MORE WEIGHT LOSS TALK

[Vajra]

I am glad your clothes are fitting better! That is a better measure of fat loss, than the scale, as long as you are getting in all that muscle building protein. I did well on a serving of Haagen Daz coffee ice cream, even nights, and never put on fat eating it. I would go back to it if they made a grass fed version, do now I make own. Don't worry, your egg whites wont effect fat loss, I just avoid them because of the tryptophan and histamines. Jennifer recommended the Wendell Estate whipped honey. It is like a cream filled chocolate from a fancy box of chocolatez. I also like it because it isn't so "honey" tasting, making it is a good substitute for white sugar in tea. I am gonna go try some right now in coffee and see how it tastes! Here is pics of it.

What does it taste like? I wasn't so lucky when I ordered some jars; a typical dark gold color, not pale. They say this doesn't change the flavor, but have you ever gotten a darker batch that tasted different? Maybe I'm just associating blindly but all the white honeys I've had were in a league of their own in tastiness - like frosting (i.e. the brand Stakich, which is dark/crystallized sometimes but is otherwise my all-time favorite). And it tasted pretty average, so I'm still seeing a pattern.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

What does it taste like? I wasn't so lucky when I ordered some jars; a typical dark gold color, not pale. They say this doesn't change the flavor, but have you ever gotten a darker batch that tasted different? Maybe I'm just associating blindly but all the white honeys I've had were in a league of their own in tastiness - like frosting (i.e. the brand Stakich, which is dark/crystallized sometimes but is otherwise my all-time favorite). And it tasted pretty average, so I'm still seeing a pattern.

I was buying a whipped honey that was frosting like too, but it still had a honey taste, but then I found that if it sat long enough that it separated with the white whipped part at the top and a dark liquid part at the bottom. It looked suspicious so I threw it out. I took a chance on Wendell Estate honey, because Jennifer talked so highly of it. I now buy 8 jars at a time! It taste more like a cream center in a fancy boxed chocolate. It is addicting by the spoonful, and very dense, but I can put it in coffee or smoothies and it has zero honey flavor. I love it!

 

[stressless]

Here is some easy math to remember:

Sugar + Fat = Fat (remember starches get converted to sugar so this equals baked potato with butter)

Sugar + Starch = Fat (this is sugar on top of sugar, aka cupcakes, and how diabetes happens)

To keep excess fat away, you want to stick to this formula.

Sugar + LEAN Protein = Fat Loss (this is the pairing fats with nonfats idea, example: nonfat milk with honey, fish or cheese with fruit, lean steak with Coke)

When we do eat fat (I don't want to cut it out completely), do you think is it best to eat fat alone?

What about fat + protein? Is this ok for weight loss? I know eating protein without sugar can cause problems so not sure about protein + fat.

This thread has been really helpful! I'm just trying to figure out the best time to eat the fat and what I should pair it with.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

When we do eat fat (I don't want to cut it out completely), do you think is it best to eat fat alone?

What about fat + protein? Is this ok for weight loss? I know eating protein without sugar can cause problems so not sure about protein + fat.

This thread has been really helpful! I'm just trying to figure out the best time to eat the fat and what I should pair it with.

I use fat on nonfat things like butter on broccoli, whole milk on lowfat sprouted rice cereal, egg yolks with non fat milk. I think fat on protein is good, like lean meat with a fatty sauce, but I would eat it closer to night. I agree with you not to totally cut out fat, cause it is necessary for digestion and fends off wrinkles, but it is harder to lose weight on a high fat diet. Nowadays I like to be really lowfat all day with nonfat whipped milk lattes, each with a scoop of gelatin and some sugar and save fattier things for night. I have lost 18 pounds in the last few months keeping my fats very low during the day.

 

[bogbody]

that’s amazing you lost 18 pounds. so are you mostly just having lattes only during the day? also do you use regular gelatin or collagen?

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

that’s amazing you lost 18 pounds. so are you mostly just having lattes only during the day? also do you use regular gelatin or collagen?

