My Journey To Optimal Health

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Cirion

Cirion

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When I first started Peating, I ate Applegate Farms' beef hotdogs with maple syrup, cooked chicken breast, scallops, fried and scrambled eggs (scrambled was like a sponge) in maple syrup, drenched my potatoes in maple syrup and drank maple milk. I would eat an old boot if it were covered in maple syrup...well, a pleather one anyway. :) Do you like garlic? I liked mixing some garlic powder and sea salt with the maple syrup in my meat and potato dishes.

Interesting... that's lots of maple syrup lol. The master cleanser diet recommends lots of maple syrup, and also lemonade/limeade/salt water.

I actually haven't had garlic in a while. Sounds like an interesting combination though.
 
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Cirion

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Got some more quality sunlight.

Gonna try a fast from solid foods this weekend to see how it improves my health/weight. I'd definitely like to drop some pounds. I'm basically gonna do the master cleanser today and tomorrow, with a few mods (like today I'm allowing myself some milk and OJ which I think are technically not allowed on MC), but also doing alot of other MC stuff like maple syrup & lemon/limeade. Also trying some baking soda/apple cider vinegar combo.

No limit to intake, just no solid foods, and no dietary fat either.
 
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Jennifer

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Interesting... that's lots of maple syrup lol. The master cleanser diet recommends lots of maple syrup, and also lemonade/limeade/salt water.
It's the Canadian genetics. I'm made of 70% maple syrup so a lot is required to replenish my stores. :D

The past few days I've been getting a half hour of sun in the morning and another half hour in the afternoon and it's doing great things!

I hope your cleanse is going well! I don't do full cleanses, but I do incorporate cleansing drinks in my diet. Mine is a mix of lemon and Thai coconut water. My body really appreciates all the alkaline minerals and my liver and skin in particular love the lemon.
 
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Cirion

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Well speaking of maple syrup, I had LOTS over the weekend.

The cleanse was an interesting experience. Not sure for sure if it was beneficial, but I was constantly hungry/pounding down lemon/maple syrup all day. I did notice a few times that my heart rate and temperatures seemed kinda high. At one point my HR hit around 100 bpm.

I don't think I'm going zero fat again though, even for just a day or two cleanse - last night I was so hungry for fat I crushed a whole pint of ice cream lol... Maybe one day at most, two was too much I think for me anyway. I could tell my stress hormones were starting to go up even with lots of carbs by the second day, if I skipped on the fat, so that's no good. Every time I try to go low fat even just temporarily my body resists, I seem to need around a minimum of 60-100g of fat a day to function.

Good job on the sun - I try to take at least one walk break outside at work myself, and get sun on the weekends at the park.
 
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Jennifer

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Thanks! :) I'm taking on a nice shade of visibility so there's progress. Haha!

LOL I guess you really did need some fat. I find I do best with at least a pound of young coconut meat or a large avocado daily, which is roughly 30g of fat so I'm thinking that's similar to you since I require half the calories you do?

Even if fat may slow down detoxing, it doesn't stop it completely. Our eliminative systems are always cleaning house. One way I check is through kidney filtration. I still have sediment in my urine while including the coconut and avos in my diet. Plus, fat acts as an antacid in the lymphatic system (a lipid based system) which is where the majority of toxins are – think of it as the sewer system of the body. And again, the fats we eat aren't chemically processed and rancid, which I believe makes a big difference.

Anyhow, I think it's smart that you're listening to your body instead of trying to force it. :)
 
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Cirion

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Yeah I definitely don't believe in forced deprivation anymore. I figure I can get most of the benefits by having the detox drinks alongside my normal foods.

I decided to quit all my supplements as an experiment and see what happens. I will be careful to try to get all my nutrients from foods so I don't get deficient in anything.

I'm still honestly rather confused about the optimal fat intake VS carb intake, and the randle cycle, and sexdrive/libido.

I find that I need plenty of carbs to avoid brain fog/fatigue/recover from workouts/avoid random aches and pains. On the other hand, dietary fat seems to be the drive for my libido and not carbs. if I go zero fat, I have almost zero libido (even if carbs are high).

