My Contribution To The Forum

Perry Staltic

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What is the evidence that men living before plato wrote the old testament?

What evidence is there that Plato wrote what is claimed he wrote? I've read that his stuff was written 1000 years after the time it is claimed he lived.
 

meatbag

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What evidence is there that Plato wrote what is claimed he wrote? I've read that his stuff was written 1000 years after the time it is claimed he lived.
That is a possibility
No one asserts that what Plato wrote is true because Plato wrote it
The bible is asserted to be true because it is inspired by a deity
 

meatbag

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[New Testament]
2 Timothy 3:1-7
[1] This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
[2] For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
[3] Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
[4] Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
[5] Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
[6] For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
[7] Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

[Old Testament]
Daniel 12:4
[4] But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
Couldn't that statement apply to any society during any period in human civilization?
 
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Couldn't that statement apply to any society during any period in human civilization?
If that period is the last days as the context states, sure.

There are people who try to make an argument that we've been in the "last days" ever since Christ was crucified, but the indicator that we're on the verge of the last days is indicated by the fig tree generation which is spoken of in Matthew chapter 24 & Luke chapter 21.

Matthew 24:34-35
[34] Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
[35] Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Luke 21:32-33
[32] Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
[33] Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

These chapters are specifically oriented around Christ's answering of the question, 'what are things going to be like before Your return and the brink of the end of the world?' Taking a few minutes to read the prophecies for yourself would bring a great deal of clarity to the topic, but I digress.

The "generation" that is spoken of is the generation in which Israel becomes a nation again, which (is most widely agreed to have) happened back on May 14, 1948. As far as I know, a country reclaiming independence after 1900 years is unprecedented.

With regard to the length of a "generation," it's either 40 years or 70-80. 40 - e.g. Israel wandered in the desert for 40 years; a generation, etc.

Alternatively, a generation is 70-80 years by implication of:

Psalms 90:10
[10] The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

So, now we have 1948 + (70-80) = 2018-2028

By no coincidence, the capital of Israel was reinstated from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem on May 14, 2018, matching the movement of the US embassy accordingly, exactly 70 years later... Even to the hour, some say.

Also, it's not hard to find modern news pieces discussing the eagerness for the Jews to rebuild the 3rd temple, which has to happen in order for the antichrist to proclaim himself to be God.

Anyhow, with Israel reconciling itself to once again become a nation in 1948, that's the greatest indicator that we're either a) in the last days or b) on the verge of their beginning, which may well be Daniel's 70th week (last 7 years of the earth).

*Two other points:
1) it's been about 2,000 years since the crucifixion of Christ, hence the year 2021.

2 Peter 3:8
[8] But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

>Christ is buried 2 days, rises on the 3rd.
>The coming millennial kingdom of Christ is 1,000 years:

Revelation 20:4
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

>After that 1,000 years is concluded, a total of 7,000 years will have passed. '7' is the number of physical and spiritual perfection. Ex. Jesus Christ is the 77th man from Adam as the genealogy is written in Luke chapter 3.

2) the phrase "last days" occurs exactly 8 times in the KJV. The number '8' is a number of new beginnings. Ex. Noah was the 8th person, he had 8 family members who repopulated the earth, etc.
 

Inaut

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If that period is the last days as the context states, sure.

There are people who try to make an argument that we've been in the "last days" ever since Christ was crucified, but the indicator that we're on the verge of the last days is indicated by the fig tree generation which is spoken of in Matthew chapter 24 & Luke chapter 21.

Matthew 24:34-35
[34] Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
[35] Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Luke 21:32-33
[32] Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
[33] Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

These chapters are specifically oriented around Christ's answering of the question, 'what are things going to be like before Your return and the brink of the end of the world?' Taking a few minutes to read the prophecies for yourself would bring a great deal of clarity to the topic, but I digress.

The "generation" that is spoken of is the generation in which Israel becomes a nation again, which (is most widely agreed to have) happened back on May 14, 1948. As far as I know, a country reclaiming independence after 1900 years is unprecedented.

With regard to the length of a "generation," it's either 40 years or 70-80. 40 - e.g. Israel wandered in the desert for 40 years; a generation, etc.

Alternatively, a generation is 70-80 years by implication of:

Psalms 90:10
[10] The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

So, now we have 1948 + (70-80) = 2018-2028

By no coincidence, the capital of Israel was reinstated from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem on May 14, 2018, matching the movement of the US embassy accordingly, exactly 70 years later... Even to the hour, some say.

Also, it's not hard to find modern news pieces discussing the eagerness for the Jews to rebuild the 3rd temple, which has to happen in order for the antichrist to proclaim himself to be God.

Anyhow, with Israel reconciling itself to once again become a nation in 1948, that's the greatest indicator that we're either a) in the last days or b) on the verge of their beginning, which may well be Daniel's 70th week (last 7 years of the earth).

*Two other points:
1) it's been about 2,000 years since the crucifixion of Christ, hence the year 2021.

2 Peter 3:8
[8] But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

>Christ is buried 2 days, rises on the 3rd.
>The coming millennial kingdom of Christ is 1,000 years:

Revelation 20:4
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

>After that 1,000 years is concluded, a total of 7,000 years will have passed. '7' is the number of physical and spiritual perfection. Ex. Jesus Christ is the 77th man from Adam as the genealogy is written in Luke chapter 3.

2) the phrase "last days" occurs exactly 8 times in the KJV. The number '8' is a number of new beginnings. Ex. Noah was the 8th person, he had 8 family members who repopulated the earth, etc.
I enjoy reading your posts. I never realized Jesus was 77th from Adam :)
 

meatbag

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If that period is the last days as the context states, sure.

