My friend is older and in need of help

[liber1]

Hi all,

My friend is in his mid 70s and has had a lot of health issues throughout the last 10 years or so, including two heart attacks. He has a pacemaker and has been on blood thinners and statins for years.

He is experiencing extreme muscle weakness in his legs along with a lot of others things like hearing loss, a generally quiet speaking voice, despite trying to speak at a more normal volume, and some memory issues as well. His doctors believe the muscle weakness is a side effect of the statins so they took him off of them.

I felt it was a good time to discuss Ray’s articles with him. My friend is open to learning more so I’m sending Ray’s articles to my friend and his wife in an email.

I’d really like to get them in touch with Ray before too long. I don’t want it to be too late. Can anyone please send me Ray’s email or please help in some way.

I will not be using the email for myself now or in the future. I just want my friend to have a fighting chance at getting healthier.

 

[Zoltanman]

Hi @liber1

I would be wary of this as a first step. Ray will assume the asker has basic grounding in LOTS of things that he does not. Ray's short, lack of context and low on explaining replies to questions will likely seem nonsensical.

I highly recommend Kate Deering's book "How to Heal Your Metabolism" as a start point for your friend instead. Wish I could go back in time and tell MYSELF that. Oh well.

I feel like questions to Ray are only useful for a 2nd year of metabolic understanding person, so the answers can hit the targets as intended.

 

[liber1]

I completely understand what you mean. I often find some of his answers to other’s emails lacking the context necessary for a newbie like myself to understand and assimilate.

I will definitely check out this book as I often find myself lost in a sea of “peatisms”.

Thank you for the suggestion. I hope I can help my friend out.

 

[Zoltanman]

I completely understand what you mean. I often find some of his answers to other’s emails lacking the context necessary for a newbie like myself to understand and assimilate.

I will definitely check out this book as I often find myself lost in a sea of “peatisms”.

Thank you for the suggestion. I hope I can help my friend out.

You'll be able to help with just that book. I'd order it express post from somewhere close, so you can satisfy that 'got to DO something' anxious feeling by getting real information on it's way to you.

 

[liber1]

You'll be able to help with just that book. I'd order it express post from somewhere close, so you can satisfy that 'got to DO something' anxious feeling by getting real information on it's way to you.

I will do that. Thank you for understanding

 

[Blossom]

I do think with older people diet is a crucial first step and a safe way to implement changes. My concern with the elderly or very ill is that trying to increase metabolism too much and too quickly could upset their homeostasis.

I was talking to my 80 year old neighbor who is very interested in health about how she ate as a child. She said they had very simple meals of meat and starch and for dinner they had a cooked vegetable to go with that meal. She said she thinks people today could improve their health just by going back to eating that way so Kate Deering’s book sounds like an excellent idea.

I think stopping the statin should help a lot. The same muscle issues happened to my dad who’s in his 70’s and he’s doing much now better off the statin.

 

[Zoltanman]

@liber1 no worries! @Blossom is right, statins are indeed a nightmare. So many ways to damage a person packed into a few tiny doses.

Food is the key till there's a felt benefit. Even a 10% shift is enough. Then you ask: "What if we could COMPOUND how good you feel on this amazing food by removing some things that block the food from working?" (queue the 'maybe your doc is killing you' conversation)

Hope this helps!

 

[liber1]

I do think with older people diet is a crucial first step and a safe way to implement changes. My concern with the elderly or very ill is that trying to increase metabolism too much and too quickly could upset their homeostasis.

I was talking to my 80 year old neighbor who is very interested in health about how she ate as a child. She said they had very simple meals of meat and starch and for dinner they had a cooked vegetable to go with that meal. She said she thinks people today could improve their health just by going back to eating that way so Kate Deering’s book sounds like an excellent idea.

I think stopping the statin should help a lot. The same muscle issues happened to my dad who’s in his 70’s and he’s doing much now better off the statin.

The idea of raising it too fast being harmful makes sense to me. I suppose slow and steady is good for a lot of things. Always felt like the medicine was in the food.

 

[liber1]

@liber1 no worries! @Blossom is right, statins are indeed a nightmare. So many ways to damage a person packed into a few tiny doses.

Food is the key till there's a felt benefit. Even a 10% shift is enough. Then you ask: "What if we could COMPOUND how good you feel on this amazing food by removing some things that block the food from working?" (queue the 'maybe your doc is killing you' conversation)

Hope this helps!

The more I read and try to really "listen" to what others are trying to tell me the more I realize how much I still have to learn. I wonder just how much nutrition is prevented from having an effect because of doctor prescribed drugs. Sad state of affairs. So glad I can reference this forum.

 

[oxphoser]

Hi all,

My friend is in his mid 70s and has had a lot of health issues throughout the last 10 years or so, including two heart attacks. He has a pacemaker and has been on blood thinners and statins for years.

He is experiencing extreme muscle weakness in his legs along with a lot of others things like hearing loss, a generally quiet speaking voice, despite trying to speak at a more normal volume, and some memory issues as well. His doctors believe the muscle weakness is a side effect of the statins so they took him off of them.

I felt it was a good time to discuss Ray’s articles with him. My friend is open to learning more so I’m sending Ray’s articles to my friend and his wife in an email.

I’d really like to get them in touch with Ray before too long. I don’t want it to be too late. Can anyone please send me Ray’s email or please help in some way.

I will not be using the email for myself now or in the future. I just want my friend to have a fighting chance at getting healthier.