Yes I am only having them during the day with a teaspoon of instant coffee, some sugar and nonfat or lowfat milk. I put a tablespoon of Great Lakes collagen powder in each one. I know other people have been doing that, but it didn't sound very good to me. Now with the frothed milk I can't even taste it. The frothed coffee makes a meringue layer, which sprinkle cinnamon sugar on top. That cinnamon sugar gets a little hard like a creme brulee crust. I usually have two of those until about 1:00 then eat lunch, then have another. Then I have an early evening regular cappuccino and then dinner. I don't snack at all now. I also have little shots of milk throughout the day and a big spoonful of honey at bedtime. It wasn't a purposeful strategy to take off weight, but it sure worked. I have lots of energy with my gelatin coffees and each one has 8 grams of protein, before I ever eat.

 

[bogbody]

that sounds delicious!

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Yes I am only having them during the day with a teaspoon of instant coffee, some sugar and nonfat or lowfat milk. I put a tablespoon of Great Lakes collagen powder in each one. I know other people have been doing that, but it didn't sound very good to me. Now with the frothed milk I can't even taste it. The frothed coffee makes a meringue layer, which sprinkle cinnamon sugar on top. That cinnamon sugar gets a little hard like a creme brulee crust. I usually have two of those until about 1:00 then eat lunch, then have another. Then I have an early evening regular cappuccino and then dinner. I don't snack at all now. I also have little shots of milk throughout the day and a big spoonful of honey at bedtime. It wasn't a purposeful strategy to take off weight, but it sure worked. I have lots of energy with my gelatin coffees and each one has 8 grams of protein, before I ever eat.

I am sad to not have more, but not sure how much collagen is too much.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

The gelatin I have been consuming daily for the last couple of months, may be in part why I have lost so much weight so easily.

5 Proven Ways Gelatin Helps Weight Loss - Hollywood Homestead

Learn how the amazing superfood gelatin helps promote weight loss! You can make gelatin work for your weight loss goals by adding it to your diet today.

hollywoodhomestead.com

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Interesting theory @Rinse & rePeat
Personally I don't have experience with it (nor with your way) so I'm just throwing it out there....

Do you know the Croissant diet?(lol...unlike the name, it's not necessarily about eating croissants)
It has some Peat principles; avoid pufas/unsaturated fats and eat only sat.fats high in stearic acid....(so CO fails this test in that regards).
However eating high starch+fat and keep sugar low (protein is unspoken) is said to burn fat on this diet. That basically is the opposite of what you've written.....what are your thoughts on that??

Hi again Dutchie! I came on this thread to look for a RP quote and saw your post. I think I may have responded, but in case I didn't let me say two things about the croissant question. First is that there are numerous ways to lose fat and all are very different, and the croissant diet is one of them. I lost a lit of fat on the mono Diets, potato being my food choice, I have lost fat on a "rotating diet", where I do a diet for 5 days and switch to another one, switching five times for 25 days, and lost a ton of fat. With that being said, though many diets are effective for fat loss, they aren't healthy in the long run and more times than not the fat comes back. I do appreciate the "staying power" of a fresh croissant with extra butter, but it isn't bettering my thyroid relying on that. Protein, calcium, and sugar has been the real key to energy, anti-aging and overall good health for me. I never have digestive issues, headaches, skin or hair challenges or low energy with Ray Peat's suggestions. If you are gonna rely on fat and starches you need to steer clear of the sugar sources, or weight gain is eminent.

 

[Dutchie]

Hi again Dutchie! I came on this thread to look for a RP quote and saw your post. I think I may have responded, but in case I didn't let me say two things about the croissant question. First is that there are numerous ways to lose fat and all are very different, and the croissant diet is one of them. I lost a lit of fat on the mono Diets, potato being my food choice, I have lost fat on a "rotating diet", where I do a diet for 5 days and switch to another one, switching five times for 25 days, and lost a ton of fat. With that being said, though many diets are effective for fat loss, they aren't healthy in the long run and more times than not the fat comes back. I do appreciate the "staying power" of a fresh croissant with extra butter, but it isn't bettering my thyroid relying on that. Protein, calcium, and sugar has been the real key to energy, anti-aging and overall good health for me. I never have digestive issues, headaches, skin or hair challenges or low energy with Ray Peat's suggestions. If you are gonna rely on fat and starches you need to steer clear of the sugar sources, or weight gain is eminent.

lol....I was intrigued by it,but I haven't done it.
Besides I don't feel much of an appetite for starch...well the sources I could try anyway.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

lol....I was intrigued by it,but I haven't done it.
Besides I don't feel much of an appetite for starch...well the sources I could try anyway.