There are people who try to make an argument that we've been in the "last days" ever since Christ was crucified, but the indicator that we're on the verge of the last days is indicated by the fig tree generation which is spoken of in Matthew chapter 24 & Luke chapter 21.

Matthew 24:34-35
[34] Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
[35] Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Luke 21:32-33
[32] Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
[33] Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

These chapters are specifically oriented around Christ's answering of the question, 'what are things going to be like before Your return and the brink of the end of the world?' Taking a few minutes to read the prophecies for yourself would bring a great deal of clarity to the topic, but I digress.

The "generation" that is spoken of is the generation in which Israel becomes a nation again, which (is most widely agreed to have) happened back on May 14, 1948. As far as I know, a country reclaiming independence after 1900 years is unprecedented.

With regard to the length of a "generation," it's either 40 years or 70-80. 40 - e.g. Israel wandered in the desert for 40 years; a generation, etc.

Alternatively, a generation is 70-80 years by implication of:

Psalms 90:10
[10] The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

So, now we have 1948 + (70-80) = 2018-2028

By no coincidence, the capital of Israel was reinstated from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem on May 14, 2018, matching the movement of the US embassy accordingly, exactly 70 years later... Even to the hour, some say.

Also, it's not hard to find modern news pieces discussing the eagerness for the Jews to rebuild the 3rd temple, which has to happen in order for the antichrist to proclaim himself to be God.

Anyhow, with Israel reconciling itself to once again become a nation in 1948, that's the greatest indicator that we're either a) in the last days or b) on the verge of their beginning, which may well be Daniel's 70th week (last 7 years of the earth).

*Two other points:
1) it's been about 2,000 years since the crucifixion of Christ, hence the year 2021.

2 Peter 3:8
[8] But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

>Christ is buried 2 days, rises on the 3rd.
>The coming millennial kingdom of Christ is 1,000 years:

Revelation 20:4
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

>After that 1,000 years is concluded, a total of 7,000 years will have passed. '7' is the number of physical and spiritual perfection. Ex. Jesus Christ is the 77th man from Adam as the genealogy is written in Luke chapter 3.

2) the phrase "last days" occurs exactly 8 times in the KJV. The number '8' is a number of new beginnings. Ex. Noah was the 8th person, he had 8 family members who repopulated the earth, etc.
 

meatbag

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The serotonin system and spiritual experiences - PubMed
 

RealNeat

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Would you mind expading on what you mean by materialism? I think recently Peat had mentioned how digital culture is built on essentialism and the ideas of emmanuel kant and people also seem to equate market culture and capitalism or even just consumerism as being materialism, it seems like the term is used to stand for a lot of different things
I don't believe matter creates itself nor has creative power independent of source. I do believe it can perpetuate the laws/ limits or possibilities put on it by source.

this is the way in which I use the word materialism. To me creation worship is materialism, whether it's worship of money, a tree or nothing. I equate the "religion" of a person to their desires (ie a desire for a greater power or purpose to not exist) and believe everyone "worships" something by making it their ideology (paganism, atheism, monotheism, nihilism etc.)
 
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Perry Staltic

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I don't believe matter creates itself nor has creative power independent of source. I do believe it can perpetuate the laws/ limits or possibilities put on it by source.

this is the way in which I use the word materialism. To me creation worship is materialism, whether it's worship of money, a tree or nothing. I equate the "religion" of a person to their desires (ie a desire for a greater power or purpose to not exist) and believe everyone "worships" something by making it their ideology (paganism, atheism, monotheism, nihilism etc.)

Would this reflect your view of materialists?

They exchanged the truth of the source for a lie, and worshiped and served the physical creation rather than its source.
 

meatbag

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Would this reflect your view of materialists?

They exchanged the truth of the source for a lie, and worshiped and served the physical creation rather than its source.
no because I don't think a materialist would say matter is created, it's just a form of energy
I don't think there is any "revealed" truth. Every example of this turns out to be unfounded.
 
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@meatbag

Alright, here's another attempt at raising the shield of faith to withstand some more brittle daggers of this world.

Ephesians 6:16
[16] Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

Matthew 28:17-20
[17] And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.
[18] And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
[19] Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
[20] Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

*Note: "observe" in Matthew 28:20 has synonyms such as "guard, keep, fortress, keep watch, keep an eye upon, hold fast, preserve," etc. The nature of the gospel is defense, yet the word itself is the sole offensive weapon of the Spirit.

Ephesians 6:17
[17] And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

This might sound paradoxical considering that the word of God IS the gospel, but bear in mind my saying that the NATURE of the gospel is defensive (as, dare I say an embodiment of God's life in Christ as a man), whereby in it's bulwark, it prevails to the last, as it is written:

Matthew 24:35
[35] Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Isaiah 45:22-24
[22] Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
[23] I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
[24] Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

Romans 14:11-12
[11] For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
[12] So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

There is none in me that leaves space for any matter to go unanswered in accordance with the word of God,

Proverbs 26:5
[5] Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.

Lest I forfeit my belief of these words:

2 Corinthians 5:10-11
[10] For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
[11] Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

_______________
Of relation to the first 20 seconds of this video:

1 Corinthians 14:33
[33] For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

2 Timothy 1:7
[7] For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

John 8:42-44
[42] Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
[43] Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
[44] Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

*Emphasis on "...and the lusts of your father will ye do."
>Lusts are sensational, e.g. of physical senses.

They are emotional, fleshly, erratic, confusing, fallen, broken, inconsistent - and when they are defended, the result is hypocrisy, hence the first world culture that many of us live in today.

James 4:1-5
[1] From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
[2] Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
[3] Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
[4] Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
[5] Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?



