Metformin And Erection Quality

RNR

Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2019
Messages
5
Hey Gents - new to the forum and I thought I'd query the hive mind and see if anyone has some insight into something I've discovered.

Earlier this year I ran a trial with Metformin. Overall the results were:

- Def got some lactic acid type symptoms (tight hands), tiredness, and it raised my AST/ALT/B12 numbers so I dropped it after about 6 weeks.
- However, one quite amazing benefit of it was it gave me amazing erection quality, like nothing else has ever done.

I couldn't figure out why in the world Metformin would improve EQ so dramatically, so I read thru some studies and came across this one by some researchers from Yale - Effects of metformin on endothelial health and erectile dysfunction

In that paper they highlight 3 problem areas in which Metformin could help: "Specific to arteriogenic ED, three major mechanisms have been identified: (I) Endothelium-dependent vasodilatory impairment, mediated by reduced bioavailability of nitric oxide (NO); (II) Sympathetic nerve activity elevation, resulting in enhanced basal and myogenic tone within the corpus cavernosum; (III) Atherosclerotic luminal narrowing, yielding reduced penile arterial inflow (3)."

Later on they write: "Sympathetic hyperactivity has been known to occur both in essential hypertension as well as diabetes mellitus (28-30). Elevated levels of norepinephrine, a well-established marker for sympathetic hyperactivity"

I'm guessing this is why it helped me so much. I've alpha blockers, blood pressure meds, etc., and other ways to block/lower norepinephrine, but nothing worked like Metformin did.

Many of you are probably thinking 'well it's because you're insulin resistant'. This is possible, but my blood levels don't indicate that (normal BP, fasting insulin sub 5, hbA1c 5, GGT normal, blood sugar normal and I can eat carbs no problem and I'm very fit/lean). However, my SHBG is somewhat low at 23 (tested 4x over 5 years). I'm a bit of a unique case as I had chemo therapy when I was younger and it seems my liver has been sensitive/ ever since.

The rest of my hormones are in good to optimal range, though I could probably raise my t3/t4 levels a bit (but TSH is around 1.25).

My question is, what other ways are there to get this effect that Metformin produced? What other methods, either via drugs or diet can we do to lower sympathetic hyperactivity? It seems all pharma drugs I've tried have major side effect trade offs. Berberine works somewhat, but not near the level to which Metformin did.

Appreciate any feedback.
 

Vinny

Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2018
Messages
1,438
Age
51
Location
Sofia, Bulgaria
Hey Gents - new to the forum and I thought I'd query the hive mind and see if anyone has some insight into something I've discovered.

Earlier this year I ran a trial with Metformin. Overall the results were:

- Def got some lactic acid type symptoms (tight hands), tiredness, and it raised my AST/ALT/B12 numbers so I dropped it after about 6 weeks.
- However, one quite amazing benefit of it was it gave me amazing erection quality, like nothing else has ever done.

I couldn't figure out why in the world Metformin would improve EQ so dramatically, so I read thru some studies and came across this one by some researchers from Yale - Effects of metformin on endothelial health and erectile dysfunction

In that paper they highlight 3 problem areas in which Metformin could help: "Specific to arteriogenic ED, three major mechanisms have been identified: (I) Endothelium-dependent vasodilatory impairment, mediated by reduced bioavailability of nitric oxide (NO); (II) Sympathetic nerve activity elevation, resulting in enhanced basal and myogenic tone within the corpus cavernosum; (III) Atherosclerotic luminal narrowing, yielding reduced penile arterial inflow (3)."

Later on they write: "Sympathetic hyperactivity has been known to occur both in essential hypertension as well as diabetes mellitus (28-30). Elevated levels of norepinephrine, a well-established marker for sympathetic hyperactivity"

I'm guessing this is why it helped me so much. I've alpha blockers, blood pressure meds, etc., and other ways to block/lower norepinephrine, but nothing worked like Metformin did.

Many of you are probably thinking 'well it's because you're insulin resistant'. This is possible, but my blood levels don't indicate that (normal BP, fasting insulin sub 5, hbA1c 5, GGT normal, blood sugar normal and I can eat carbs no problem and I'm very fit/lean). However, my SHBG is somewhat low at 23 (tested 4x over 5 years). I'm a bit of a unique case as I had chemo therapy when I was younger and it seems my liver has been sensitive/ ever since.