An example, this morning I had some chocolate which is generous in saturated fats... felt immediate boost lol. In particular, seems like saturated fats are the driver (which makes sense, based upon all the benefits talked about on these forums from SFA's)

On keto, when I was averaging upwards of 300g fat a day (sometimes even 350), my libido was INSANELY high, the highest its been on any diet I've ever followed (including Peat). The only thing that was bad (and the reason why I decided to quit it) was that my workouts were not that great, muscles always flat, but most of all I had lots of chronic aches and pains. I wonder if its because I had lots of PUFA in my keto diet though.

Sometimes I still wonder if keto may indeed be the right diet for me (but eliminating PUFAs). But then, Ray peat seems to resonate with me, which is why I'm still doing it and giving it a shot. For me, libido is an indirect indicator of overall health though, so hard to say if what I'm doing is the right thing or not for sure currently.

And then I think about the randle cycle, and wonder, and get confused all over again - because deep down I really do think insulin sensitivity is the key to good health - but then why is my libido lower? It's not dead, to be clear, but it's definitely a lot weaker. I would say maybe a 5/10-6/10 at best, whereas at times on Keto my libido was a 8,9, and sometimes even a 10/10 (out of respect for people here I won't go into details... but read Haidut's 1500 testosterone post, and that's probably not far off from how I felt lol), and I miss it... will it ever come back to this level on the RP style of eating? And then, I wonder, if eating High fat is so great for the sexdrive, then why is it also bad for you in terms of insulin resistance + obesity/diabetes?

I get that maybe I'm just still somewhat of a fat metabolizer which is just a fancy way of saying I have some insulin resistance. When my insulin resistance fully goes away, will things restore themselves? Or is it that some people simply must eat lots of dietary fat due to irreversible genetics and will never metabolize carbs like they can fats? A few members here do report success on very high fat intake (Kreese eats like 60% calories from fat, and one other member, whose name escapes me, probably has a similar %)

Again to be clear I think overall I'm feeling better with the carbs, better moods/energy and so forth. But I still just feel like something is... missing.

Could it be that we just don't need more than around 400g carbs (which is what RP eats, and also is about the maximum amount even an athletic body can store in glucose), and should eat the rest of our calories in fats to keep hormone production up?
 
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Jennifer

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Are you positive your insanely high libido while following keto was due to high T production and not stress? I remember Ray saying that excess estrogen can cause an insatiable appetite for sex or something like that. I think excess serotonin/gut irritation can contribute to it, as well.

I don't believe in irreversible genetics, just weak tissues that need regenerating but setting aside that, the randle cycle, needing over 400g of carbs (Someone said we need over 400g carbs?), supposed insulin resistance, diabetes and obesity from high fat, let's look at what we do know?

You are neither diabetic nor obese, you feel better with lots of carbs and enough saturated fat in your diet, you ate chocolate, a perfect mix of sat. fat and sugar, and your libido went "Hello!" and I think the same happened with coffee(?) so what do you feel is missing? Just the insanely high libido?

It doesn't sound like your libido can't rise to the occasion. I couldn't find haidut's testosterone post so I'm not sure what you mean by insanely high, but I'm thinking you mean the typical signs for men that point to a healthy libido such as the ones you experienced after adding coffee to your diet?

I just thought of something – you experienced an immediate boost in libido after having coffee and chocolate, only one high in sat. fat but both stimulants. Does your blood pressure tend to run low? You've mentioned issues with carb metabolism, adrenalin and then a confidence boost with coffee – could your adrenal(s) be a little weak?

If so, maybe it just comes down to time for you and not anything you're missing? If you were only getting worse, I would question if your current approach is right for you, but you seem to be seeing improvements and it has been my experience that feeling immediate improvements doesn't mean my body is done healing up.

Another thing I just thought of – were you with your ex-girlfriend most of the time you followed keto? If so, maybe being around someone whom you had chemistry with helped stoke the fire? You felt a boost when chatting with that girl at the grocery store, right?

