Neurological Symptoms, TSH, Copper

[dfspcc20]

Ray Peat, via email, suggested my neurological symptoms could be due to spinal cord inflammation. Main symptoms are: occasional numbness/pins-and-needles on side of left arm (upper and forearm), left thigh, calf, heel, poor activation of postural muscles on left side, less sensation on left side in general, stiffness on left side of neck when turning head to right. See a theme with the left side? These symptoms have been present at some level most of my life, but have become more obvious the past 5 years or so, but really aren't affecting quality of life so much yet.

He suggested my highish TSH (2.1) could be the cause, and/or low copper.

What lowers TSH? I know T4 and/or NDT, but what else?

My temps have always tended low with diet alone, but I am able to get them up with methylene blue and aspirin. For example, with ~300mcg methylene blue, 150mg aspirin, and plenty of light, my temps get to 98.8F most of the day. Pulse is usually 75-80 range. So I'm not sure adding T4 or NDT would be wise.

As for copper- I eat shellfish 4-5x/week, and cooked mushrooms 3-4x/week. So I think I should be getting enough as intake. Are there any reliable tests to check copper levels? Or what else might be interfering with that?

Any other thoughts or similar experiences? My symptoms seem to point to a spinal stenosis (could be from a car accident many years ago or other head injuries), but Ray seemed to write that idea off.

 

[Gone Peating]

Ray Peat, via email, suggested my neurological symptoms could be due to spinal cord inflammation. Main symptoms are: occasional numbness/pins-and-needles on side of left arm (upper and forearm), left thigh, calf, heel, poor activation of postural muscles on left side, less sensation on left side in general, stiffness on left side of neck when turning head to right. See a theme with the left side? These symptoms have been present at some level most of my life, but have become more obvious the past 5 years or so, but really aren't affecting quality of life so much yet.

He suggested my highish TSH (2.1) could be the cause, and/or low copper.

What lowers TSH? I know T4 and/or NDT, but what else?

My temps have always tended low with diet alone, but I am able to get them up with methylene blue and aspirin. For example, with ~300mcg methylene blue, 150mg aspirin, and plenty of light, my temps get to 98.8F most of the day. Pulse is usually 75-80 range. So I'm not sure adding T4 or NDT would be wise.

As for copper- I eat shellfish 4-5x/week, and cooked mushrooms 3-4x/week. So I think I should be getting enough as intake. Are there any reliable tests to check copper levels? Or what else might be interfering with that?

Any other thoughts or similar experiences? My symptoms seem to point to a spinal stenosis (could be from a car accident many years ago or other head injuries), but Ray seemed to write that idea off.

Yea it’s probably left over damage from your accident or other injuries. Peat can be pretty stubborn thinking everything is the result of thyroid or estrogen imbalance.

Have you tried applying methylene blue topically to the areas of concern and spine/neck?

 

[mangoes]

Have you checked b12 ya?

 

[Aaron]

Could be unilateral psoas overactivation/diaphragmic underactivation. Most people have some degree of this, and it distinctly compresses some of the spinal discs and limits neck turning in one direction. Do you have any occipital neuralgia?

 

[dfspcc20]

Yea it’s probably left over damage from your accident or other injuries. Peat can be pretty stubborn thinking everything is the result of thyroid or estrogen imbalance.

Have you tried applying methylene blue topically to the areas of concern and spine/neck?

I suppose most people have blinders to some extent. No, haven't thought of applying MB topically. That'd leave an interesting mark on my upper neck.

Have you checked b12 ya?

No. Does that seem warranted? Intake should be sufficient with dairy, egg yolks, shellfish. No other obvious symptoms of low B12.

Could be unilateral psoas overactivation/diaphragmic underactivation. Most people have some degree of this, and it distinctly compresses some of the spinal discs and limits neck turning in one direction. Do you have any occipital neuralgia?

Perhaps, never heard of it before, but seems possible. I can get cramps near the occipital region (left side again), if I overdo something like chin tucks.

