Natural Bodybuilding Competition With RP's-style Diet

[encerent]

Would some of RP's foods and supps give me an advantage if I were to diet down for a bodybuilding show?

Severe calorie restriction, and lifting heavy (at least) 4 times won't be avoidable if you want to get down to 6% body fat or even lower, while maintaining good muscle mass.

But if instead of chicken, rice and broccoli and exhausting cardio, I did some of the familiar things on this forum:

Foods:
Protein: 0% milk + gelatin and occasional ruminant muscle meat.
Carbs: OJ and fruit
Fat: coconut oil and occasional cheese and dairy.

Supps:
A, K, D, E, taurine and niacinamide, coffee, magnesium, etc. Bathing in red light, bag breathing.

Wouldn't this stuff keep my stress hormones relatively low, and androgens high despite (severe) calorie restriction and allow me to slay the competition??

 

[Herbie]

Ive thought about this myself.

I know that bodybuilders do use t3 when preparing for competitions.

Tom Platz a famous body builder was known for having a diet of eggs, beef, milk, cheese, coffee and ice-cream.

I think that using anabolic steroids is protective for their muscle mass during the restrictive diets they do before competition.

 

[superhuman]

Of course, its easy. Just set up your calories and macros and choose the RP foods that fits your needs. This is not rocket science

 

[mirc12354]

Would some of RP's foods and supps give me an advantage if I were to diet down for a bodybuilding show?

Severe calorie restriction, and lifting heavy (at least) 4 times won't be avoidable if you want to get down to 6% body fat or even lower, while maintaining good muscle mass.

But if instead of chicken, rice and broccoli and exhausting cardio, I did some of the familiar things on this forum:

Foods:
Protein: 0% milk + gelatin and occasional ruminant muscle meat.
Carbs: OJ and fruit
Fat: coconut oil and occasional cheese and dairy.

Supps:
A, K, D, E, taurine and niacinamide, coffee, magnesium, etc. Bathing in red light, bag breathing.

Wouldn't this stuff keep my stress hormones relatively low, and androgens high despite (severe) calorie restriction and allow me to slay the competition??

Ray Peat diet and supplements help but I would not bet on them to defy the world class genetics (ideal body proportions for example, great symetry, etc.), years of training (that "mature" muscle look) or drug use.

 

[Velve921]

Epsom salt baths and androsterone would be on my list if I were choosing to compete; before bed time would help avoid tissues breakdown, keep stress hormones low, and maintain sleep while low fat dieting.

 

[schultz]

I started lifting again recently. Last time I lifted was like 5 years ago or more and I have not done any lifting while doing the Peat stuff until now.

There used to be this "rule" that you shouldn't take NSAID's if you wanted to heal from your workouts or whatever. I guess the idea is that you need the prostanoids to promote rebuilding of the damaged muscle. From a Peat perspective I suspect this may be flawed reasoning, especially since prostanoids are made from AA. Apparently these prostanoids are what is mainly responsible for delayed onset muscle soreness (DOMS).

I think aspirin would be beneficial for bodybuilding. It lowers prostaglandin, aromatase, FFA and cortisol. Testosterone is increased during weight training but so is cortisol. Cortisol has a direct connection with aromatase activity.

I'm not sure if the increase in Testosterone during lifting is because of the anabolic effect or because of a thickening of the blood caused by the exercise and fluid retention of the muscles. Take this quote for example from Ray...

“The reluctance to see something as simple as the swelling of a muscle when its energy is depleted, has led into other unnecessary confusions. For example, the water that the muscle takes up comes from the blood. The blood gets thicker, and is harder to pump. The loss of water from the blood makes it seem that hormones have increased, when actually they have decreased. If the tissues could be re-energized, they would release some of their water back to the blood.”

In regards to lifting, this could be the "pump" one gets when they lift hard. Aspirin thins the blood and I feel like this would be of benefit to combat the thickening of the blood that Ray is talking about. Admittedly, I don't have a great understanding of this stuff lol.