As time has 'progressed' toward the future, we continue to REgress on account of our increasing vindication of individual emotionalism. When the phrase, "I'm right because I feel like it" rules in favor of the feeler on account of their feelings, this is a glorification of man, a recipe for disaster, and is likened unto a house built on sand:

Matthew 7:26-27
[26] And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
[27] And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

Whereby it ought to be repeatedly stated that if we walk by the law, we will justify ourselves, and while justice is meet for holiness, there are none just before God; whereby we are not subject to a law unto ourselves, but rather the law of God.

For as long as we subject ourselves to the laws of other men, we are yet carnal and are consequently at enmity with God because the carnal mind is not subject to God, neither indeed can it be.

If we are not subject to the incorruptible image of God, we are subject to a corruptible image like unto man; and so while we are yet corruptible, we are dead in our trespasses and sins against God.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely, as the saying goes.

We are all liars, thieves, blasphemers, fornicators, and the rest of it, so when we call ourselves just, this results in hypocritical outcomes. A liar is not righteous, yet if it is our standard of righteousness to deem a liar lawful before God, the consequences of this manmade justification will be death & corruption. Lawyers and justification of immoral behavior are the centerpiece for the downfall of the world.

Galatians 6:7-8
[7] Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
[8] For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

Romans 6:23
[23] For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

And so the remedy is to walk after the Spirit whereby we take the high road, not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh:

Galatians 5:17-18
[17] For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
[18] But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Romans 8:4-6
[4] That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
[5] For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
[6] For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

__________________
I often remark that faith (in God) is the most nonsensical thing in the world.
It's not of the senses because it's not of this world, yet it is nonetheless in this world because the Comforter has been sent, hallelujah:

John 14:26-27
[26] But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
[27] Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

I ask myself how it might be that someone could read those words of John 14:26-27 and then not so plainly observe the apparently opposite disposition of the kids in the beginning of that Persinger clip.

And the answer is this, as pasted above in John 8:43 -

John 8:43
[43] Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

Which plugs into:

Romans 10:17-18
[17] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
[18] But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

And so now it might be made evident to the reader that hearing the word of God is no matter of physically feeling the eardrum reverberate to a wave of sound, but rather an understanding of what is written. From the understanding of what is written, we gather faith. This is what it means to believe the gospel, the word of God.

I thank God that it's a nonsensical operation because that means that no man will ever be able to fully grasp it, that I'm not responsible for taking more or less of it than anyone else, and that between these two aforementioned things, that I may rest upon a blessed assurance, in the peace of God which passeth all understand, breathing a sigh of relief that His work is finished... Because mine won't ever be.

Romans 3:4
[4] God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

John 19:30
[30] When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Philippians 4:6-7
[6] Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.
[7] And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

*Moving on past the first twenty seconds of the above Persinger clip:

If were possible to import thoughts using exogenous electricity, this presentation from 2005 wouldn't carry much weight considering that a much more convenient solution of behavioral control could be achieved by weaponizing wifi routers against us instead of blatantly jumping through every other hoop of modern medicine to forcibly make people dumb and infertile on account of Satan himself trying yet again to bruise the heel of the seed of the woman:

Genesis 3:15
[15] And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Revelation 12:4-5
[4] And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
[5] And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

*Sidenote: does anyone know of any other books which have their ending written in their beginning, being spaced out something like 1500 years in between their writings of each other?

*Back to this tangent, it is written that during the return of the Son of man, it will be as it was in the days of Noe (Noah):

Matthew 24:37-41
[37] But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

*And so then comes another motive of these sayings:

Matthew 24:40-43
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[42] Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
[43] But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

*Another point I want to make is a fresh one that was revealed as I type this. That point is that the following verses in Revelation are written in past tense, aka that they already happened:

Revelation 12:9-13
[9] And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
[10] And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
[11] And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
[12] Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
[13] And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

*I have been posing the question to numerous people for years, "Do you think that God is everything that ever was and ever will be?" To which there has been a 99% agreement and 1% no comment rating, or thereabouts. Everyone agrees that God is omniscient and omnipotent, yet there is often confusion as to what God's will is for a person's life... Even most Christians are confused about this (hint: follow His commandments), much moreso anyone who follows a spritual practice based on works (aka all other spritual practices in the entire world besides Christianity).

Clearly, God's will for someone's life is always available for them to choose; glory to God or glory to self with regard to the decisions yet made & surrounding circumstances therein.

But the point is this: as the book of Revelation was already written before the time of the garden of Eden, so too is God's will for us already available in the Spirit granted that we deny the flesh and invite His will into our lives instead of our own.

I could be overtired or some other adjective, but the remainder of Revelation 12 seems to imply the beginning of the garden of Eden story after the dragon sees that he is cast down to the earth in Revelation 12:13 -

Revelation 12:14-17
[14] And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
[15] And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
[16] And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

*In a similar vein, I used to often use the following as a conversation starter:
"What if everything that ever WILL happen already HAS happened... But the only reason that we perceive time is because of our sensory perception?"

Annnnnnd the corruptible flesh (sensory perception) is the realm of the prince of the power of the air. The body decays, yet the soul is already seated in heaven, having received all spiritual blessings:

Ephesians 1:3
[3] Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

Ephesians 2:5-6
[5] Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
[6] And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Praise God! \o/

***Back to the Persinger clip:

The purpose of the presentation is to silence the "god gene" which corresponds to increased electrical activity in the brain when someone is, loosely put, worshipping in faith. The plan is to release an airborne rhinovirus that would then be vaccinated for, of which said vaccine would silence the proposed gene of religious fundamentalism (4m 15s):


_______________________
With regard to the book title, 'Only One God'

This is a lateral point, but a useful rebuttal against any modern day individuals writing conflicting takes of etched-in-stone history:

The 1611 Authorized King James Bible is the longest standing English translation, being in print for over 400 years.