 

[Diokine]

The left side of the body is typically associated with activity of the sympathetic nervous system. This is a broad generalization but will help in analysis. Chronic irritation in the intestines can refer up the nervous system, through the phrenic and vagal nerves, and can significantly alter autonomic nervous activity through over activation of NMDA, etc. The broad scope of your issue indicates that this is likely the case. Essentially the structures maintaining the timing of your autonomic nervous system have organized towards a pattern of excessive activity.

This excessive sympathetic activity will indeed utilize copper at a high rate. Additionally, irritation in the small intestines (neurogenic or locally mediated) can greatly decrease the ability to absorb and properly utilize copper. GABA activity will be decreased, glutamatergic excitation will be increased, cholinesterase will be decreased.

Chronic, subliminal fungal infections, viral activity, circadian disruption, nnEMF exposure, and chronic hyperinsulinemia will all contribute.

How is your digestion? Do you get enough iodine? Have you experimented with ascorbic acid supplementation? Sunlight?

 

[dfspcc20]

The left side of the body is typically associated with activity of the sympathetic nervous system. This is a broad generalization but will help in analysis. Chronic irritation in the intestines can refer up the nervous system, through the phrenic and vagal nerves, and can significantly alter autonomic nervous activity through over activation of NMDA, etc. The broad scope of your issue indicates that this is likely the case. Essentially the structures maintaining the timing of your autonomic nervous system have organized towards a pattern of excessive activity.

This excessive sympathetic activity will indeed utilize copper at a high rate. Additionally, irritation in the small intestines (neurogenic or locally mediated) can greatly decrease the ability to absorb and properly utilize copper. GABA activity will be decreased, glutamatergic excitation will be increased, cholinesterase will be decreased.

Chronic, subliminal fungal infections, viral activity, circadian disruption, nnEMF exposure, and chronic hyperinsulinemia will all contribute.

How is your digestion? Do you get enough iodine? Have you experimented with ascorbic acid supplementation? Sunlight?

Interesting. Thanks!

Digestion: lately good. 1-2 BMs/day, easy to pass, solid, well-formed, rarely get gas. Tended to be looser, flaky in past, never constipated. Too much fruit & OJ seems to bring that on quickly. Cut way back on that and that doesn't appear to be an issue. No issues with obvious indigestion or heartburn. Gently palpating on relaxed abdomen sometimes does find tender spots that usually can be massaged away.

Iodine: shellfish & milk should, in theory, be sufficient (in Peat world, anyway). Occasionally do a homemade mouthwash with iodine, which gets spit out. Other than that, not sure.

Ascorbic Acid: started with Allergy Research Group Liposomal C a couple weeks ago, mainly because I'm not getting as much OJ. Maybe 150-200mg/day.

Sunlight: plenty, or red light when cloudy. Also have a Sperti that I occasionally use in winter.

What would you recommend for testing for low-level infection?

 

[mangoes]

No. Does that seem warranted? Intake should be sufficient with dairy, egg yolks, shellfish. No other obvious symptoms of low B12.

well I dunno about the left side in particular, I think it’s usually bilateral but I think neurological symptoms like peripheral neuropathy warrant a check on your b12 levels for sure. Dietary intake doesn’t matter if there’s a problem with absorption so yeah. It may well not be related to b12 but worth checking still

 

[dfspcc20]

well I dunno about the left side in particular, I think it’s usually bilateral but I think neurological symptoms like peripheral neuropathy warrant a check on your b12 levels for sure. Dietary intake doesn’t matter if there’s a problem with absorption so yeah. It may well not be related to b12 but worth checking still

I'll ask about getting B12 tested next blood work. I don't have peripheral neuropathy, though, so not sure if it'll warrant coverage from insurance.

 

[mangoes]

@dfspcc20 Edit: oh yeah I see now you get it all the way up your thigh

 

[Diokine]

What would you recommend for testing for low-level infection?