I meant to ask you, did you end up finding oysters that aren't in a can? If not, below is a company I've had saved since my time following a WAPF diet. The oysters come frozen:

https://www.vitalchoice.com/product/frozen-pacific-oysters-shelled-12-oz

I also had these companies saved. The oysters come in glass:

Buy Extra Small Quillcene Oysters in Jars Online

Shucked Oysters

Oh, and do you have a Trader Joe's near you? I bought some of their freeze dried fruit yesterday and find it pretty addicting. They have a nice crunch to them. The blueberries remind me of blueberry pie flavored crunch berries and the mango reminds me of sweet puffed cheese doodles. :)
 
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Cirion

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I feel like I took a step backwards yesterday, had trouble sleeping and woke up fatigued with dark circles under my eyes (this has been a chronic problem for me most of my life). Hard to say if it was the PUFA's or too much protein - had lots of protein, as well as eggs (PUFAs), and cheese (lots of tryptophan). I guess not enough carbs to balance all that out?

Are you positive your insanely high libido while following keto was due to high T production and not stress? I remember Ray saying that excess estrogen can cause an insatiable appetite for sex or something like that. I think excess serotonin/gut irritation can contribute to it, as well.

I've had more than one member suggest this, and perhaps it is part of it, but I don't think it is the full picture, because I feel like for the most part I was fairly healthy, felt good, didn't need a ton of sleep, good moods, high libido, etc etc. In addition, on keto typically your SFA intake is very high, which means the body has a healthy amount of cholesterol (upwards of 2000-3000+ mg a day on a day I might have had an insane amount of eggs on) to work with to create T.

I don't believe in irreversible genetics, just weak tissues that need regenerating but setting aside that, the randle cycle, needing over 400g of carbs (Someone said we need over 400g carbs?), supposed insulin resistance, diabetes and obesity from high fat, let's look at what we do know?

Well the problem is, since starting peat, I have done well over 400g of carbs every single day. If I don't, fatigue creeps in. This morning in fact I felt especially groggy, with dark circles under the eyes etc, despite 600+g carbs yesterday. If I force myself to restrict to 400g of carbs, it's only gonna be worse. I wonder if part of this is that I just can't handle caffeine/stimulants. Many members around here just say this means you need to tough it out because it improves, and that caffeine improves fatty liver disease etc... but I wonder if some people, like myself, just shouldn't have much/any stimulants. I think all the caffeine yesterday may have been why I had some issue with sleep. On many occasions I have as much as 800-1000g of carbs (as you may have seen on some of my other posts in this thread). Just seems insane lol. As I write this I wanna just go back to bed even after having 400 mg caffeine...

You are neither diabetic nor obese, you feel better with lots of carbs and enough saturated fat in your diet, you ate chocolate, a perfect mix of sat. fat and sugar, and your libido went "Hello!" and I think the same happened with coffee(?) so what do you feel is missing? Just the insanely high libido?

Yeah. Like, I've experienced what a truly high and what I consider optimal libido feels like. For a man, it gives us the confidence to succeed as well as the confidence to pursue & talk to / ask out a random girl (I don't have this confidence normally without it, it really does alter your brain chemistry a lot lol). I think it's one of nature's way of making sure that only healthy men procreate & pass on genes.

It doesn't sound like your libido can't rise to the occasion. I couldn't find haidut's testosterone post so I'm not sure what you mean by insanely high, but I'm thinking you mean the typical signs for men that point to a healthy libido such as the ones you experienced after adding coffee to your diet?
Yeah pretty much. He was talking about how he felt good all the time.

I just thought of something – you experienced an immediate boost in libido after having coffee and chocolate, only one high in sat. fat but both stimulants. Does your blood pressure tend to run low? You've mentioned issues with carb metabolism, adrenalin and then a confidence boost with coffee – could your adrenal(s) be a little weak?
My blood pressure is usually a little high usually, though not insanely, averages around 130/60-70. Was 128/65 or something last time it was checked.