It took 54 scholars 7 years to translate in full. Many of them were fluent in multiple languages. As far as I know, this was the full time occupation of this group of people for 7 years without distraction as the provision was set forth by the King.

Reportedly, but I have not proven this in my own research:

There are 5,321 Syrian manuscripts which make up over 99% of all Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic Bible foundation texts. All of these manuscripts agree with each other. Same words in the respective languages copied over and over again.

There are 43 Alexandrian manuscripts. Most of them aren't more than 3 verses. The 2 notable ones are the Codex Sinaiticus and the Vaticanus. These translations each have their own rendition of most of the New Testament but they are missing something like 50% of the Old Testament. None of the Alexandrian manuscripts agree with each other. They make up less than 1% of all foundational Bible translation YET...

The only English translation that we still have available to us today which comes COMPLETELY from the Syrian manuscripts is the King James Bible.

Ecclesiastes 8:4
[4] Where the word of a king is, there is power: and who may say unto him, What doest thou?

Esther 8:8
[8] Write ye also for the Jews, as it liketh you, in the king's name, and seal it with the king's ring: for the writing which is written in the king's name, and sealed with the king's ring, may no man reverse.

*God tells us that He will preserve His word. We have faith that God cannot lie and He keeps His promises. This is known as the 'doctrine of preservation:'

Psalms 12:6-7
[6] The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
[7] Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

1 Kings 8:56
[56] Blessed be the LORD, that hath given rest unto his people Israel, according to all that he promised: there hath not failed one word of all his good promise, which he promised by the hand of Moses his servant.

*Finally, the King James Bible has no copyright whatsoever. Every other Bible in print does, which means someone makes money on it. Not that one, though. Nobody makes money on the most popular book of all time. Weird, right? It's almost like it's the only book in which money doesn't apply to...

1 Timothy 6:10
[10] For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

______________________
***Regarding greater serotonin binding affinity in subjects who perceive greater self-transcendance:

1 Timothy 6:20-21
[20] O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:
[21] Which some professing have erred concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen. (The first to Timothy was written from Laodicea, which is the chiefest city of Phrygia Pacatiana.)

2 Corinthians 5:6-7
[6] Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
[7] (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

Romans 1:20-25
[20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
[21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
[22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
[23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
[24] Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
[25] Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

*Satan is the illusion (vanity) that one can love themselves (this world and the materials therein) more than they love God.

Ephesians 4:17-24
[17] This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
[18] Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
[19] Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
[20] But ye have not so learned Christ;
[21] If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
[22] That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
[23] And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
[24] And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Romans 8:20-24
[20] For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
[21] Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
[22] For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
[23] And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
[24] For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

Hebrews 11:1
[1] Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Ecclesiastes 1:12-14
[12] I the Preacher was king over Israel in Jerusalem.
[13] And I gave my heart to seek and search out by wisdom concerning all things that are done under heaven: this sore travail hath God given to the sons of man to be exercised therewith.
[14] I have seen all the works that are done under the sun; and, behold, all is vanity and vexation of spirit.

Job 35:12-14
[12] There they cry, but none giveth answer, because of the pride of evil men.
[13] Surely God will not hear vanity, neither will the Almighty regard it.
[14] Although thou sayest thou shalt not see him, yet judgment is before him; therefore trust thou in him.
_____________________
Romans 14:14
[14] I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.

Romans 14:5
[5] One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

Hebrews 9:27-28
[27] And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
[28] So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
 
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Explorer

Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2020
Messages
131
One man's fortune cookie is another man's prophecy. Personally I've never had much use for religion, I never found the arguments compelling or convincing enough. But it's really not "religion" that I take issue with, it's the concept of any creationism really.

Whether we're talking orthodoxed religion, ancient astronaut theory, or the "simulation theory" they all have a unique and uncanny ability to absolve a certain level of responsibility from the human species. It allows our race to not take action on some of the most useful things paramount to our own survival. "Why take life seriously?," "why care about our planet?."

It teaches the human mind to not care about the most important questions that have yet to be answered, namely our own survival. And the reason why is the responsibility has been absolved on the blind belief that a god, intelligent being, or software update is going to save us. That there's something above us, a "all knowing" force and "all caring" force that will be our salvation.

I gotta admit it sounds good, really good. In fact who would not want it like this? The unfortunate thing is we can't depend on this, if we wish to survive anyways. This responsibility is NOT absolved on us, it does NOT belong to a "all knowing" force. We are the stewards sitting a drift on this pale blue dot, and we are our own keepers. This is a very empowering reality check, however it also comes with a massive responsibility that humans don't like burdening.

The survival of our species is in the stars. We can either evolve and come closer to our own divinity, racing ourselves towards Type III civilizations that populate galaxies, or we can destroy ourselves on this lonely little rock while beholding to primitive thought that absolves our responsibility.
Yeah you put into words what I was trying to say that in many situations religions and spiritualities in the general result into placing too much faith onto a higher being taking care of everything which then means if something would happen in this world that humans needed to take care of and solve with their own means and skills and resources and abilities then there might not be a full effort put into doing that and in the general more time spent on spiritual pursuits decreases time and effort and focus and energy putting into directly improving and influencing the real physical material world which ultimately is what determines the survivability of our organisms since at the end of the day the organisms still need food (energy) and sleep and rest and shelter and other means of the basic neccesities and the reason that all this religious and spiritual stuff can be thought of and comprehended in the first place is simply because of the physical body of the organism being real and existing
 

meatbag

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Messages
1,563
@meatbag

Alright, here's another attempt at raising the shield of faith to withstand some more brittle daggers of this world.