The rest of my hormones are in good to optimal range, though I could probably raise my t3/t4 levels a bit (but TSH is around 1.25).

My question is, what other ways are there to get this effect that Metformin produced? What other methods, either via drugs or diet can we do to lower sympathetic hyperactivity? It seems all pharma drugs I've tried have major side effect trade offs. Berberine works somewhat, but not near the level to which Metformin did.

Appreciate any feedback.
I don`t know why Met did such an amazing job to you, but I wonder also, for what reason did you take it since you have no issues with diabetes? Where you expecting positive effect on erection quality?
 

Andreas

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
19
It increases enos that's why.
I wouldn't touch metformin tho.
Try garlic + Vitamin C, Olive leaf extract, Pycnogenol, tribulus, icariin or forskolin. Berberine is another one but it seems anti androgenic.
 
Last edited:

Kingpinguin

Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2019
Messages
586
It increases enos that's why.

Hey Gents - new to the forum and I thought I'd query the hive mind and see if anyone has some insight into something I've discovered.

Earlier this year I ran a trial with Metformin. Overall the results were:

- Def got some lactic acid type symptoms (tight hands), tiredness, and it raised my AST/ALT/B12 numbers so I dropped it after about 6 weeks.
- However, one quite amazing benefit of it was it gave me amazing erection quality, like nothing else has ever done.

I couldn't figure out why in the world Metformin would improve EQ so dramatically, so I read thru some studies and came across this one by some researchers from Yale - Effects of metformin on endothelial health and erectile dysfunction

In that paper they highlight 3 problem areas in which Metformin could help: "Specific to arteriogenic ED, three major mechanisms have been identified: (I) Endothelium-dependent vasodilatory impairment, mediated by reduced bioavailability of nitric oxide (NO); (II) Sympathetic nerve activity elevation, resulting in enhanced basal and myogenic tone within the corpus cavernosum; (III) Atherosclerotic luminal narrowing, yielding reduced penile arterial inflow (3)."

Later on they write: "Sympathetic hyperactivity has been known to occur both in essential hypertension as well as diabetes mellitus (28-30). Elevated levels of norepinephrine, a well-established marker for sympathetic hyperactivity"

I'm guessing this is why it helped me so much. I've alpha blockers, blood pressure meds, etc., and other ways to block/lower norepinephrine, but nothing worked like Metformin did.

Many of you are probably thinking 'well it's because you're insulin resistant'. This is possible, but my blood levels don't indicate that (normal BP, fasting insulin sub 5, hbA1c 5, GGT normal, blood sugar normal and I can eat carbs no problem and I'm very fit/lean). However, my SHBG is somewhat low at 23 (tested 4x over 5 years). I'm a bit of a unique case as I had chemo therapy when I was younger and it seems my liver has been sensitive/ ever since.

The rest of my hormones are in good to optimal range, though I could probably raise my t3/t4 levels a bit (but TSH is around 1.25).

My question is, what other ways are there to get this effect that Metformin produced? What other methods, either via drugs or diet can we do to lower sympathetic hyperactivity? It seems all pharma drugs I've tried have major side effect trade offs. Berberine works somewhat, but not near the level to which Metformin did.

Appreciate any feedback.

Yes just like sildenafil AKA viagra. Metformin increases cyclic GMP this causes nitric oxide release leading to increased PKG resulting in reduced cellular calcium thus relaxing smooth muscles. The mechanism is slightly different as metformin increases cGMP synthesis and viagra increases cGMP by blocking its break down.

It also stimulates brain nitric oxide which in turn triggers dopamine release in the medial preoptic area which controles desire and sexual lust completely in males. So its a jackpot on all levels. Both increasing lust and increasing your ability for erections.


Preoptic area - Wikipedia

”In male rats, the mPOA affects the consummatory phase of sexual behavior, and possibly motivation, with lesions causing a complete loss of copulatory behaviors.[9]Conversely, electrical stimulation of this area triggers male copulatory behavior, as measured by decreases in the latency to ejaculate.[10] Furthermore, testosteroneimplanted into the mPOA of castrated males completely restores mating, as long as aromatase is not inhibited.[11]

Like to note the last section. As long as aromatase is not inhibited testosterone restores mating completely. Thats funny since some forum gurus promote complete estrogen suppression when clearly its essential not only for normal nitric oxide release but also for the brain and its response to testosterone and a healthy libido and dopamine signalling. I personally tried aromatase inhibitors and it completely kills libido.
 