If so, maybe it just comes down to time for you and not anything you're missing? If you were only getting worse, I would question if your current approach is right for you, but you seem to be seeing improvements and it has been my experience that feeling immediate improvements doesn't mean my body is done healing up.

Maybe, but then I wonder why I feel like this week I've taken backwards steps? I'm wondering if I'm just allergic to a lot of foods I eat. How can I know if I'm allergic to a specific food, if it's not immediately obvious? I still feel like I have lots of chronic bloating and what not. That combined with the dark circles under the eyes, seems to indicate chronic gut problems / allergies to foods.

I wonder if I just had too much protein yesterday though, I'm wondering if too much protein in general causes the dark circles. I had like 75g more protein yesterday than I had been getting the past few days and a fairly protein heavy dinner, which could certainly contribute to night time blood sugar problems. I'm thinking carbs + fats should be ideal in the evening, not so much protein..

Another thing I just thought of – were you with your ex-girlfriend most of the time you followed keto? If so, maybe being around someone whom you had chemistry with helped stoke the fire? You felt a boost when chatting with that girl at the grocery store, right?
I wasn't actually. I was single at this time. I did feel a boost, but not as high as other periods in my life like keto. Let's put it this way... on keto my drive was so high that I found 50+ yr old women & women with body types other than my "normal type" as attractive as "ideal body type" 20-30 yr olds (not meaning that to be offensive, but I am only 31 and normally find myself attracted to those my age or younger).

I meant to ask you, did you end up finding oysters that aren't in a can? If not, below is a company I've had saved since my time following a WAPF diet. The oysters come frozen:

https://www.vitalchoice.com/product/frozen-pacific-oysters-shelled-12-oz

I also had these companies saved. The oysters come in glass:

Buy Extra Small Quillcene Oysters in Jars Online

Shucked Oysters

Oh, and do you have a Trader Joe's near you? I bought some of their freeze dried fruit yesterday and find it pretty addicting. They have a nice crunch to them. The blueberries remind me of blueberry pie flavored crunch berries and the mango reminds me of sweet puffed cheese doodles. :)

I found oysters in a plastic container, maybe not the greatest, but oh well. I do have a trader joe's - haven't been to one lately though. Thanks for the finds! I do have a trader joe's but I haven't been to it in a while.
 
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Cirion

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Most definitely a blood sugar problem. I'm fine now after pounding a lot of OJ. Seems like I need to make sure I don't exceed around 150g protein a day, and try to have at least a 4:1 carb:protein ratio. I was at around 225g protein and 575g carbs yesterday, which was only around 2.5:1.

I often notice too (as was the case last night) that I woke up in the middle of the night with a "4 am depression". I often find myself brooding about negative things in the middle of the night. Probably also blood sugar problems... I'm getting to where I really dread night time now. I can not seem to make it through the night without blood sugar problems.

Bloat remains excessive and annoying though.
 

Jennifer

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Did you happen to get blood work during that period you followed keto? It certainly sounds like you do best with having both saturated fat ad carbs in your diet. I don't think there is anything wrong with needing 400g of carbs or more, I just thought it was odd that your source implied we all need 400 or more grams, or maybe I misunderstood you.
Yeah. Like, I've experienced what a truly high and what I consider optimal libido feels like. For a man, it gives us the confidence to succeed as well as the confidence to pursue & talk to / ask out a random girl (I don't have this confidence normally without it, it really does alter your brain chemistry a lot lol).
That makes sense.

Oh, good! It doesn't seem like an adrenal weakness with a BP of 130/60-70 (ideal being 120-130/60-70).

Yeah, you could be allergic or sensitive to something you're eating given the bloating or maybe not digesting something well. Do you have a white coating on your tongue?

