a good idea. I'll check out that book too.


Thanks! I was carnivore for about 2 years and the person who posted in the carnivore group was around the same (~2 yr)- I wonder if that's a common time for the wheels to start falling off for many?

That’s very interesting they had your ovary removed for a cyst. I don’t think that’s a good thing. The medical establishment literally just views everything in silos.
Anyway, many things are hard or impossible to find in Canada. I used to see progesterone cream on amazon up until a year ago, I never bought it because I read fear porn from mainstream science. Now, there’s no progesterone on amazon, even wild yam root cream is unavailable. Instead they heavily push oestrogen creams.

 

[mamakitty]

@CLASH

- I just listened to both of your videos and your video with Jay Feldman caught my attention.
- About the 'Strong Sistas' being able to lower their Cholesterol by around 300 or so by just doing a Pro Metabolic way eating.
- In my case, I never really knew what my Lipid Profile was when I was doing Keto/Carnivore (close to 5 years).
- I only knew it after a year of doing my approach to 'Peating'.

- Right now, I'm getting this familiar Keto Liver inflammation again and could only suspect that it's due to my almost 2 months of consecutively eating Eggs.
- So I'll probably stop eating Eggs and maybe supplement Choline instead (most of them are Soy based, so I'm like what else could there be)?
- Anyway, thanks for the videos they're really informative.

@equipoise

- You mentioned that you gained a bit of weight in the beginning, it's good that that's the only thing that happened (or are there others)?
- 'Cause in my case (in 2019 when I started adding Carbs again), I was getting lethargic and my lips would go pale.
- Asides from that, I'm getting water retention quite easily.
- The feeling is as if my body is rejecting Carbs for some unkown reason, but definitely it's a full blown Insulin Resistance.

@skuabird

- In regards to Serrapeptase (&/or other Systemic Enzymes), I couldn't be so sure yet about using it would help Eye Floaters.
- 'Cause I've been using Systemic Enzymes for about 4 years now, mainly for my Pulmonary Fibrosis (due to having Chronic Bronchitis in childhood).
- And I think all those lung issues I had when I was a kid was due to the Root Canals that I had... that's just my close guess.
- So far the Systemic Enzymes surely helped my Fibrosis, kind of like close to none as of the moment.
- Also now I've only been dosing it for maintenance, unlike back then when I had to take the Therapeutic Dose.
- Just cause the Fibrosis I had bothers me I lot when I'm training.

- Also I've re-read your supplements (the Original Post), I don't think Calcium Supplements should be taken?
- But from what I've heard, the best form of Calcium Supplements would be Carbonate or Lactate (I've heard it from a guest in the Thermo Diet Podcast).
+ you could also watch it on YouTube, the title is "The Thermo Diet Podcast Episode 73 - Healing Bones With Theresa and Loren".
- Also, if I remembered correctly I think Georgi uses Calcium Carbonate -- so I guess it's safe to use Calcium Carbonate since Georgi uses it... hahaha.

- As with Probiotics and other Fermentables ('cause you mentioned Kefir), I think it's a no go in the Ray Peat community.
- Since they say it's better to have a Sterile Gut rather than adding these Pre & Pro Biotics in your system.
- I actually want to do a short stint of using Anti-Biotics, just like how Danny Roddy says in one of his videos.
- But I'm not yet fully commited, so I'll park that idea for now.
- There's also others that say Spore Based Probiotics work (so I'm like which is it, Probiotic or Antibiotic?), but I find it expensive; so I'll just go with Anti-Biotics...

- Also I've read on top that you're Anemic, maybe that's just lack of Copper.
- Try listening to Matt Blackburn with Morley Robbins (and others), that's where I got the idea.
- Actually I'm also slightly Anemic (which was 4 months ago), so I've made sure that I consume Beef Liver and just Beef (instead of: Chicken, Pork, etc.) everyday.
- 'Cause prior to that I wanted to do a Phelbotomy, but they're requiring me to get an Iron Panel first.
- And came out that I was actually Anemic and not suited for any Phelbotomy to be done.
- And of course I was given an "Rx Iron" supplement right after... hahaha.
- I was also asked to get an Ultra Sound in my Abdomen, to check if there's any Blood leaking from my Bones.
- In my mind it was just added expense, so I gave it a pass.
- But my 'theory' on why I was Anemic, probably was due to some Arthosclerotic Plaque that probably got ruptured due to some Physical Activity.
- And that Arthrosclerotic Plaque(s) & Rupturing was most likely from doing Keto/Carnivore for years; along with Extended Fasting & OMADs.
- But again, that's just my close guess.

