MitoLipin - Dietary Supplement For Cardiolipin And Mitochondria Support

Discussion in 'IdeaLabs' started by haidut, Apr 1, 2016.

  1. tara

    tara Member

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    Nice stories. :)
     
  2. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    MitoLipin may help as saturated PC has been used for decades in Europe as a drug for liver disease (especially fibrosis/cirrhosis). I think starting with a single dose of 40 drops split into 10-15 drops with each meal would be enough. You can take more but even 1 dose should have an effect. From the supplements you listed I think vitamin K (Kuinone or other vendor) can be taken in pretty much any dose and Lapodin can also be increased if needed. The rest look fine. For fibrotic conditions, vitamin K, caffeine, low dose niacinamide, taurine, emodin, progesterone, aspirin, glycine/gelatin are the most helpful. You probably don't need all of these supplements at the same time, but if you feel find on them I would retest liver enzymes in a month and then maybe drop everything except the low dose niacinamide, vitamin K, emodin, and aspirin.
    Doctors give prednisone b/c this is the emergency treatment for acute inflammation. They either do not give much thought to the side effects or are taught that the side effects are unavoidable and something to be "managed" with other more less toxic drugs. Such is the state of medicine we pay dearly for. It has actually regressed in terms of effectiveness since the mid 19th century.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I think it should make thyroid more effective as the effects of thyroid depend on cell PUFA status. If there is too much PUFA it can occupy both the thyroid transport protein in the blood AND the thyroid receptor inside the cell. Saturated PC should be able to displace the PUFA from the cell over time and thus increase thyroid effectiveness. I just don't know how long it needs to be taken for that effect, but the animal studies show effects on cardiolipin within 4-8 weeks.
     
  4. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    That is actually a really good idea! Peat has already written about the benefits of vitamin E as steroid carrier, and some of the studies I posted in the original MitoLipin post talk about using PC as a highly effective carrier for drugs directly into the mitochondria. So, dissolving progesteron and/or DHEA or even thyroid into MitoLipin may be a great way to deliver them directly into mitochondria with very little wastage.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Thanks for sharing! Keep us posted on how it goes.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Well, I think everything is subject to damage by X-Rays but I have not seen anything on airport scanner somehow spoiling supplements. I doubt it degrades the PC from a such a brief exposure.
     
  7. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Other than the 600 IU vitamin E you get from each dose, I don't know of anything else that has to be considered when taking higher doses. The human trials with UC and Chron's used 3g a day for months without any side effects.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    There are animal studies showing beneficial effects on the liver from as little as a human dose of 100mg daily. So, how much you take is up to you and the doctor and considering each dose has 600 IU (400mg) of vitamin E.
     
  9. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Each dose has 400mg (which is about 600 IU) of mixed tocopherols.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I think the high dose vitamin E in MitoLipin may need to be taken into account by people prone to bleeding. So, adding some vitamin K2 may not be a bad idea. Other than that, I am not aware of any data on PC leading to deficiencies of any sort or requiring supplementing with other nutrients. The suggestion to take with meal was Peat's and I thought it is not a bad idea given the GI upset some people get when ingesting vitamin E on empty stomach. But the fat in MitoLipin is enough to make it not need additional fat intake for absorption. Blending with butter is a great idea. All ingredients in MitoLipin are fully saturated and should not spoil for years to come. In fact, they may even protect the small residual amount of PUFA in butter from going rancid.
     
  11. allblues

    allblues Member

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    Cool! I was sure you'd have tried this already :)
    I'm asking on behalf of a family member who one day asked me what i was up to with all these little bottles.
    I got her interested in trying pregnenolone, but thought DMSO might put her off, if she has a skin reaction.
    I'll definitely try mixing some pregnenolone powder with the MitoLipin.
    If it works, it sounds almost like a speedball of peatdom.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    This is awesome! Thanks for sharing.
    The tired feeling is probably from the progesterone effects of high dose vitamin E. I also find topical MitoLipin to give me an energy boost while oral makes me sleepy. I do like the sleepy feeling as well, so I take at night sometimes.
     
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    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I will post in the Kuinone thread as well but just wanted to share this here too. Due to the large number of reports on Kuinone staining, we are using a batch that has a much paler yellow color and it should not stain. I will see how this batch fares and if it is liked just as much as the staining batch we will stick to using the non-staining version. Vitamin K2 can vary in color from almost pure white to bright yellow/orange. People who have used the vitamin K2 pills from VRP, Relentless Improvement, etc have seen this - i.e. they all vary in color even though chemically it is the same vitamin K2 (or at least it has the same CAS number).
     
  14. allblues

    allblues Member

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    Regarding @Jayfish comment, the part about losing fat where MitoLipin was used;

    I know PUFAs are preferentially stored - is there any way the PUFA can be saturated when stored?
    In this case, could MitoLipin be saturating the local fat tissues, making the fats more suitable and likely to be burned?
    I've been wondering this about vitamin E, also. If my physiologizing is off, please set me straight.

    Regardless, i'm definitely putting some on my slight cortisol belly.
     
  15. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Peat has a quote in one of his articles about vitamin E having no known metabolic role that does not somehow include the saturation of PUFA.
    Vitamin E: Estrogen antagonist, energy promoter, and anti-inflammatory
    "..."No metabolic function is known for alpha-tocopherolquinol or its quinone other than as a cofactor in the biohydrogenation of unsaturated fatty acids that can be carried out by only a few organisms."

    So, vitamin E on its own and especially when combined with the saturated PC and the MCT in MitiLipin should be able to re-saturate fat in fatty cells. I seem to remember somebody post an experiment back in 2014 showing that topical vitamin E lowered their blood levels of PUFA FFA and raised saturated blood FFA.
     
  16. Jayfish

    Jayfish Member

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    Should I be concerned at all with taking both estroban and mitolipon and maybe adding in progest-e? All topically. Is this too much e? I'm also taking k2.
     
  17. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Vitamin E, progesterone, and vitamin A can all thin the blood when used on their own. Together, the effects is probably much more potent. So, keeping that vitamin K intake is crucial. Nobody knows how much vitamin E is "too much". It depends on a host of factors like age, PUFA stores, iron saturation, estrogen levels, etc and those are all different for different people.
     
  18. Peata

    Peata Member

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    Anyone find themselves more prone to headache from taking it? I don't know if that's why, but I noticed since I started using it that something can set off a headache easier, whether it's stress, heat, too much caffeine without enough food, etc. The headache is located between brows and/or above brows/center of forehead when I get it. I tend to need ibuprofen to make it go away and/or a night's sleep. Eating food doesn't necessarily help, so I'm not sure it's a blood sugar thing. It could be a coincidence. Or could MitoLipin be making me more sensitive or is it a product of raising metabolism?
     
  19. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    MitoLipin has a decent amount of vitamin E in every dose and tocopherols can give that headache side effect. I doubt it is the saturated PC as I a few people have tried it on its own and it has no side effects except raising temps quite a bit in one person. Have you measured your temps when you get the headache?
     
  20. Soren

    Soren Member

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    Would MitoLipin have any potential benefit for those suffering from Opiate withdrawal and if so how?

    Thanks.
     
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