Tarmander

Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2015
Messages
3,763
Berberine will help with Blood sugars and has some PDE5 inhibition for ED. People are replacing metformin for Berberine all over the internet.
 

Aad

Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2019
Messages
431
Hey Gents - new to the forum and I thought I'd query the hive mind and see if anyone has some insight into something I've discovered.

Earlier this year I ran a trial with Metformin. Overall the results were:

- Def got some lactic acid type symptoms (tight hands), tiredness, and it raised my AST/ALT/B12 numbers so I dropped it after about 6 weeks.
- However, one quite amazing benefit of it was it gave me amazing erection quality, like nothing else has ever done.

I couldn't figure out why in the world Metformin would improve EQ so dramatically, so I read thru some studies and came across this one by some researchers from Yale - Effects of metformin on endothelial health and erectile dysfunction

In that paper they highlight 3 problem areas in which Metformin could help: "Specific to arteriogenic ED, three major mechanisms have been identified: (I) Endothelium-dependent vasodilatory impairment, mediated by reduced bioavailability of nitric oxide (NO); (II) Sympathetic nerve activity elevation, resulting in enhanced basal and myogenic tone within the corpus cavernosum; (III) Atherosclerotic luminal narrowing, yielding reduced penile arterial inflow (3)."

Later on they write: "Sympathetic hyperactivity has been known to occur both in essential hypertension as well as diabetes mellitus (28-30). Elevated levels of norepinephrine, a well-established marker for sympathetic hyperactivity"

I'm guessing this is why it helped me so much. I've alpha blockers, blood pressure meds, etc., and other ways to block/lower norepinephrine, but nothing worked like Metformin did.

Many of you are probably thinking 'well it's because you're insulin resistant'. This is possible, but my blood levels don't indicate that (normal BP, fasting insulin sub 5, hbA1c 5, GGT normal, blood sugar normal and I can eat carbs no problem and I'm very fit/lean). However, my SHBG is somewhat low at 23 (tested 4x over 5 years). I'm a bit of a unique case as I had chemo therapy when I was younger and it seems my liver has been sensitive/ ever since.

The rest of my hormones are in good to optimal range, though I could probably raise my t3/t4 levels a bit (but TSH is around 1.25).

My question is, what other ways are there to get this effect that Metformin produced? What other methods, either via drugs or diet can we do to lower sympathetic hyperactivity? It seems all pharma drugs I've tried have major side effect trade offs. Berberine works somewhat, but not near the level to which Metformin did.

Appreciate any feedback.

What was your dosage?
 
OP
R

RNR

Member
Joined
Sep 21, 2019
Messages
5
Appreciate the feedback, everyone.

@Aad - I tried 500mg 2x a day but that made me exhausted and gave me fairly bad lactic acid type symptoms. Before I dropped it I was taking 500mg at night and that was still enough to get the EQ effect, but also raised liver enzymes.

@Tarmander - yes Berberine has a bit of the same effect, but not to the degree that Metformin has, as least in my case. It could be that I was under dosing it however.

@Vinny - I live in a country where I can buy it over the counter. I wanted to experiment with it.

@Andreas and @estastichamster - Noted and thanks for the recommendations. I've tried "garlic + Vitamin C, Pycnogenol, tribulus," but never noticed much of a difference. I'll research the others and give them a run.

@Kingpinguin - Great stuff and thanks for the detailed reply. I agree about having a more balanced view of estrogen as well. I'm on trt (medically needed after cancer) and dropped AIs long ago because of the negative effects they had on libido and well-being.
 

rei

Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2017
Messages
1,607
Yes just like sildenafil AKA viagra. Metformin increases cyclic GMP this causes nitric oxide release leading to increased PKG resulting in reduced cellular calcium thus relaxing smooth muscles. The mechanism is slightly different as metformin increases cGMP synthesis and viagra increases cGMP by blocking its break down.

It also stimulates brain nitric oxide which in turn triggers dopamine release in the medial preoptic area which controles desire and sexual lust completely in males. So its a jackpot on all levels. Both increasing lust and increasing your ability for erections.