- As with supplementing Taurine, I've only been taking after hearing that it counter acts Tryptophan.
- And Tryptophan drive Serotonin Production.
- And Serotonin causes Fibrosis (if I got it right).
- And Tryptophan is abundant in meats.
- So I've been taking it everytime I get large amounts of meat for that meal.
- As with Glycine, I forgot its exact Mechanistic Effects (I think it inhibits Neuro Excitation?) but I've heard from Georgi that...
+ you can get away with daily consumption of meat if you:
* supplement with Niacinamide which counteracts Phosphate
* also Taurine (as mentioned above)
* also Gelatin, due to its Glycine content
* also Milk due to is Calcium content which counteracts Phosphate
* Vitamin-E & Aspirin, for its mitigating mechanisms in regards to the cons

- Also I forgot to mention that I also take Policosanol (for lowering Cholesterol / PUFA Displacer they say) & Shilajit (for its Fulvic Acid)

- As with the diet I'm in, I never go past 35g of Fat.
- Most of the time it's just under 30g of Fat.
- Kind of like Reverse Keto...
- Maybe your husband is doing the same thing.

- And as far as Satiatey is concerned, it's the Skimmed Milk that helps (for me to say the least).
- I still get Milk Farts though... that's why I wanted to try some Anti-Biotics.

- And yeah, I just remembered Jessica Ash Wellness.
- She has a really great course and it's mainly catered to women.
- Maybe you can find her info more appealing.

- And lastly, I don't know if you're already using a Rebounder.
- But using it all through out the day helps a lot with General Fitness (ie. Lymphatic Flow, etc).
- I actually use it: before start of day, as a warm-up, after training... and I'm probably over doing it, but it's great.
- Also hanging on a pull-up bar, maybe that'll help your back.
- And also trying an Inclined Bed Therapy, been doing that for 3 months now and it's a great way to sleep.
- Kind of unusual at first, but it kind of feels nice afterwards.

Hi, how’s your cholesterol now? Did policosanol work?

 

[danishstargazer]

Ex vegan, ex vegetarian , ex keto , ex carnivore , ex bulimic , ex stoner , ex food restrictor here. After years of Peat -ish eating and getting off the hamster wheel of supplements and freakouts ... ( and feeling much better ) here is what I suggest. Ditch ALLLLL restriction, ( except massive PUFA and possibly gluten ) ditch alllll supplements , and start over. Eat whatever you crave when you crave it. Get basic labs done and don't go willy nilly taking huge Vit D doses and and hormones until you know your levels. Take at least 3 months of eating like you did when you were a kid and didn't care. Move your body like you did when you were a kid , only doing what you wanted. No " working out " . Get your sleep and get your sun. THEN... after about 3 months, re-asses your situation. I don't think it hurts to know your blood type either so get that while you get a basic set of labs. Even though you know your numbers after you get the labs, STILL dont take supplements and STILL eat and drink whatever you want . Then re test. I am a bit older than you so I am going full ham on you right now , trust me , stop the madness.

 

[Sefton10]

Ex vegan, ex vegetarian , ex keto , ex carnivore , ex bulimic , ex stoner , ex food restrictor here. After years of Peat -ish eating and getting off the hamster wheel of supplements and freakouts ... ( and feeling much better ) here is what I suggest. Ditch ALLLLL restriction, ( except massive PUFA and possibly gluten ) ditch alllll supplements , and start over. Eat whatever you crave when you crave it. Get basic labs done and don't go willy nilly taking huge Vit D doses and and hormones until you know your levels. Take at least 3 months of eating like you did when you were a kid and didn't care. Move your body like you did when you were a kid , only doing what you wanted. No " working out " . Get your sleep and get your sun. THEN... after about 3 months, re-asses your situation. I don't think it hurts to know your blood type either so get that while you get a basic set of labs. Even though you know your numbers after you get the labs, STILL dont take supplements and STILL eat and drink whatever you want . Then re test. I am a bit older than you so I am going full ham on you right now , trust me , stop the madness.

This is good advice. I’ve learned that hitting the full supplements/hormone regimen that many of us fall into is a fools errand without basing on labs. It’s hard to know which is doing what (if anything) and we get even further away from our intuitive sense of what we “need”. Sometimes even tracking on cronometer can be detrimental as eating becomes like a game of Tetris instead of tuning into what we crave. Too many of us here are eating/taking what we feel we should as opposed to what improves the way we “feel”.

 

[mamakitty]

Ex vegan, ex vegetarian , ex keto , ex carnivore , ex bulimic , ex stoner , ex food restrictor here. After years of Peat -ish eating and getting off the hamster wheel of supplements and freakouts ... ( and feeling much better ) here is what I suggest. Ditch ALLLLL restriction, ( except massive PUFA and possibly gluten ) ditch alllll supplements , and start over. Eat whatever you crave when you crave it. Get basic labs done and don't go willy nilly taking huge Vit D doses and and hormones until you know your levels. Take at least 3 months of eating like you did when you were a kid and didn't care. Move your body like you did when you were a kid , only doing what you wanted. No " working out " . Get your sleep and get your sun. THEN... after about 3 months, re-asses your situation. I don't think it hurts to know your blood type either so get that while you get a basic set of labs. Even though you know your numbers after you get the labs, STILL dont take supplements and STILL eat and drink whatever you want . Then re test. I am a bit older than you so I am going full ham on you right now , trust me , stop the madness.

Wow excellent advice!