Natural DHT & Testosterone Maximization Through Peating

[Jsaute21]

I Wanted to get some opinions on the most sure fire ways to raise DHT & T both through diet and supplementation. I know that dopamine maximization along with serotonin elimination are keys. Any proven ways to conquer this puzzle would be beneficial. Below are some ways in which i have personally managed to get T to a healthy level. @Such_Saturation @haidut @jaywills @pboy @burtlancast You all seem to have educated opinions on the topic. I am specifically looking for ways to raise dopamine/lower serotonin and cortisol.

• Adequate carbohydrate intake. (At least 200 G sugar and usually 50-75 g starch per day).
• Adequate protein intake. (120-170 G). I weigh 196.
• Adequate saturated fat intake with low to moderate monounsaturated fat.
• Have sex often
• Avoid a calorie deficit, especially on active days.
• Occasional caffeine use through USP Labs pills and coffee/espresso. (I find it best not every day for cortisol reasons).
• Gelatin use with any muscle meats.
• Upped Goat milk or decent quality 1% intake.
• tocovit, energin, boron, magnesium oil, supplementation. (What others)?
• Strength train 2-3 x a week.

 

[Jsaute21]

Any thoughts on this?

 

[milk_lover]

Never heard of Peat recommending boron, do you know why you're taking it?

Starch can actually increase serotonin which you don't want.

Panasterone seems like a good option maybe?

 

[Jsaute21]

I know starch isn't the best but I am pretty damn lean and strength train very intensely 2-3x a week. I have cut back in starches already but am not ready to eliminate potatoes or white rice. They have been proven to be hormonally beneficial for those who train.

Is panasterone a hormonal supplement? I am very unversed in thyroid medication and other hormonal supplements

 

[TheHound]

I know starch isn't the best but I am pretty damn lean and strength train very intensely 2-3x a week. I have cut back in starches already but am not ready to eliminate potatoes or white rice. They have been proven to be hormonally beneficial for those who train.

Is panasterone a hormonal supplement? I am very unversed in thyroid medication and other hormonal supplements

so far I'm having good results with haidut's pansterone and androsterone. More energy in the gym and surprisingly my head hair and facial hair is much softer. Skin is also clearer too

 

[tyler]

Haidut has recently keyed me in to some studies that showed that high dose vitamin k2 (mk4) doubled the t levels in rats. It worked directly on the gonads, prompting them to use the raw materials and convert to T. Similar to the pituitary hormones, so this should work for people suffering from secondary/central hypogonadism. If you google "vitamin k testosterone rats" a few articles and studies will come up.

In my own experience, small daily pieces of liver give me the greatest androgenic/dopaminergic response.

 

[TubZy]

Look at the scientific study section, haidut has done a lot of research on this. Some suggestions:

Glycine/gelatin (higher doses especially)
Pregnenolone
DHEA
T3
All the fat soluble vitamins
Niacinimide
Methyelene blue
Caffeine/coffee
Taurine
BCAA and tyrosine combo
Aspirin
11 keto dht
Androsterone

Peat's work in general is all pro metabolic, pro DHT , pro T etc. since its anti estrogen, prolactin, cortisol and serotonin. So anything he suggests either has a good effect on hormone production (DHT/T)either upstream or downstream.

 

[beachbum]

Look at the scientific study section, haidut has done a lot of research on this. Some suggestions:

Glycine/gelatin (higher doses especially)
Pregnenolone
DHEA
T3
All the fat soluble vitamins
Niacinimide
Methyelene blue
Caffeine/coffee
Taurine
BCAA and tyrosine combo
Aspirin
11 keto dht
Androsterone

Peat's work in general is all pro metabolic, pro DHT , pro T etc. since its anti estrogen, prolactin, cortisol and serotonin. So anything he suggests either has a good effect on hormone production (DHT/T)either upstream or downstream.

Hi TubZy

How ironic you said RP is pro t and anti estrogen which I figured and mentioned myself, so it wasn't my imagination. That is way I feel if I eat like RP suggest I get high testosterone / dht and I am female. I have question you may be able to answer. Testosterone makes estrogen correct. Well how would I lower T and E while I am currently upping my progesterone which is helping. As of now I added selenium and it is making feel pretty good. I am wondering if dht and aromatase inhibitors would not be a good idea.

Thank you

 

[lexis]

RP recommends Vitamin A and thyroid for upping T

 

[Fearlessgolfer]

Look at the scientific study section, haidut has done a lot of research on this. Some suggestions:

Glycine/gelatin (higher doses especially)
Pregnenolone
DHEA
T3
All the fat soluble vitamins
Niacinimide
Methyelene blue
Caffeine/coffee
Taurine
BCAA and tyrosine combo
Aspirin
11 keto dht
Androsterone

Peat's work in general is all pro metabolic, pro DHT , pro T etc. since its anti estrogen, prolactin, cortisol and serotonin. So anything he suggests either has a good effect on hormone production (DHT/T)either upstream or downstream.