You are a stronger person than me, because it hard for me to pass up a perfect "out of the oven" croissant. I justify it because of it's high butter content

 

[GuitarInnovatio]

Here is some easy math to remember:

Sugar + Fat = Fat (remember starches get converted to sugar so this equals baked potato with butter)

Sugar + Starch = Fat (this is sugar on top of sugar, aka cupcakes, and how diabetes happens)

To keep excess fat away, you want to stick to this formula.

Sugar + LEAN Protein = Fat Loss (this is the pairing fats with nonfats idea, example: nonfat milk with honey, fish or cheese with fruit, lean steak with Coke)

If I am having a starch I keep the rest of ingredients as low in fat as possible, examples:

-my liver tostado, I use as little fat as possible to fry my tostado in as well as the fat I fry my meat in. I use mozzarella which has 30% less fat and I dont use sour cream.

-A hamburger, I skip the mayo sauces, but have the cheese, pickle, mustard, ketchup and onion and have it lettuce wrapped with a small coke. No fries!

-pizza i will have a couple of bites with the crust (cause the crust converts to sugar, and then just eat the toppings from several pieces after that and throw away the crusts. If you want to stay away from the wheat, have a small coke with it, the toppings is more of that, bad, sugar + fat combo)

Most of the time I go starchless eating things mentioned below:

-I love to eat a pile of shrimp, and do weekly, just steamed and dipped in melted butter! That is a good "fats with nonfats" pairing. It is good to have a little fruit or honey before or a bit after that meal.

-my boil & broil, nearly fat free, wings I pair with a sugary or fruity sauce, and I eat a good amount of these in one sitting!

-a seasoned flat iron steak with sweetened espresso with a half cup of nonfat milk

-seared scallops with fresh tomato cream sauce or a lemon marmalade
and green onion sauce.

-my meatloaf with my pineapple ketchup topping is a favorite just by itself and needs no pairing except an espresso shot to block iron

-fried eggs in butter, seasoned salt and with Chinese 5-Spice and topped with green onion and coconut Aminos needs no pairings

-fruit infused water with a salty mozzarella is a favorite snack

So let's get busy and get that extra fat gone!

This is almost a perfect distillation of the principles, but it's missing a full explanation of which combos are acceptable for meal/snack options.

It appears there are 4 possible fundamental options:

sugar
starch
protein
fat

sugar + lean protein = optimal
fat + protein = optimal
starch + what? = optimal


Do you see what I'm getting at? Could you possibly fill out the rest of the optimal options? Also, does fiber play a role in this? I know that Peat has suggested to cook fibrous vegetables fully to avoid problems. Thanks in advance.

 

[kYgirl]

You are a stronger person than me, because it hard for me to pass up a perfect "out of the oven" croissant. I justify it because of it's high butter content

Hi Rinse! I love seeing your daily food diaries. I went full on Peating two years ago and gained about 15 pounds on my 5’1 frame. It needs to come off and I am learning more from you than anyone. Thanks for all of your insights and help!

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

This is almost a perfect distillation of the principles, but it's missing a full explanation of which combos are acceptable for meal/snack options.

It appears there are 4 possible fundamental options:

sugar
starch
protein
fat

sugar + protein = optimal
fat + protein = optimal
starch + what? = optimal


Do you see what I'm getting at? Could you possibly fill out the rest of the optimal options? Also, does fiber play a role in this? I know that Peat has suggested to cook fibrous vegetables fully to avoid problems. Thanks in advance.

I appreciate the question and love the discussion. I do get what you are asking, and upon writing this post, I was only discussing my success losing fat as Ray Peat said was optimal. He does not suggest eating starch, and certainly not for losing weight. I have since found that if one eats starch, to at least maintain their weight, it has to be instead of sugar. Ray Peat says to always pair starches with fats and sugars with proteins. I can lose weight eating a Quesadilla with extra cheese, and though I am following Ray Peat's suggestion, how to best eat starches, it is not optimal and I am not doing anything for my anti-aging goals. As for protein plus fat that would not be optimal, you would still have to pair it with a sugar/carb and that would not equate to fat loss.