Preoptic area - Wikipedia

”In male rats, the mPOA affects the consummatory phase of sexual behavior, and possibly motivation, with lesions causing a complete loss of copulatory behaviors.[9]Conversely, electrical stimulation of this area triggers male copulatory behavior, as measured by decreases in the latency to ejaculate.[10] Furthermore, testosteroneimplanted into the mPOA of castrated males completely restores mating, as long as aromatase is not inhibited.[11]

Like to note the last section. As long as aromatase is not inhibited testosterone restores mating completely. Thats funny since some forum gurus promote complete estrogen suppression when clearly its essential not only for normal nitric oxide release but also for the brain and its response to testosterone and a healthy libido and dopamine signalling. I personally tried aromatase inhibitors and it completely kills libido.
Can metformin be addictive since it increases dopamine? Or does brain nos not increas dopamine elsewhere than MPA?

The other quote seems to provide more evidence to the concept that testosterone makes you able, it's conversion into estrogen makes you seek out.

OT: Does anyone have a list on obscure things that raise aromatase activity, especially in the brain? Can foreplay for instance trigger it into overdrive? Can the pain from spanking do it? How about oxygen depletion when giving head? Hyperventilation? Can it be that the MPA estrogenic tone is increasing for the whole time during sex, and orgasm is the result when the excitatory action of estrogen reaches a treshold? Like a localized epileptic episode, as epilepsy is a known effect of excess estrogen. It would also provide a good research direction for premature ejaculation. If your baseline estrogen is high, magnesium low etc. then there might not be very much room for estrogen to increase before the threshold is reached. This would be the sex maniac that nuts already during blowjob.
 
Last edited:

schultz

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2014
Messages
2,653
Like some other pharmaceutical drugs, Metformin has some accidental positive benefits. People don't like this about drugs, but usually the reality is they do more things than just the one thing they were 'designed' for (like AI's, which I imagine do more than just lower aromatase, though I still see people and science publications talking about AI's like they are a synonym for low estrogen)

I was doing some research and came across a study on Metformin and LPS. Knowing about the connection between LPS and diabetes I thought it was quite interesting that Metformin seems to have a positive effect on LPS in the body. It turns out there are quite a few studies on Metformin and LPS. I think Metformin can actually help diabetes, but not necessarily because it lowers blood sugar, but in spite of it lowering blood sugar. I think Metformin should be thought of as a 'gut drug', one that helps lower intestinal inflammation and LPS. Acknowledging this stuff is actually pretty important. If Metformin works by lower LPS and intestinal inflammation, is that in concert with its effects on blood sugar or in spite of it? If these questions are asked then I think science can find its way. Instead, I think the community will just think 'well, we know sugar is bad, so that fact that it lowers sugar has to be good'. Whatever. But it is important to understand these things because it will allow us to come up with better solutions. Orange juice lowers endotoxin, and is not toxic like Metformin... just sayin'.

I was posting on another thread recently talking about how it is common in the scientific community to use high-fat diets to induce diabetes in test subjects. Notice this in the last study I posted below. It is well know that high-fat diets increase endotoxin. It is also well known that endotoxin contributes to diabetes. The connections are not that hard to see. Meanwhile I've never heard any mainstream person talk about LPS.

Metabolic endotoxemia and diabetes mellitus: A systematic review. - PubMed - NCBI
"Most of the studies observed higher LPS or LBP concentrations in diabetic subjects than in healthy controls. T1DM and T2DM subjects presented higher mean fasting LPS of 235.7% and 66.4% compared with non-diabetic subjects, respectively."

Metformin Protects against LPS-Induced Intestinal Barrier Dysfunction by Activating AMPK Pathway. - PubMed - NCBI
Interestingly, metformin treatments attenuated LPS-induced intestinal barrier damage, inflammation, and oxidative stress. We found that metformin improved the expression of intestinal tight junction proteins (ZO1, occludin, and Claudin1) that were reduced by LPS stimulation. Moreover, metformin alleviated LPS-induced NF-κB phosphorylation, promoted Nrf2 nuclear translocation, and increased the expression of the antioxidative genes (HO-1 and NQO-1), leading to reduced intestinal ROS content. Mechanistically, we found that metformin protects against LPS-induced intestinal barrier dysfunction by activating AMPK. These results reveal the potential of metformin as an effective therapy for treating intestinal diseases.

Metformin exerts glucose-lowering action in high-fat fed mice via attenuating endotoxemia and enhancing insulin signaling. - PubMed - NCBI
In high-fat fed mice, metformin restored the tight junction protein occludin-1 levels in gut, reversed the elevated gut permeability and serum LPS levels, and increased the abundance of beneficial bacteria Lactobacillus and Akkermansia muciniphila.