Ephesians 6:16
[16] Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

Matthew 28:17-20
[17] And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.
[18] And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
[19] Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
[20] Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

*Note: "observe" in Matthew 28:20 has synonyms such as "guard, keep, fortress, keep watch, keep an eye upon, hold fast, preserve," etc. The nature of the gospel is defense, yet the word itself is the sole offensive weapon of the Spirit.

Ephesians 6:17
[17] And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

This might sound paradoxical considering that the word of God IS the gospel, but bear in mind my saying that the NATURE of the gospel is defensive (as, dare I say an embodiment of God's life in Christ as a man), whereby in it's bulwark, it prevails to the last, as it is written:

Matthew 24:35
[35] Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Isaiah 45:22-24
[22] Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
[23] I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
[24] Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

Romans 14:11-12
[11] For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
[12] So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

There is none in me that leaves space for any matter to go unanswered in accordance with the word of God,

Proverbs 26:5
[5] Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.

Lest I forfeit my belief of these words:

2 Corinthians 5:10-11
[10] For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
[11] Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

_______________
Of relation to the first 20 seconds of this video:

1 Corinthians 14:33
[33] For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

2 Timothy 1:7
[7] For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

John 8:42-44
[42] Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
[43] Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
[44] Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

*Emphasis on "...and the lusts of your father will ye do."
>Lusts are sensational, e.g. of physical senses.

They are emotional, fleshly, erratic, confusing, fallen, broken, inconsistent - and when they are defended, the result is hypocrisy, hence the first world culture that many of us live in today.

James 4:1-5
[1] From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
[2] Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
[3] Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
[4] Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
[5] Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?



As time has 'progressed' toward the future, we continue to REgress on account of our increasing vindication of individual emotionalism. When the phrase, "I'm right because I feel like it" rules in favor of the feeler on account of their feelings, this is a glorification of man, a recipe for disaster, and is likened unto a house built on sand:

Matthew 7:26-27
[26] And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
[27] And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

Whereby it ought to be repeatedly stated that if we walk by the law, we will justify ourselves, and while justice is meet for holiness, there are none just before God; whereby we are not subject to a law unto ourselves, but rather the law of God.

For as long as we subject ourselves to the laws of other men, we are yet carnal and are consequently at enmity with God because the carnal mind is not subject to God, neither indeed can it be.

If we are not subject to the incorruptible image of God, we are subject to a corruptible image like unto man; and so while we are yet corruptible, we are dead in our trespasses and sins against God.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely, as the saying goes.

We are all liars, thieves, blasphemers, fornicators, and the rest of it, so when we call ourselves just, this results in hypocritical outcomes. A liar is not righteous, yet if it is our standard of righteousness to deem a liar lawful before God, the consequences of this manmade justification will be death & corruption. Lawyers and justification of immoral behavior are the centerpiece for the downfall of the world.

Galatians 6:7-8
[7] Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
[8] For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

Romans 6:23
[23] For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

And so the remedy is to walk after the Spirit whereby we take the high road, not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh:

Galatians 5:17-18
[17] For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
[18] But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Romans 8:4-6
[4] That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
[5] For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
[6] For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

__________________
I often remark that faith (in God) is the most nonsensical thing in the world.
It's not of the senses because it's not of this world, yet it is nonetheless in this world because the Comforter has been sent, hallelujah:

John 14:26-27
[26] But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
[27] Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

I ask myself how it might be that someone could read those words of John 14:26-27 and then not so plainly observe the apparently opposite disposition of the kids in the beginning of that Persinger clip.

And the answer is this, as pasted above in John 8:43 -

John 8:43
[43] Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

Which plugs into:

Romans 10:17-18
[17] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
[18] But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

And so now it might be made evident to the reader that hearing the word of God is no matter of physically feeling the eardrum reverberate to a wave of sound, but rather an understanding of what is written. From the understanding of what is written, we gather faith. This is what it means to believe the gospel, the word of God.

I thank God that it's a nonsensical operation because that means that no man will ever be able to fully grasp it, that I'm not responsible for taking more or less of it than anyone else, and that between these two aforementioned things, that I may rest upon a blessed assurance, in the peace of God which passeth all understand, breathing a sigh of relief that His work is finished... Because mine won't ever be.

Romans 3:4
[4] God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

John 19:30
[30] When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Philippians 4:6-7
[6] Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.
[7] And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

*Moving on past the first twenty seconds of the above Persinger clip:

If were possible to import thoughts using exogenous electricity, this presentation from 2005 wouldn't carry much weight considering that a much more convenient solution of behavioral control could be achieved by weaponizing wifi routers against us instead of blatantly jumping through every other hoop of modern medicine to forcibly make people dumb and infertile on account of Satan himself trying yet again to bruise the heel of the seed of the woman:

Genesis 3:15
[15] And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Revelation 12:4-5
[4] And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
[5] And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

*Sidenote: does anyone know of any other books which have their ending written in their beginning, being spaced out something like 1500 years in between their writings of each other?

*Back to this tangent, it is written that during the return of the Son of man, it will be as it was in the days of Noe (Noah):

Matthew 24:37-41
[37] But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

*And so then comes another motive of these sayings:

Matthew 24:40-43
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[42] Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
[43] But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

*Another point I want to make is a fresh one that was revealed as I type this. That point is that the following verses in Revelation are written in past tense, aka that they already happened:

Revelation 12:9-13
[9] And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
[10] And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
[11] And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
[12] Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
[13] And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

*I have been posing the question to numerous people for years, "Do you think that God is everything that ever was and ever will be?" To which there has been a 99% agreement and 1% no comment rating, or thereabouts. Everyone agrees that God is omniscient and omnipotent, yet there is often confusion as to what God's will is for a person's life... Even most Christians are confused about this (hint: follow His commandments), much moreso anyone who follows a spritual practice based on works (aka all other spritual practices in the entire world besides Christianity).