Great info. Thanks. Following.

 

[tobieagle]

In my own experience, small daily pieces of liver give me the greatest androgenic/dopaminergic response.

I made the same observations and it makes sense.
Vitamin A, Vitamin K2 and cholesterol.

 

[TubZy]

Hi TubZy

How ironic you said RP is pro t and anti estrogen which I figured and mentioned myself, so it wasn't my imagination. That is way I feel if I eat like RP suggest I get high testosterone / dht and I am female. I have question you may be able to answer. Testosterone makes estrogen correct. Well how would I lower T and E while I am currently upping my progesterone which is helping. As of now I added selenium and it is making feel pretty good. I am wondering if dht and aromatase inhibitors would not be a good idea.

Thank you

Yes, T either converts to DHT or estrogen.

How come you want to lower T? Excess cortisol, prolactin and serotonin all suppress T so when you lower either or all of them it should boost your T.

As a male, progesterone was tricky for me I don't use it though.

To lower E, any of the fat soluble vitamins works especially K2, A and E. I use all of them I definitely notice a decrease in estrogen.

 

[Jsaute21]

@milk_lover Boron is an excellent supplement for increasing free Testosterone. You can get it through raisins, prunes or dates, but supplementing it works well too.

 

[milk_lover]

@milk_lover Boron is an excellent supplement for increasing free Testosterone. You can get it through raisins, prunes or dates, but supplementing it works well too.

In nuclear power plants, we use the soluble boron to control excess reactivity because it's a stronger absorber of neutrons. So in a sense, it acts like a poison to neutrons. That's why I was surprised that it can increase free testosterone. Maybe the increase in T will convert to estrogen? I noticed any sudden increase in T actually increases my estrogen.

 

[TubZy]

In nuclear power plants, we use the soluble boron to control excess reactivity because it's a stronger absorber of neutrons. So in a sense, it acts like a poison to neutrons. That's why I was surprised that it can increase free testosterone. Maybe the increase in T will convert to estrogen? I noticed any sudden increase in T actually increases my estrogen.

Same here, I tried boron in then past and felt nothing sometimes even worse. It's touted a lot on some forums for its T boosting ability like anabolic men but I never noticed anything from it personally- just my experience

 

[milk_lover]

Same here, I tried boron in then past and felt nothing sometimes even worse. It's touted a lot on some forums for its T boosting ability like anabolic men but I never noticed anything from it personally- just my experience

Thanks for sharing your experience, TubZy. Has Peat ever talked about it? I am curious.

 

[allblues]

Peat quote on boron and elaborations here; Boron—Essential To Ray Peat Health?

 

[TubZy]

Peat quote on boron and elaborations here; Boron—Essential To Ray Peat Health?

Well I guess haidut pretty much summed it up which is why I probably felt worse on it.

"Boron is HIGHLY estrogenic. The bodybuilding community was crazy about it in the 1990s, but then they found out first hand that it raises estrogen (I think all 3 types) and dumped it. Boron has similar effects to cadmium, nickel, cobalt, etc and they are all estrogenic and carcinogenic in higher doses.
Peat is right that unless you aredeficient you'd better not mess with it. See below for a study in men.

The effect of boron supplementation on its urinary excretion and selected cardiovascular risk factors in healthy male subjects

"...Supplementation with 10 mg B/d for 4 wk resulted in 84% of the supplemented dose being recovered in the urine. Plasma estradiolconcentrations increased significantly as a result of supplementation (51.9±21.4 to 73.9±22.2 pmol/L;p<0.004) and there was a trend for plasma testosterone levels to be increased. However, there was no difference in plasma lipids or the oxidizability of low-density lipoprotein Our studies suggest that the absorption efficiency of B is very high and estimation of the urinary B concentration may provide a useful reflection of B intake. In addition, the elevation of endogenous estrogen as a result ofsupplementation suggests a protective role for B in atherosclerosis."

 

[beachbum]

How come you want to lower T? Excess cortisol, prolactin and serotonin all suppress T so when you lower either or all of them it should boost your T

Hi TubZy,

Actually the progesterone cream lowers all that you mentioned above. My problem is I have high dht and I don't like that because I breakout and excess hair ( Face- chin mostly) not good for a girl ..haha.. Now correct if I am wrong. . Dht is what get converted to estrogen with aromatase, something like that. Bottomline is I want high progesterone to estrogen of course we need some estrogen. As for testosterone it self I am not sure of its process. I need to keep acne and facial hair away. What othet process does testosterone make. I tried reading a chart put not sure of its works. I was told my progesterone/estrogen ratio was way off. Its getting better if I don't try RP ways all the way. Sorry if I was rambling.

 

[Jsaute21]

Interesting stuff here @milk_lover @TubZy. I have never felt bad on it, and actuall have Low estradiol levels as is. @TubZy is right that Anabolic Men preaches it as a god send for testosterone. Boron: The Anti-Estrogen Mineral Also Found To Lower SHBG Naturally | Anabolic Men