Not sure. A blood test including CBC and WBC may be diagnostic.

How are your teeth? Infection in the jaw can cause many issues.

Are you sleeping well?

Do you have issues with allergies? Do they cycle with any regularity? How is sinus congestion?

How is your skin?

Do you get enough selenium? Vitamin E?

Have you had any occupational exposure to aluminum or other metals?


Regarding iodine; Dr. Peat doesn't think supplementation is necessary or safe, but in my experience some cases respond very well to mild supplementation of potassium iodide - especially neurological issues. I think maternal iodine intake and maintenance during gestation may change patterns of deiodinases in the fetus and may predispose to thyroid issues and neurological issues. This is pure speculation but my intuition is pointing me this way. A few hundred mcgs once or twice week spread out over a few weeks may be diagnostic.

Glutamic acid decarboxylase catalyzes the transformation of glutatmate to GABA, and disregulation of this system is indicated in nearly any pathology. Cyclic changes in cytosolic pH from respiration and cellular metabolism work to finely tune this system to maintain neurological structures in the brain. Pyridoxine and lower pH encourage the activity of glutamic acid decarboxylase. I might supplement with pyridoxine or pyridoxal-5-phosphate and experiment with bag breathing and observe feelings while doing so.

Please understand I'm not a doctor and none of this is medical advice.

EDIT: Biotin deficiency is also indicated in cases of neuropathy.

Biotin enrichment in oligodendrocytes in the rat brain.

Cytochemical localization of endogenous biotin in the rat brain was detected by two different staining methods, avidin-biotin-HRP and goat-anti-biotin with HRP-rabbit-anti-goat. In both staining methods, oligodendrocytes were labeled to a far greater degree than other brain cells. This finding may be important for identification of the role of carbonic anhydrase, which is elevated in the oligodendrocyte, and it may help to explain how the oligodendrocyte generates large quantities of lipids for myelin production.

Biotin Is Endogenously Expressed in Select Regions of the Rat Central Nervous System

The vitamin biotin is an endogenous molecule that acts as an important cofactor for several carboxylases in the citric acid cycle. Disorders of biotin metabolism produce neurological symptoms that range from ataxia to sensory loss, suggesting the presence of biotin in specific functional systems of the CNS.

 

[dfspcc20]

@Diokine Thanks again for another thought-provoking response.

Things like sleep and skin have been long-standing issues for me, but have been improving greatly of late. Maybe because of normalizing temps with MB, aspirin and vitamin C. And making more effort to get enough zinc (via oysters).

Seasonal allergies have gone away entirely since cutting back on vitamin A ~2 years ago. Not strict; just no supplements and liver. Maybe a vitamin D, E and/or zinc connection there.

Gums have been in great shape. No inflammation or bleeding. Have had a couple cavities come up dispute that though, which have been filled. Though I don't have any root canals or anything like that, so not sure how likely jaw infections might be.

Selenium (via shellfish) and vitamin E (via Tocovit) should be good, on paper anyway.

Don't think there's been occupational aluminum exposure (I work in IT), other than childhood vaccines in the past (which can be significant, I know...)

Interesting on B6 and biotin. I do take Energin regularly, but might experiment with either of those in greater amounts. I've been shying away from B6 in general since many here have advised it can increase serotonin, and have seen other stuff on the web that as supplements it can cause neuro issues. But the true method of knowledge is experiment.

Will consider iodine as well.

 

[Elize]

How do you make the iodine mouth wash? How often do you do it and what does it help for?

Thanks for sharing.

 

[dfspcc20]

How do you make the iodine mouth wash? How often do you do it and what does it help for?

Thanks for sharing.

3-4 drops of 2% Lugols solution in a shot glass full of salt water, then gargle ~30 seconds and spit. No idea if I'm doing that right or if it's helping anything. :)

 

[Elize]

I found out that iodine is a Histamine liberator and activate mast cells when ingested. I will try the month wash and see if I have any reaction. Thanks for letting me know