Mm...yeah, the extra protein could have been the cause, particularly in the evening. Too much in the evening always meant a poor night's sleep for me.
I wasn't actually. I was single at this time. I did feel a boost, but not as high as other periods in my life like keto. Let's put it this way... on keto my drive was so high that I found 50+ yr old women & women with body types other than my "normal type" as attractive as "ideal body type" 20-30 yr olds (not meaning that to be offensive, but I am only 31 and normally find myself attracted to those my age or younger).
No, I totally get it. For a time while taking high doses of Progest-E, my libido was rather non-discriminating, too. That was 4 years ago so I was around your age and I found it difficult to be in public because practically every man I saw that wasn't elderly, turned me on. My libido is healthy, but it takes more than being male to inspire it. lol Funny, I hated it. I found it frustrating.
Most definitely a blood sugar problem. I'm fine now after pounding a lot of OJ. Seems like I need to make sure I don't exceed around 150g protein a day, and try to have at least a 4:1 carb:protein ratio. I was at around 225g protein and 575g carbs yesterday, which was only around 2.5:1.

I often notice too (as was the case last night) that I woke up in the middle of the night with a "4 am depression". I often find myself brooding about negative things in the middle of the night. Probably also blood sugar problems... I'm getting to where I really dread night time now. I can not seem to make it through the night without blood sugar problems.
Ah, well there you have it! Ignore what I said above. lol The same thing happens to me, even the 4am depression (mine is mainly low grade anxiety attacks mixed with a lifetime of cr*p that I could swear I let go of years ago lol) if I don't get enough fruit carbs.
 
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Cirion

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Ah I did not mean that everyone should have 400g carb, just suggesting that seems to be a normal "max range" number for most healthy non hypo thyroid (males, at least) but that most hypo people like myself seem to need way more. I find it crazy that I can be upwards of 1000g carbs given that that's about the amount that 300 lb professional strongman competitors have a day... lol.

I guess I need to make sure I get most/all of my protein earlier in the day, and not exceed too much. I personally don't find high libido frustrating in fact I crave it - because it makes me awesome at everything (and not just at flirting lol). I found it also made me ultra productive at work and anything I set my mind to, and more sociable etc also euphoric moods in general.

Isn't it annoying how the mind can make you think ridiculous things when your blood sugar is low? When I was younger it truly put my mind in a dark place almost 24/7, constantly beating myself stuff up, telling myself I'm worthless, stupid, all sorts of negative/dark junk. Now I realize though that was all just superficial and just because my health was in the garbage can due to LOTS of stress (mostly self imposed through perfectionist tendencies).

I wonder if I have SIBO or something and need to focus on less fermentable foods for the bloat, and maybe also increase my carrot intake to several a day.
 

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Gotcha. I find it crazy, too, and it's something I've been wondering for a long time now. I follow this raw (mostly) vegan bodybuilder on YouTube who is built (IMO) and he eats less calories than I do and I'm not even a 100lbs.

Well, you're not the first guy to say that so maybe it's a guy thing. Or maybe I'm just strange, which I'm leaning towards since that's nothing new for me. lol

Ha, yes! I relate to all of that. I've made a lot of progress with talking myself out of believing the negative thoughts about myself when they come up, but it would be nice to not have to do it or at least, not as frequently as I do now. On the plus side, I now recognize when it's happening instead of just owning them as truth.

Yeah, it wouldn't surprise me given the diet you're coming from. After fracturing, I was put on the WAPF diet by my doctor at the time and she was fairly anti carbs, even from fruit, and had me on no more than 100g of carbs a day and for years after dropping the diet, I was fighting a pretty nasty overgrowth.
 
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Cirion

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That bodybuilder you follow more than likely is massively hypo, from what little you have told me. Being built/lean does not mean healthy, in fact, more often than not it means the opposite. Just about all the fitness competitors, fitness models, etc you see out there are horribly undernourished. I've been there and done it myself - I got to around 3-5% body fat, and almost killed myself (literally) in the process. I believe that even non-hypo females probably need at least 2500 calories a day and males need at least 3500 a day (very roughly, of course) and many need more than those numbers.