Examples of snacks that promote weight loss for me would be mozzarella slices dipped in salsa instead of chips, a hard boiled egg with a chunk of honeycomb, a small bowl of sprouted brown rice cereal and milk or pics I attached here. I have never enjoyed my food in tandem with good health as much until "Peating".

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Hi Rinse! I love seeing your daily food diaries. I went full on Peating two years ago and gained about 15 pounds on my 5’1 frame. It needs to come off and I am learning more from you than anyone. Thanks for all of your insights and help!

Oh now that really inspired me to be even more creative and keep sharing! Thank you for encouraging me! With proper pairings and lower fats it does come off. I do not eat whole fruit, only strained juices from fresh or frozen fruit. I do eat honey, sometimes a lot, and sometimes none. Sugar is not evil, but I ditched the Mexican Coke, and feel it proved it's point, but I was missing out on nutrients drinking it. In the beginning, finding Ray Peat, I found coffee ice cream to be valuable, and I was big into meat and seafood, but now I find that very little meat and seafood feels better, and dairy plays a bigger part in my daily diet now, from mostly milk, non-fat and raw whole, depending on what I am having it with. Remember milk has it's own sugars so it stands alone pretty good as a meal replacement. I just pour 2+ cups of it over ice and keep my focus on being busy, sipping it, instead of overthinking things trying to hit perfect numbers. You are gonna have to be mindful about hitting those high protein and calcium numbers to get the unwanted fat off. Again food pairings and low fat are really the key! Let us know here what finally gets things moving in the right direction for you. You can do it kYgirl!

 

[kYgirl]

Oh now that really inspired me to be even more creative and keep sharing! Thank you for encouraging me! With proper pairings and lower fats it does come off. I do not eat whole fruit, only strained juices from fresh or frozen fruit. I do eat honey, sometimes a lot, and sometimes none. Sugar is not evil, but I ditched the Mexican Coke, and feel it proved it's point, but I was missing out on nutrients drinking it. In the beginning, finding Ray Peat, I found coffee ice cream to be valuable, and I was big into meat and seafood, but now I find that very little meat and seafood feels better, and dairy plays a bigger part in my daily diet now, from mostly milk, non-fat and raw whole, depending on what I am having it with. Remember milk has it's own sugars so it stands alone pretty good as a meal replacement. I just pour 2+ cups of it over ice and keep my focus on being busy, sipping it, instead of overthinking things trying to hit perfect numbers. You are gonna have to be mindful about hitting those high protein and calcium numbers to get the unwanted fat off. Again food pairings and low fat are really the key! Let us know here what finally gets things moving in the right direction for you. You can do it kYgirl!

I can’t get raw milk so I buy organic horizon 2%. Do you think that will work? Interestingly every time I start eating yogurt regularly, I gain weight. Regardless of the type, low fat, no fat, Greek or otherwise. Which makes me sad because I love it.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I can’t get raw milk so I buy organic horizon 2%. Do you think that will work? Interestingly every time I start eating yogurt regularly, I gain weight. Regardless of the type, low fat, no fat, Greek or otherwise. Which makes me sad because I love it.

I don't eat yogurt either. My pic with yogurt is a suggestion for those who do. My raw milk dairy farm burned down, more thanks month ago, so I switched to Strauss nonfat and whole. It has been just fine. Fats are better at night for sleep and lowfat keeps my energy up during the day.

 

[Dutchie]

You are a stronger person than me, because it hard for me to pass up a perfect "out of the oven" croissant. I justify it because of it's high butter content

The 'diet' isn"t about eating croissants anyway. Gluten is not for me.
Aside from all of that, my croissant eating days are left in my childhood, bc no one has ever equalled the croissants my dad used to make.?

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

The 'diet' isn"t about eating croissants anyway. Gluten is not for me.
Aside from all of that, my croissant eating days are left in my childhood, bc no one has ever equalled the croissants my dad used to make.?

Oh you lucky!