If he can afford the $120 cost, he might consider having a consultation with Andrew Murray at Western Botanical Medicine. He will often consult with Ray Peat.

I will bet they will have your friend do a basic metabolic panel. If the TSH is high, he will get your friend to measure his temperature and pulses before and after the first 2 meals, and then one more time 90 minutes later to see if they are falling off at the end of the day.

I recommend him because he’s helped me straighten out how much thyroid medication I need.

 

[liber1]

If he can afford the $120 cost, he might consider having a consultation with Andrew Murray at Western Botanical Medicine. He will often consult with Ray Peat.

I will bet they will have your friend do a basic metabolic panel. If the TSH is high, he will get your friend to measure his temperature and pulses before and after the first 2 meals, and then one more time 90 minutes later to see if they are falling off at the end of the day.

I recommend him because he’s helped me straighten out how much thyroid medication I need.

I’ll be looking into this for him. Thank you for the advice. All is appreciated

 

[Peachy]

He could talk to his doctor about moving to prescription niacin instead of the statin - at least in the interim to help prevent a potential rebound effect that often goes with stopping statins.

 

[Peatness]

Glad the doctor took him off statins did he prescribe q10?

Coenzyme Q10 and Statin-Induced Mitochondrial Dysfunction

Coenzyme Q10 is an important factor in mitochondrial respiration. Primary and secondary deficiencies of coenzyme Q10 result in a number of neurologic and myopathic syndromes. Hydroxyl-methylglutaryl coenzyme A reductase inhibitors or statins interfere ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Coenzyme Q10

Contents Summary Introduction Biological Activities Mitochondrial ATP synthesis Lysosomal function Antioxidant functions Nutrient interactions Deficiency Disease Prevention Aging

lpi.oregonstate.edu

What is his thiamine status?

Myopathy in thiamine deficiency: analysis of a case - PubMed

Myopathy may occur in patients with thiamine deficiency.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Peachy]

He could talk to his doctor about moving to prescription niacin instead of the statin - at least in the interim to help prevent a potential rebound effect that often goes with stopping statins.

Sorry, I thought he was still on the statins. If he’s already off, I’d try to avoid more prescriptions

 

[liber1]

Glad the doctor took him off statins did he prescribe q10?

Coenzyme Q10 and Statin-Induced Mitochondrial Dysfunction

Coenzyme Q10 is an important factor in mitochondrial respiration. Primary and secondary deficiencies of coenzyme Q10 result in a number of neurologic and myopathic syndromes. Hydroxyl-methylglutaryl coenzyme A reductase inhibitors or statins interfere ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Coenzyme Q10

Contents Summary Introduction Biological Activities Mitochondrial ATP synthesis Lysosomal function Antioxidant functions Nutrient interactions Deficiency Disease Prevention Aging

lpi.oregonstate.edu

What is his thiamine status?

Myopathy in thiamine deficiency: analysis of a case - PubMed

Myopathy may occur in patients with thiamine deficiency.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Incredible information, I’ll talk with him about supplementing with these. I see from the first link that statins effect the ability to even form CoQ10 and I’m fairly certain from what I know he probably isn’t getting sufficient thiamine.

Thank you very much

 

[liber1]

Sorry, I thought he was still on the statins. If he’s already off, I’d try to avoid more prescriptions

Yes, he’s off of them. I’m hoping they don’t have the mind to prescribe something equally harmful in their place or perhaps put him back on if he sees improvement.

I’m very uneducated with a lot of this. The Peat world is only about 6 months old for me. Personal training background… trying to continue to evolve

 

[Peatness]

Incredible information, I’ll talk with him about supplementing with these. I see from the first link that statins effect the ability to even form CoQ10 and I’m fairly certain from what I know he probably isn’t getting sufficient thiamine.

Thank you very much

You're welcome

 

[Peachy]

Yes, he’s off of them. I’m hoping they don’t have the mind to prescribe something equally harmful in their place or perhaps put him back on if he sees improvement.

I’m very uneducated with a lot of this. The Peat world is only about 6 months old for me. Personal training background… trying to continue to evolve

You’re so kind to help him. My dad had similar leg issues on statins so they put him on prescription niacin. He did great on that. Then his cholesterol started going back up (I’m sure it being either a non-issue or thyroid related) and they put him on low-dose statins. So maybe if the issue comes up again you can have the niacin in your back pocket. Your friend is fortunate to have you!

 

[liber1]

You’re so kind to help him. My dad had similar leg issues on statins so they put him on prescription niacin. He did great on that. Then his cholesterol started going back up (I’m sure it being either a non-issue or thyroid related) and they put him on low-dose statins. So maybe if the issue comes up again you can have the niacin in your back pocket. Your friend is fortunate to have you!

Thank you for saying that. Might even buy him some myself. Anything to reduce the barrier to entry.

 

[Peachy]

Thank you for saying that. Might even buy him some myself. Anything to reduce the barrier to entry.

Oh, I meant the prescription niacin as a statin alternative if his doctor starts to cause trouble. They actually use this sometimes when people don’t tolerate statins - because it happens a lot!

But for now, a good b-complex like LifeBlud Energi+ and some extra thiamin could be great. Magnesium glycinate or glycinate/taurate could be super helpful too. Not sure if anyone has recommended that.

I’ll post the “foundations protocol” I wrote up for my dad in a bit. I tried to keep it easy and effective (avoiding barriers to entry like you said). They have different issues but some overlap and they’re the same age.