I still want to get back to being at least fairly lean (10% bf or so would be great), but be healthy while doing so, and not kill myself doing so. When I got to the 3% (it read like 3-4% on the hand held scanner) body fat I was eating like 1500-1800 calories a day, lifting weights 5-6 days a week intensely for 1-2 hrs, and doing HIIT for at least 3 days a week, was on essentially a zero fat diet, with only enough carbohydrates in the diet to not die of glucose deprivation (not kidding). I was running on pure stress hormones, so it was hard to sleep more than 6 hrs a night. The brain fog was intense...

https://www.siboinfo.com/uploads/5/4/8/4/5484269/sibo_specific_diet_food_guide_sept_2014.pdf

Looks like according to this, cottage cheese (especially with carrageenan) is a double evil. I was eating some cottage cheese the last week or so with carrageenan, and later without it, but even without it, seems like a big no-no if trying to avoid fermented foods. Sad. Maybe that's why I'm having problems - I'm eating cottage cheese nearly every day lately. Butter and ghee it is for dairy, I guess, lol.

Yeah the mood is something I am a lot more aware of now. When I find myself thinking negative thoughts, I catch myself and realize it usually means its time to eat some carbs or something.

Found a gem of a thread earlier.

Obesity Caused By Gut Flora

I really believe I've discovered a big piece of the puzzle for my health at least.

Too much endotoxin. The source of which I'm not 100% on yet, but it is likely exasperated by fermentable carbs in particular, and it sounds like heavy Iron intake is another factor as well.

So, I do think I'm on the right train of thought.
 
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Jennifer

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Yeah, that's what I suspected after he mentioned not being able to eat even one extra banana without gaining weight. He's open about his use of mushrooms and I wondered if that could also play a part – could they be messing with the glands?

2500 calories seems about right IME. I need about 2500, though since sunbathing daily, my appetite has been crazy and I wouldn't be surprised if I'm closing in on 3000. I can only imagine what your food bill looks like if the sun is having the same effect on you.

Oh my! Yeah, 3-4% body fat is crazy low and that was quite the regiment you had. I can see why you were having trouble with your workouts. On the plus side, you definitely seem to have determination which I believe will come in handy as you're healing.

I did some crazy things, too, like climbing mountains every weekend even when I was down to like 80lbs. In one of many attempts to get my weight up, my doctor sent me to a dietician who measured my body fat % with a special scale and it was in the 2-3% range.

Hmm...yeah, it could be that. I avoided starch, certain fibers, carrageenan and other gums, fermented/cultured foods, jams and even raw honey because they seemed to make overgrowth symptoms worse. For me, it ended up being due to the dairy, but I still have problems with certain fibers.

If you're still wanting cottage cheese, you could always make it? Because I couldn't find any without microbial enzymes, cultures or vinegar, I started making my own. I used lemon juice as a curdling agent and I recall a few members on here having good results with rennet.
 
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Cirion

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Cut out cottage cheese today and have noticeably less bloat after lunch this time.

I also seem to have significantly more energy this afternoon. Did not have a means to check my temperature, but I feel like I have been extra hot too. It's been pretty hot outside too though, so no doubt that's a factor as well. I know this is n=1 at this point, but it's good enough for me to start getting more serious about FODMAP. I had beef for lunch, which is still a bit heavy on the iron side, so I'll just make sure maple syrup becomes a serious staple in my life to mitigate its effects until I think of some bright ideas to get the protein and fats I need without iron.

Nice to see verification of my theories working out for me. Does suck that I will need to be harsh about restricting a lot of FODMAP though.

Chasing being lean while harshly restricting calories is a miserable existence - I won't be doing it again lol. Avoiding one banana for fear of gaining fat is definitely way too extreme lol.

I now believe a healthy gut is actually the #1 importance for maintaining health and lean-ness.

Haidut posted something awhile back saying that gut serotonin is the driver behind obesity. It all is starting to make sense now. It's not so much the foods you intake that matter (I mean, it does but...) rather how your gut reacts to them. Most people are eating stuff that is irritating to their system, and this drives serotonin/inflammation/stress hormones which in turn drives obesity.

Otherwise healthy people can eat a wider variety of foods without causing bacterial overgrowth, thus if you're healthy, you can get away with some "junk food".

However a heavy bacterial overgrowth will disturb your ability to absorb nutrients you intake, making you eat more than you need to, ultimately making you fat.

