Need help debunking or confirming- Study claims reduction in cognitive performance due to wearing masks, and their increase in CO2.

Perry Staltic

Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2020
Messages
8,186
Since you are on the Ray Peat forum, doesn't it make sense to read some Ray Peat?

Well I do, but honestly I can't follow him for very long before my eyes glaze over and my mind shuts down. His communication style - sort of stream of consciousness, rambling, professor-speaking-to-class, pastor-preaching-to-congregation - is something my mind is simply not able to endure when it comes to technical matters I'm trying to learn. It's just not the way I learn.

He said something very interesting, though, in a podcast that I heard before I came here, and it was only after coming here that I realized it was him in that podcast. He claimed that low CO2 in mechanical ventilation air caused inflammation and mentioned that carbogen (5% CO2) would remedy that. I have tried to verify his claim that CO2 is anti-inflammatory, but have not been able to do so. That's another problem I have reading his stuff: for me learning requires a chain of authority based in verifiable data and facts.

btw if anyone knows where I can find that podcast please let me know. I would love to hear it again.
 

Collden

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2012
Messages
630
Several studies suggest that inhalation of plastic micro-particles can cause neurotoxicity. I wonder if any of the so called "long hauler" syndromes, which include neurological symptoms, are actually caused by wearing these plastic masks all the time?

 

Giraffe

Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
3,730
He said something very interesting, though, in a podcast that I heard before I came here, and it was only after coming here that I realized it was him in that podcast. He claimed that low CO2 in mechanical ventilation air caused inflammation and mentioned that carbogen (5% CO2) would remedy that. I have tried to verify his claim that CO2 is anti-inflammatory, but have not been able to do so. That's another problem I have reading his stuff: for me learning requires a chain of authority based in verifiable data and facts.

btw if anyone knows where I can find that podcast please let me know. I would love to hear it again.


Ray Peat is referring to the work of Yandell Henderson. He has talked about him in several podcasts, and many of them have been transcribed. The quote below leads you to one of them.


It is a highly significant fact, as revealed by experiment, that in order to induce pneumonia in dogs it is not enough merely to introduce the pathogenic organisms into the lungs ; it is essential also to narcotize the animals so deeply that the cough reflex is abolished and respiration is depressed. In general, depressed or shallow breathing tends to permit the development of pneumonia, and deep breathing with full ventilation of the lungs tends strongly to inhibit it."

... and CO2 makes you breathe deeper.

Then you may want to check the posts of user @md_a regarding Henderson's work.
 

Regina

Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2016
Messages
6,511
Location
Chicago
Technically, these is truth to this because elevated CO2 is sedating (possibly through increased GABA and lower cortisol). It is not a coincidence that CO2 breathing was used decades ago as treatment for seizures. Nowadays, anti-seizure drugs have replaced CO2 breathing and virtually all of them are sedating. The effects of breathing CO2 for extended period of time are not unlike those of a hefty dose of progesterone, and you can find many studies showing higher dose progesterone makes people sleepy and impairs cognitive performance while the sedation lasts. However, after sedation wears off cognitive performance increases above baseline due to the improved brain oxygenation from progesterone/CO2.
That's interesting. Ray recently said something like that when he improved thyroid function, he didn't need to do too many things at once. I'm noticing that while I sleep more, my work is mistake-free. Yet, I might get snickers from people who pride themselves at getting up at the crack of dawn and run around multi-tasking. Yet, their work has to be re-done. And that pattern stays oblivious to the person running around creating chaos and messes everywhere.
 
OP
Philomath

Philomath

Member
Joined
May 23, 2013
Messages
775
Age
54
Location
Chicagoland
That's interesting. Ray recently said something like that when he improved thyroid function, he didn't need to do too many things at once. I'm noticing that while I sleep more, my work is mistake-free. Yet, I might get snickers from people who pride themselves at getting up at the crack of dawn and run around multi-tasking. Yet, their work has to be re-done. And that pattern stays oblivious to the person running around creating chaos and messes everywhere.
I’m finding good sleep makes a big difference in just about everything - but as you get older, going to bed early, or getting up later seems increasingly difficult.
 

schultz

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2014
Messages
2,653
Well I do, but honestly I can't follow him for very long before my eyes glaze over and my mind shuts down. His communication style - sort of stream of consciousness, rambling, professor-speaking-to-class, pastor-preaching-to-congregation - is something my mind is simply not able to endure when it comes to technical matters I'm trying to learn. It's just not the way I learn.

He said something very interesting, though, in a podcast that I heard before I came here, and it was only after coming here that I realized it was him in that podcast. He claimed that low CO2 in mechanical ventilation air caused inflammation and mentioned that carbogen (5% CO2) would remedy that. I have tried to verify his claim that CO2 is anti-inflammatory, but have not been able to do so. That's another problem I have reading his stuff: for me learning requires a chain of authority based in verifiable data and facts.

btw if anyone knows where I can find that podcast please let me know. I would love to hear it again.

He mentions something about CO2 and inflammation in the article below. You'd have to follow-up on his sources to see what the papers actually say.

"Carbon dioxide is being used increasingly to prevent inflammation and edema. For example, it can be used to prevent adhesions during abdominal surgery, and to protect the lungs during mechanical ventilation. It inhibits the formation of inflammatory cytokines and prostaglandins (Peltekova, et al., 2010, Peng, et al., 2009, Persson & van den Linden, 2009), and reduces the leakiness of the intestine (Morisaki, et al., 2009). Some experiments show that as it decreases the production of some inflammatory materials by macrophages (TNF: Lang, et al., 2005), including lactate, it causes macrophages to activate phagocytic neutrophils, and to increase their number and activity (Billert, et al., 2003, Baev & Kuprava, 1997)."

Edit: Actually one of the studies sort of suggests it would be useful in mechanically ventilated patients, which seems relevant to COVID. They cite 8 different sources... I didn't follow up on them though.

"Although hypercapnia can be controlled by increasing respiratory rate (33), there is evidence to suggest that hypercapnia may be beneficial in the prevention of, and recovery from, lung injury (6, 15, 16, 18, 19, 3032)."
 
Last edited:

Perry Staltic

Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2020
Messages
8,186
He mentions something about CO2 and inflammation in the article below. You'd have to follow-up on his sources to see what the papers actually say.

I have tried to access those papers, but have not been able to.
 

rei

Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2017
Messages
1,607
cognitive performance is affected by how alert you are. If you are normally low co2 and then increase it for significant periods, you will get less alert, more relaxed and don't perform as good on many kinds of tests. This is NOT same as living at altitude and adapt to high CO2, or same as doing breath work, exercise etc. to intermittently increase CO2 as an exercise.

If the only thing masks did was increase CO2 they could be good "endurance exercise" but since they do many other negative effects i don't think they are good "hormetic equipment"
 
Back
Top Bottom