Clearly, God's will for someone's life is always available for them to choose; glory to God or glory to self with regard to the decisions yet made & surrounding circumstances therein.

But the point is this: as the book of Revelation was already written before the time of the garden of Eden, so too is God's will for us already available in the Spirit granted that we deny the flesh and invite His will into our lives instead of our own.

I could be overtired or some other adjective, but the remainder of Revelation 12 seems to imply the beginning of the garden of Eden story after the dragon sees that he is cast down to the earth in Revelation 12:13 -

Revelation 12:14-17
[14] And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
[15] And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
[16] And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

*In a similar vein, I used to often use the following as a conversation starter:
"What if everything that ever WILL happen already HAS happened... But the only reason that we perceive time is because of our sensory perception?"

Annnnnnd the corruptible flesh (sensory perception) is the realm of the prince of the power of the air. The body decays, yet the soul is already seated in heaven, having received all spiritual blessings:

Ephesians 1:3
[3] Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

Ephesians 2:5-6
[5] Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
[6] And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Praise God! \o/

***Back to the Persinger clip:

The purpose of the presentation is to silence the "god gene" which corresponds to increased electrical activity in the brain when someone is, loosely put, worshipping in faith. The plan is to release an airborne rhinovirus that would then be vaccinated for, of which said vaccine would silence the proposed gene of religious fundamentalism (4m 15s):


_______________________
With regard to the book title, 'Only One God'

This is a lateral point, but a useful rebuttal against any modern day individuals writing conflicting takes of etched-in-stone history:

The 1611 Authorized King James Bible is the longest standing English translation, being in print for over 400 years.

It took 54 scholars 7 years to translate in full. Many of them were fluent in multiple languages. As far as I know, this was the full time occupation of this group of people for 7 years without distraction as the provision was set forth by the King.

Reportedly, but I have not proven this in my own research:

There are 5,321 Syrian manuscripts which make up over 99% of all Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic Bible foundation texts. All of these manuscripts agree with each other. Same words in the respective languages copied over and over again.

There are 43 Alexandrian manuscripts. Most of them aren't more than 3 verses. The 2 notable ones are the Codex Sinaiticus and the Vaticanus. These translations each have their own rendition of most of the New Testament but they are missing something like 50% of the Old Testament. None of the Alexandrian manuscripts agree with each other. They make up less than 1% of all foundational Bible translation YET...

The only English translation that we still have available to us today which comes COMPLETELY from the Syrian manuscripts is the King James Bible.

Ecclesiastes 8:4
[4] Where the word of a king is, there is power: and who may say unto him, What doest thou?

Esther 8:8
[8] Write ye also for the Jews, as it liketh you, in the king's name, and seal it with the king's ring: for the writing which is written in the king's name, and sealed with the king's ring, may no man reverse.

*God tells us that He will preserve His word. We have faith that God cannot lie and He keeps His promises. This is known as the 'doctrine of preservation:'

Psalms 12:6-7
[6] The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
[7] Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

1 Kings 8:56
[56] Blessed be the LORD, that hath given rest unto his people Israel, according to all that he promised: there hath not failed one word of all his good promise, which he promised by the hand of Moses his servant.

*Finally, the King James Bible has no copyright whatsoever. Every other Bible in print does, which means someone makes money on it. Not that one, though. Nobody makes money on the most popular book of all time. Weird, right? It's almost like it's the only book in which money doesn't apply to...

1 Timothy 6:10
[10] For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

______________________
***Regarding greater serotonin binding affinity in subjects who perceive greater self-transcendance:

1 Timothy 6:20-21
[20] O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:
[21] Which some professing have erred concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen. (The first to Timothy was written from Laodicea, which is the chiefest city of Phrygia Pacatiana.)

2 Corinthians 5:6-7
[6] Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
[7] (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

Romans 1:20-25
[20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
[21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
[22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
[23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
[24] Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
[25] Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

*Satan is the illusion (vanity) that one can love themselves (this world and the materials therein) more than they love God.

Ephesians 4:17-24
[17] This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
[18] Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
[19] Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
[20] But ye have not so learned Christ;
[21] If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
[22] That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
[23] And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
[24] And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Romans 8:20-24
[20] For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
[21] Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
[22] For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
[23] And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
[24] For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

Hebrews 11:1
[1] Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Ecclesiastes 1:12-14
[12] I the Preacher was king over Israel in Jerusalem.
[13] And I gave my heart to seek and search out by wisdom concerning all things that are done under heaven: this sore travail hath God given to the sons of man to be exercised therewith.
[14] I have seen all the works that are done under the sun; and, behold, all is vanity and vexation of spirit.

Job 35:12-14
[12] There they cry, but none giveth answer, because of the pride of evil men.
[13] Surely God will not hear vanity, neither will the Almighty regard it.
[14] Although thou sayest thou shalt not see him, yet judgment is before him; therefore trust thou in him.
_____________________
Romans 14:14
[14] I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.

Romans 14:5
[5] One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

Hebrews 9:27-28
[27] And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
[28] So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
Serotonin promotes (futile) patience and (false) faith in future rewards
 
Joined
Apr 22, 2019
Messages
360


The primary issue of the railings against Christianity is the assumption that it operates in the same relationship as every 'religion' in the world, making it just a different color of walking stick that isn't any different from Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism, Judaism, etc etc. All of the religions in the world are joined together by the sacrifice of works to this world in order to gain a more favorable outcome in the next life without any certainty that those physical works (like making a pie or saying nice things or giving money to the homeless or chanting a mantra, etc) are going to offer more or less reward. It's all ambiguous, confusing, and as a result, each person lives in their own imagination regarding where they might land on the coming hierarchy/totem pole of the next life.