A stressful life (cortisol) probably exasperates the tendency for bacteria to grow. More stressful life = must be more strict about foods. Less stressful life = can probably be less strict.

I thought by merely lowering serotonin by limiting tryptophan, I could fix my gut. I still believe this is one factor, but the gut can increase serotonin even in the absence of dietary tryptophan I've since learned. A serotonin lowering diet must not only be low in tryptophan but also low in bacteria feeding foods.

Quitting supplements seems to have shown me my diet is deficient in magnesium. Getting some weird pains in my left hip in particular, and my legs in general seem excessively sore. May be time to try out that Epsom salt float pod this weekend...
 
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EIRE24

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Cut out cottage cheese today and have noticeably less bloat after lunch this time.

I also seem to have significantly more energy this afternoon. Did not have a means to check my temperature, but I feel like I have been extra hot too. It's been pretty hot outside too though, so no doubt that's a factor as well. I know this is n=1 at this point, but it's good enough for me to start getting more serious about FODMAP. I had beef for lunch, which is still a bit heavy on the iron side, so I'll just make sure maple syrup becomes a serious staple in my life to mitigate its effects until I think of some bright ideas to get the protein and fats I need without iron.

Nice to see verification of my theories working out for me. Does suck that I will need to be harsh about restricting a lot of FODMAP though.

Chasing being lean while harshly restricting calories is a miserable existence - I won't be doing it again lol. Avoiding one banana for fear of gaining fat is definitely way too extreme lol.

I now believe a healthy gut is actually the #1 importance for maintaining health and lean-ness.

Haidut posted something awhile back saying that gut serotonin is the driver behind obesity. It all is starting to make sense now. It's not so much the foods you intake that matter (I mean, it does but...) rather how your gut reacts to them. Most people are eating stuff that is irritating to their system, and this drives serotonin/inflammation/stress hormones which in turn drives obesity.

Otherwise healthy people can eat a wider variety of foods without causing bacterial overgrowth, thus if you're healthy, you can get away with some "junk food".

However a heavy bacterial overgrowth will disturb your ability to absorb nutrients you intake, making you eat more than you need to, ultimately making you fat.

A stressful life (cortisol) probably exasperates the tendency for bacteria to grow. More stressful life = must be more strict about foods. Less stressful life = can probably be less strict.

I thought by merely lowering serotonin by limiting tryptophan, I could fix my gut. I still believe this is one factor, but the gut can increase serotonin even in the absence of dietary tryptophan I've since learned. A serotonin lowering diet must not only be low in tryptophan but also low in bacteria feeding foods.

Quitting supplements seems to have shown me my diet is deficient in magnesium. Getting some weird pains in my left hip in particular, and my legs in general seem excessively sore. May be time to try out that Epsom salt float pod this weekend...
Check out Stan efferding the vertical diet. He has said he basis most of his work off peats writings.
 
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Cirion

Cirion

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Check out Stan efferding the vertical diet. He has said he basis most of his work off peats writings.



It seems he prefers steak to beef. That is interesting.

I say that because at the time I'd say my mood/libido may have been at around its highest point in my life, I ate very similar to this, had a lb of steak 3-4x a week. What is in steak that makes it so superior to beef?

He seems to like white rice a lot though. I'm not a huge fan of it. I'm guessing he doesn't ascribe to the philosophy that sucrose > glucose as white rice is pure glucose. I can understand why he promotes it though (easily utilized carbs). Many of his food choices I can support though looking through a Peat prism. White rice probably is not ideal for the main carb source for a non-athlete, since it is devoid of a lot of nutrients. I can kinda see why someone like him might prefer it though.

I do appreciate the simple approach to eating, the philosophy I can get behind in general. "Vertical eating" I'm actually trying to implement myself in my own diet - try to develop the optimal diet for nutrients with the minimum amount of effort possible (i.e., with like 10 or less unique foods).

Out of all "fad diets" out there though, this is probably one of the better ones.

Why is he a fan of the iron intake? That along with the rice are my main two questions. I am reading more and like most of what I see though.
 
