NDT vd Synt. T3 with Rt3 in the higher range

[Bodhi]

Hello,

I'm reading allot about using NDT or T3 only when u are Hypothyroid..

Now my questions is this :

My averige TSH is around 5
T4 around 13
Free T 3 within range on the higher side
reverse T3 within range on the higer side

From what i understand so far is that with T3 only "therapy" one can use this to lower Reverse T3 so that
T3 will be better getting into the cells..

If this happens can this also lower my TSH?

What would happen with the T4 from the NDT ?

I prefer to use NDT but i'm not sure if it can help me lowering Rt3

Thanks for shining your light...

Bodhi

 

[answersfound]

I had a bad experience with NDT. The t4 was converting to rt3 and my doctor put me on Cytomel. I would stick to t3 only. before ndt my tsh was 2ish, after ndt it went up to 4.

ndt sounds good in theory, but t3 works a lot better in my experience.

 

[youngandold]

I used to have naturally high Free T3 and borderline low Free T4 and it feels like hell.
Your body needs T4 to be ok.

Levothyroxine dose needs to be increased to consistently bring FT4 to the top of the range.
If Ft3 is low then add selenium to help t4 to t3 conversion.
ONLY then you can add T3.

RP never suggested T3 only.
He said that SOMETIMES T4 isnt properly converted to T3
You are automatically assuming you are one of these rare non converters.

Rt3 doesnt block or bind to T3 receptors.

 

[Jooce_user]

I used to have naturally high Free T3 and borderline low Free T4 and it feels like hell.
Your body needs T4 to be ok.

Levothyroxine dose needs to be increased to consistently bring FT4 to the top of the range.
If Ft3 is low then add selenium to help t4 to t3 conversion.
ONLY then you can add T3.

RP never suggested T3 only.
He said that SOMETIMES T4 isnt properly converted to T3
You are automatically assuming you are one of these rare non converters.

Rt3 doesnt block or bind to T3 receptors.

Can you describe the high t3 feeling in more detail? Thanks

 

[tara]

Hi Bodhi,
Peat has said that the optimal ratio of supplementary T3 and T4 varies from person to person, but usually in the range 1:2 - 1:4 of T3:T4. Some people do fine on T4 only, if their system is good at the conversion - seems youngandold is fortunate to be one of them. Selenium is one of the requirements for the conversion, but there are several others, too. Deficiency in any of them can slow it down.

TSH of 5 + hypothyroid symptoms seems high enough to consider supplementing.
The key concern Peat seems to have with current NDTs is that he is not aware of a reliable well-standardised product. But there are several people here who say they have benefitted greatly from NDT.
If you have access to separate synthetic T4 and T3, that allows you more control to experiment with quantities and ratios. This seems to be what Peat favours.

But I wonder if high rT3 indicates that the body is deliberately keeping metabolism down because it is short on some resources?
Do you want to mention what/how much you are eating? Have you run it through cronometer or similar to see if you are covering basic nutrition? Ignore cronometers calorie recommendations - they are usually too low.

WHatever you decide to try, please start small and take it slowly. T4 has a long half life, so it can take more than 2 weeks at a steady dose to reach stable blood levels. So you should wait at least [edit to correct:] 2 weeks, preferably 3 or 4, before incrementing T4. T3 has short half life of a few hours. Even 1mcg can have a significant effect (healthy body produces 3-4mcg/hr). Peat has suggested trying a tiny nibble of T3 (I'm guessing that means 1-2mcg) as needed, up to every hour or two, and using T4 or combo T3/T4 at night.

post 109988 RP never suggested T3 only.
He said that SOMETIMES T4 isnt properly converted to T3
You are automatically assuming you are one of these rare non converters.

I agree that Peat does not usually recommend T3 only.
I don't know why you think the conversion issue is so rare. There seem to be a large number of people who do much better on T3+T4 than on T4 only. Maybe they are a minority, I don't know - but not a trivial one.
In this particular case, it does look as though T3 is not low, though, so some conversion is happening. This makes me suspect other factors promoting rT3.

post 109988 Rt3 doesnt block or bind to T3 receptors.

What do you think it does? I thought this was its main function - block/limit some of the effect of T3 when the body judges there is too much of it?

 

[youngandold]

Nope.
Read Pubmed studies.
rT3 doesn't bind or block receptors.
In fact hyperthyroid peopel (like me) have rT3 levels several fold above normal yet hyperthyroid symptoms continue.

rT3 is made when the body senses excess thyroid whatever the reason and makes rT3 just to get rid of T4 thus preventing it from forming T3.

 

[Giraffe]

post 110362 Nope.
Read Pubmed studies.
rT3 doesn't bind or block receptors.
In fact hyperthyroid peopel (like me) have rT3 levels several fold above normal yet hyperthyroid symptoms continue.

Can you provide such pubmed studies? (Please studies not a link to a blogger's website.)

(By the way, Ray Peat does not believe this receptor theory.)

post 110362rT3 is made when the body senses excess thyroid whatever the reason and makes rT3 just to get rid of T4 thus preventing it from forming T3.

Also high cortisol downregulates the TSH, and it "causes the liver to turn thyroxin to rT3 which interferes even more than thyroxin with the active T3 function." -- RP

A caller asked about TSH and T4 supplements. It starts around the 44 minutes mark.
KMUD: 10-16-15 Current Trends on Nitric Oxide