This leads to a "to each their own" concept where individualism & pride are thereby glorified. If one person releases their stress by sacrificing food to their god and another person sits uselessly in a closet actively trying to dilute their free will by crossing whatever threshold that they believe is a state of 'nothingness,' then more power to each of them, as the philosophy goes.

The hypocrisy of this matter is that anyone who believes this life is left up to the personal, moment-to-moment, ongoing interpretation of one's own imagination which yields their unique, quantum, snowflake experience as the only form of elusive truth in this conscious life right up until the moment they die in total uncertainty (except, conveniently, their certain fear of death)... The hypocrisy is that within this whole paradigm, all that person cares about is their own soul. You see, it's an excuse to not give a ***t about anyone else except for themselves, which is the exact opposite of the whole reason why they let bygones be bygones.

The commonality between the two people who sacrifice food or selfish meditation is that they are both sacrificing the time and effort of their flesh as a work in exchange for temporary peace in this temporal realm. If they have a belief about what comes in the next life, by default they think that their individual soul is more or less righteous than the soul of another by doing these actions, which is simply expressed as "self-righteousness."

Under the circumstance that an individual believes they are the only righteous authority, it shields them from the potential judgement of anyone else because by them being morally correct about their actions, this is also saying in the same breath that everyone else is morally wrong.

Which is why we believe the KJV Bible as the standard of truth, lest we would put the truth of men (instead of God) as the supreme truth... Which will result in things like biological men competing in sporting events against biological women, as one example.

Romans 3:9-10
[9] What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Romans 3:22-23
[22] Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
[23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

In conclusion, a Christian submits their infinite soul as a living sacrifice to God... But every other religion/form of spirituality in the world merely submits the work of their expiring flesh in exchange for temporary peace.

Romans 12:1-2
[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
[2] And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

The pleasures of sin is only for a season:

Hebrews 11:25
[25] Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;

...

But if you insist on maintaining guiltless pleasure in your life & thereby risking going to hell for eternity because you'd rather believe that one neurotransmitter is the crux of the reason why every person is born fearing death, then God help your soul.

1 Timothy 6:20
[20] O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

Romans 8:15
[15] For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

2 Thessalonians 2:8-12
[8] And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
[9] Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
[10] And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
[11] And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
[12] That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

_______________________
***Regarding hell, it is the place where the worm dieth not and the fire is not quenched:

Mark 9:43-48
[43] And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
[44] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
[45] And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
[46] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
[47] And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
[48] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

*Similarly, the rich man in torment:

Luke 16:22-25
[22] And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
[23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
[24] And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
[25] But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

_______________________

Hebrews 2:14-18
[14] Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
[15] And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
[16] For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
[17] Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
[18] For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

*Again, death is not a fear of the Christian:

1 Corinthians 15:54-58
[54] So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
[55] O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
[56] The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
[57] But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
[58] Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

_____________________

Lastly, Pascal's wager seems fitting enough to insert as an honorable mention:

In essence - is it more rational to live a life as if God doesn't exist and then come to find out that He does or;
To live a life as if God does exist to then find out that He doesn't?

 

meatbag

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Messages
1,563
The primary issue of the railings against Christianity is the assumption that it operates in the same relationship as every 'religion' in the world, making it just a different color of walking stick that isn't any different from Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism, Judaism, etc etc. All of the religions in the world are joined together by the sacrifice of works to this world in order to gain a more favorable outcome in the next life without any certainty that those physical works (like making a pie or saying nice things or giving money to the homeless or chanting a mantra, etc) are going to offer more or less reward. It's all ambiguous, confusing, and as a result, each person lives in their own imagination regarding where they might land on the coming hierarchy/totem pole of the next life.

This leads to a "to each their own" concept where individualism & pride are thereby glorified. If one person releases their stress by sacrificing food to their god and another person sits uselessly in a closet actively trying to dilute their free will by crossing whatever threshold that they believe is a state of 'nothingness,' then more power to each of them, as the philosophy goes.

The hypocrisy of this matter is that anyone who believes this life is left up to the personal, moment-to-moment, ongoing interpretation of one's own imagination which yields their unique, quantum, snowflake experience as the only form of elusive truth in this conscious life right up until the moment they die in total uncertainty (except, conveniently, their certain fear of death)... The hypocrisy is that within this whole paradigm, all that person cares about is their own soul. You see, it's an excuse to not give a ***t about anyone else except for themselves, which is the exact opposite of the whole reason why they let bygones be bygones.

The commonality between the two people who sacrifice food or selfish meditation is that they are both sacrificing the time and effort of their flesh as a work in exchange for temporary peace in this temporal realm. If they have a belief about what comes in the next life, by default they think that their individual soul is more or less righteous than the soul of another by doing these actions, which is simply expressed as "self-righteousness."

Under the circumstance that an individual believes they are the only righteous authority, it shields them from the potential judgement of anyone else because by them being morally correct about their actions, this is also saying in the same breath that everyone else is morally wrong.

Which is why we believe the KJV Bible as the standard of truth, lest we would put the truth of men (instead of God) as the supreme truth... Which will result in things like biological men competing in sporting events against biological women, as one example.

Romans 3:9-10
[9] What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Romans 3:22-23
[22] Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
[23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

In conclusion, a Christian submits their infinite soul as a living sacrifice to God... But every other religion/form of spirituality in the world merely submits the work of their expiring flesh in exchange for temporary peace.