Another thing that I have been thinking about, and that may also be perceived as counter productive by the mainstream, is using red light directly after a workout. I think post-workout red light would help prevent damage to the mitochondria from the eccentric parts of the lifts, like the lowering portion of a barbell squat.

Mushrooms, OJ and carrot for lowering of aromatase.

Lots of sugar peri-workout to help lower cortisol and prevent stress reaction.

Cortisol is what causes the catabolism of muscle during caloric restriction, so you really want to keep this low. Androsterone would be helpful, but I don't know the rules for a natural competition. Is it like the Olympics where you're "allowed" to take steroids as long as your blood levels of androgens are below a certain limit? Do they even check blood in these competitions, or is it some sort of honour system...?

 

[paymanz]

For those "unavoidable calorie restrictions" i would limit my fat intake rather than carbs as much as possible. If it is for short term then I think it doesn't hurt your fat soluble vitamins status.

I would even reduce some protein intake and replace it with carbs.if your protein intake is realy high like most bodybuilders.

 

[tca300]

No. Severe caloric restriction is extremely stressful irregardless of diet and or supplements taken.

 

[Koveras]

Would some of RP's foods and supps give me an advantage if I were to diet down for a bodybuilding show?

Severe calorie restriction, and lifting heavy (at least) 4 times won't be avoidable if you want to get down to 6% body fat or even lower, while maintaining good muscle mass.

But if instead of chicken, rice and broccoli and exhausting cardio, I did some of the familiar things on this forum:

Foods:
Protein: 0% milk + gelatin and occasional ruminant muscle meat.
Carbs: OJ and fruit
Fat: coconut oil and occasional cheese and dairy.

Supps:
A, K, D, E, taurine and niacinamide, coffee, magnesium, etc. Bathing in red light, bag breathing.

Wouldn't this stuff keep my stress hormones relatively low, and androgens high despite (severe) calorie restriction and allow me to slay the competition??

No. Severe caloric restriction is extremely stressful irregardless of diet and or supplements taken.

Fructose May Help Control Post-Exercise Cravings - Almost 30% Reduced Desire to Eat After 1h Low-Intensity "Cardio" - SuppVersity: Nutrition and Exercise Science for Everyone

Fructose as a Dieting Tool: 100g Fructose Per Day Exert Sign. Protein Sparing Effects & Ameliorate the Decline in Thyroid Hormones During Starvation Diet in the Obese - SuppVersity: Nutrition and Exercise Science for Everyone

 

[tca300]

@Koveras Very cool for fructose, but We need to remember that obese sedentary women injected with Fructose might not have the same effect as it would on a full grown man with extra muscle, engaging in very strenuous physical effort for months, not a few days. I have dieted down to 6% body fat using a "Pure" Peat diet. It is LESS stressful for certain, but it was very unpleasant and very stressful nevertheless. I would expect a simular experiance with others who have actually done this before.

 

[tyw]

We should note that at the extremes of body fat percentage, the body is likely functioning at the edge of balance.

For example, if one is carrying a lot of body fat, one is likely to face estrogen dominance, while in cases of extreme leanness, estrogen is below normal levels -- adipose tissue has a significant effect on this balance. Lyle McDonald gives some commentary regarding this Leptin and Estrogen balance here -- http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/re...d-leptin-signalling-in-the-hypothalamus.html/

In 99.99% of cases, where stress is high and body fat is higher than bodybuilding levels, it is "too much leptin" and "too much estrogen" that is the problem. In cases of being super lean, the balance can shift the other way, especially with Leptin (where you have barely enough leptin, and the body thinks that it is starving most of the time).

All the re-feeding type protocols that people use are all an attempt to trick the body into thinking that it shouldn't be panicking despite being super lean. Again, I'll direct people to Lyle's articles on this subject, specifically, the ' Set Points, Settling Points and Bodyweight Regulation' series, and then the 'Bodyweight Regulation: Leptin' series.