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Jennifer

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Glad to hear you had less bloat after cutting out the cottage cheese. I was telling another member on here that I think my time Peating would have been much different had I left out the dairy and just stuck to eggs and shellfish as my main sources of protein.

Yeah, Ray places huge importance on the gut and preventing intestinal inflammation. This is one of the reasons he is cautious of supplements – he says they can contain contaminants/allergens. I had emailed him during the time I was struggling with the overgrowth and that's when he told me that starches are a common cause of it and intestinal inflamation, and that rice promotes gas. Maybe for those whose health is compromised, sprouted rice would be better tolerated since its complex sugars are broken down, but it seems to me that Ray would still recommend fruit over starch.
 
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The problem is I think ray peat's diet may be ideal: but with two major caveats.

1.) Only healthy people can seem to handle very high sugar low fat. Most people here aren't healthy especially starting off. For the rest of us, we need more saturated fats.
2.) A lot of the foods RP recommends are only OK if they are high quality (and many of us don't have access to high quality dairy, fruit etc).

The problem for most people (including myself) is all the additives in foods. I now stick to foods that have 3 or less ingredients (and 1 ingredient only, wherever possible), and avoid nasty additives like carrageenan, and if it does have multiple ingredients, understand what they all are and decide for myself if they are OK. My mom is a big nutrition nut too (she thinks I'm crazy when I told her about some of the stuff about RP lol). She told me about "foodbabe" and I may check out her book, she seems huge on avoiding the additives and GMO and all that. She has rated a lot of the commercial foods out there (in grocery stores, and restaurants) so that could be good to be sure I'm getting stuff that's good quality.

Supplements - currently still taking nothing, except I did add in magnesium glycinate the other day after I realized I was deficient. I'm now having blackstrap molasses which is high in magnesium though, so I may be able to ditch the supplement. I needed a quick fix because my muscles were kinda hurting. After several doses of this I feel better. I think I made the right choice quitting. It makes you more honest with your diet and is much easier to truly pinpoint deficiencies this way as well as what supplements actually are benefitting you. Blackstrap molasses was an amazing find - it seems like almost the perfect food. Calcium, magnesium, potassium, manganese all in one package. Just add sodium and it has just about all the minerals you need.
 
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Jennifer

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Healthy or not, I haven't seen where Ray says the ideal diet is low-fat. I've only seen where he has said that we don't know what the ideal percentage for each macro is, but thinks it could be roughly 33% for each, I think. If I'm not mistaken, one of the reasons Ray suggests milk and OJ is because they are available to most and affordable sources of quality nutrition.

Haha! Your mom sounds like my kind of lady. I totally agree that the additives in food are a problem. I've been reading labels since I was a child so it's second nature to me, but I can see it being overwhelming for those not used to it. If I couldn't understand or pronounce an ingredient, I wouldn't get the product before researching it.

I'm also one of those who, when not sure, will contact companies to find out the source of their ingredients right down to the kind of water used – if it's municipal etc. (was trying to avoid fluoride due to my bone disease). I visited local farms, the fishmonger, farmers' markets etc. and became friends with them as they loved talking about food as much as I did.

I sometimes think we have better options now than when we were kids because companies are now having to cater to all our allergies. lol I think the best we can do is to stick to simple, fresh (including frozen – fruit, veggies, seafood/meats with no additives) foods whenever possible like fruits, veggies, eggs and unprocessed seafood/meats. We're lucky in that we have the internet and can check ingredients, contact companies, find farms and farmers' markets in our area etc. A bit of a pain, but not nearly as much as disease IME.

Yeah, I totally agree! I think it's best to choose whole foods for nutrients unless there is a real need for supplementation. I used to consume a lot of blackstrap molasses during the time I followed RBTI (Reams' biological theory of ionization). RBTI is all about minerals, high Brix foods, and blackstrap was a favorite. We were also instructed to cover our pots when cooking to prevent minerals from escaping, that's how much minerals were valued by the one who developed RBTI (Carey Reams).
 

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