Romans 12:1-2
[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
[2] And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

The pleasures of sin is only for a season:

Hebrews 11:25
[25] Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;

...

But if you insist on maintaining guiltless pleasure in your life & thereby risking going to hell for eternity because you'd rather believe that one neurotransmitter is the crux of the reason why every person is born fearing death, then God help your soul.

1 Timothy 6:20
[20] O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

Romans 8:15
[15] For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

2 Thessalonians 2:8-12
[8] And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
[9] Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
[10] And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
[11] And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
[12] That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

_______________________
***Regarding hell, it is the place where the worm dieth not and the fire is not quenched:

Mark 9:43-48
[43] And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
[44] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
[45] And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
[46] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
[47] And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
[48] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

*Similarly, the rich man in torment:

Luke 16:22-25
[22] And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
[23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
[24] And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
[25] But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

_______________________

Hebrews 2:14-18
[14] Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
[15] And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
[16] For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
[17] Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
[18] For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

*Again, death is not a fear of the Christian:

1 Corinthians 15:54-58
[54] So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
[55] O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
[56] The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
[57] But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
[58] Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

_____________________

Lastly, Pascal's wager seems fitting enough to insert as an honorable mention:

In essence - is it more rational to live a life as if God doesn't exist and then come to find out that He does or;
To live a life as if God does exist to then find out that He doesn't?

The primary issue of the railings against Christianity is the assumption that it operates in the same relationship as every 'religion' in the world, making it just a different color of walking stick that isn't any different from Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism, Judaism, etc etc. All of the religions in the world are joined together by the sacrifice of works to this world in order to gain a more favorable outcome in the next life without any certainty that those physical works (like making a pie or saying nice things or giving money to the homeless or chanting a mantra, etc) are going to offer more or less reward. It's all ambiguous, confusing, and as a result, each person lives in their own imagination regarding where they might land on the coming hierarchy/totem pole of the next life.

This leads to a "to each their own" concept where individualism & pride are thereby glorified. If one person releases their stress by sacrificing food to their god and another person sits uselessly in a closet actively trying to dilute their free will by crossing whatever threshold that they believe is a state of 'nothingness,' then more power to each of them, as the philosophy goes.

The hypocrisy of this matter is that anyone who believes this life is left up to the personal, moment-to-moment, ongoing interpretation of one's own imagination which yields their unique, quantum, snowflake experience as the only form of elusive truth in this conscious life right up until the moment they die in total uncertainty (except, conveniently, their certain fear of death)... The hypocrisy is that within this whole paradigm, all that person cares about is their own soul. You see, it's an excuse to not give a ***t about anyone else except for themselves, which is the exact opposite of the whole reason why they let bygones be bygones.

The commonality between the two people who sacrifice food or selfish meditation is that they are both sacrificing the time and effort of their flesh as a work in exchange for temporary peace in this temporal realm. If they have a belief about what comes in the next life, by default they think that their individual soul is more or less righteous than the soul of another by doing these actions, which is simply expressed as "self-righteousness."

Under the circumstance that an individual believes they are the only righteous authority, it shields them from the potential judgement of anyone else because by them being morally correct about their actions, this is also saying in the same breath that everyone else is morally wrong.

Which is why we believe the KJV Bible as the standard of truth, lest we would put the truth of men (instead of God) as the supreme truth... Which will result in things like biological men competing in sporting events against biological women, as one example.

Romans 3:9-10
[9] What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Romans 3:22-23
[22] Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
[23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

In conclusion, a Christian submits their infinite soul as a living sacrifice to God... But every other religion/form of spirituality in the world merely submits the work of their expiring flesh in exchange for temporary peace.

Romans 12:1-2
[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
[2] And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

The pleasures of sin is only for a season:

Hebrews 11:25
[25] Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;

...

But if you insist on maintaining guiltless pleasure in your life & thereby risking going to hell for eternity because you'd rather believe that one neurotransmitter is the crux of the reason why every person is born fearing death, then God help your soul.

1 Timothy 6:20
[20] O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

Romans 8:15
[15] For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

2 Thessalonians 2:8-12
[8] And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
[9] Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
[10] And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
[11] And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
[12] That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

_______________________
***Regarding hell, it is the place where the worm dieth not and the fire is not quenched:

Mark 9:43-48
[43] And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
[44] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
[45] And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
[46] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
[47] And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
[48] Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

*Similarly, the rich man in torment:

Luke 16:22-25
[22] And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
[23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
[24] And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
[25] But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

_______________________

Hebrews 2:14-18
[14] Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
[15] And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
[16] For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
[17] Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
[18] For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

*Again, death is not a fear of the Christian:

1 Corinthians 15:54-58
[54] So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
[55] O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
[56] The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
[57] But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
[58] Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

_____________________

Lastly, Pascal's wager seems fitting enough to insert as an honorable mention:

In essence - is it more rational to live a life as if God doesn't exist and then come to find out that He does or;
To live a life as if God does exist to then find out that He doesn't?

Thank you. I personally don't think any religious text is true. I did enjoy learning the theology of the early church fathers and the eastern christian tradition, which I prefer to the protestant and catholic interpretations;
https://jaysanalysis.com/2019/03/01/plato-aristotle-egypt-and-the-structure-of-reality/
 

mariantos

Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2021
Messages
32
For those who do not yet believe, may God soften your hearts.May God renew your mind, strengthen your spirit, free you from the spirits of wickedness, so that you may direct your steps towards Him! May Jesus Christ cleanse and enlighten your souls!

For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, And every tongue shall confess to God. So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
Romans 14:11‭-‬12
 
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