One of the oddities that has been noted between the genders is that Male brains seem to respond more to Insulin, while Female brains seem to respond more to Leptin -- Gender differences in the control of energy homeostasis. - PubMed - NCBI

In the context of re-feeding, both are useful, and both respond to Glucose. In that context, I view Fructose as useful only insofar as it maintains liver glycogen, but with extra (more insulin-stimulating) glucose being more responsible for the ability to get to and maintain low body fat.

Personally, I keep to a moderate to low fructose intake (TBH, anywhere from 25-70g a day), and then a very high glucose intake, and have managed to maintain low body fat fairly easily for quite some time now (at least 1.5 years, which is indicative that systems are not crashing).

As usual, no recommendations made Experiment and figure out what works.

.....

 

[superhuman]

The better the thyroid the lower the bodyfat % you can maintain healthfully.

But yeah like tca300 said getting down to those bodybuilder level is never healthy. Also most of the people that do alot of training and want to get lean etc have no idea what it takes and also think they are "stage ready" when they have 20 lbs of more fat to loose. Most people think they are way leaner then they are and they think its way easier to get down there then it is.

 

[Insaneacinamide]

DNP and Thyroid are DR.Peat approved

 

[superhuman]

DNP and Thyroid are DR.Peat approved

done them both, its still hard tho

 

[papaya]

@Koveras Very cool for fructose, but We need to remember that obese sedentary women injected with Fructose might not have the same effect as it would on a full grown man with extra muscle, engaging in very strenuous physical effort for months, not a few days. I have dieted down to 6% body fat using a "Pure" Peat diet. It is LESS stressful for certain, but it was very unpleasant and very stressful nevertheless. I would expect a simular experiance with others who have actually done this before.

wow! how many calories did u eat a day? can u please share exactly what foods u ate?

 

[tca300]

@papaya I started at 3000 and slowly lowered as weightloss would intermittently stop and ended up at about 2300 per day, depending on how long I walked that day. Same foods as I eat now and have been for a long time, 1% and skim milk, fruit, fruit juice, liver, gelatin, coffee, carrot, and hydrogenated coconut oil. The foods aren't magical, they help keep the metabolism going and therefore allow more to be eaten when losing weight. I have several friends who drop down to about 4-6% every year eating McDonald's and other trash, but they have to eat a lot less than me to get there.

 

[Orion]

hydrogenated coconut oil

Where do buy? online?

 

[tca300]

Where do buy? online?

Yup, there is a thread on here about sources.

 

[papaya]

@papaya I started at 3000 and slowly lowered as weightloss would intermittently stop and ended up at about 2300 per day, depending on how long I walked that day. Same foods as I eat now and have been for a long time, 1% and skim milk, fruit, fruit juice, liver, gelatin, coffee, carrot, and hydrogenated coconut oil. The foods aren't magical, they help keep the metabolism going and therefore allow more to be eaten when losing weight. I have several friends who drop down to about 4-6% every year eating McDonald's and other trash, but they have to eat a lot less than me to get there.

thank u! it's very impressive that u have the discipline to do that, i'm so jealous lol. i need to start eating liver!

 

[Westside PUFAs]

I view Fructose as useful only insofar as it maintains liver glycogen, but with extra (more insulin-stimulating) glucose being more responsible for the ability to get to and maintain low body fat.

Personally, I keep to a moderate to low fructose intake (TBH, anywhere from 25-70g a day), and then a very high glucose intake, and have managed to maintain low body fat fairly easily for quite some time now (at least 1.5 years, which is indicative that systems are not crashing).

Sounds like a starch endorsement by twy. I tend to agree. Starch aka glucose = low body fat*

* so long as it's not a delivery vessel for polyunsaturated cooking/condiment oil, monounsaturated olive oil and/too much saturated dairy fat like butter, sour cream and cheese. ;PUFAs, Westside, pufa university press, 2016.,.


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