Metformin administration attenuates endotoxemia and enhances insulin signaling in high-fat fed mice, which contributes to its anti-diabetic effects.

... feeding a HFD to mice was found to increase gut gram-negative bacteria, which was shown to be correlated to endotoxemia and insulin resistance.

In addition, we observed that administering exogenous LPS to the mice blocked the improvements of metformin on insulin signaling and glucose tolerance, while antibiotic treatment showed opposite effects to those of LPS. These findings suggest a previously unrecognized role of metformin in modulating gut bacteria and blood LPS levels in its insulin signal-enhancing and glucose-lowering effects.

Treatment with antibiotics alone produced similar effects as metformin did.
 

Max23

Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2018
Messages
490
One supplement that improves erection for me is activated charcoal. It is allergenic for me though.
 

Vinny

Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2018
Messages
1,438
Age
51
Location
Sofia, Bulgaria
Like some other pharmaceutical drugs, Metformin has some accidental positive benefits. People don't like this about drugs, but usually the reality is they do more things than just the one thing they were 'designed' for (like AI's, which I imagine do more than just lower aromatase, though I still see people and science publications talking about AI's like they are a synonym for low estrogen)

I was doing some research and came across a study on Metformin and LPS. Knowing about the connection between LPS and diabetes I thought it was quite interesting that Metformin seems to have a positive effect on LPS in the body. It turns out there are quite a few studies on Metformin and LPS. I think Metformin can actually help diabetes, but not necessarily because it lowers blood sugar, but in spite of it lowering blood sugar. I think Metformin should be thought of as a 'gut drug', one that helps lower intestinal inflammation and LPS. Acknowledging this stuff is actually pretty important. If Metformin works by lower LPS and intestinal inflammation, is that in concert with its effects on blood sugar or in spite of it? If these questions are asked then I think science can find its way. Instead, I think the community will just think 'well, we know sugar is bad, so that fact that it lowers sugar has to be good'. Whatever. But it is important to understand these things because it will allow us to come up with better solutions. Orange juice lowers endotoxin, and is not toxic like Metformin... just sayin'.

I was posting on another thread recently talking about how it is common in the scientific community to use high-fat diets to induce diabetes in test subjects. Notice this in the last study I posted below. It is well know that high-fat diets increase endotoxin. It is also well known that endotoxin contributes to diabetes. The connections are not that hard to see. Meanwhile I've never heard any mainstream person talk about LPS.

Metabolic endotoxemia and diabetes mellitus: A systematic review. - PubMed - NCBI
"Most of the studies observed higher LPS or LBP concentrations in diabetic subjects than in healthy controls. T1DM and T2DM subjects presented higher mean fasting LPS of 235.7% and 66.4% compared with non-diabetic subjects, respectively."

Metformin Protects against LPS-Induced Intestinal Barrier Dysfunction by Activating AMPK Pathway. - PubMed - NCBI
Interestingly, metformin treatments attenuated LPS-induced intestinal barrier damage, inflammation, and oxidative stress. We found that metformin improved the expression of intestinal tight junction proteins (ZO1, occludin, and Claudin1) that were reduced by LPS stimulation. Moreover, metformin alleviated LPS-induced NF-κB phosphorylation, promoted Nrf2 nuclear translocation, and increased the expression of the antioxidative genes (HO-1 and NQO-1), leading to reduced intestinal ROS content. Mechanistically, we found that metformin protects against LPS-induced intestinal barrier dysfunction by activating AMPK. These results reveal the potential of metformin as an effective therapy for treating intestinal diseases.

Metformin exerts glucose-lowering action in high-fat fed mice via attenuating endotoxemia and enhancing insulin signaling. - PubMed - NCBI
In high-fat fed mice, metformin restored the tight junction protein occludin-1 levels in gut, reversed the elevated gut permeability and serum LPS levels, and increased the abundance of beneficial bacteria Lactobacillus and Akkermansia muciniphila.

Metformin administration attenuates endotoxemia and enhances insulin signaling in high-fat fed mice, which contributes to its anti-diabetic effects.

... feeding a HFD to mice was found to increase gut gram-negative bacteria, which was shown to be correlated to endotoxemia and insulin resistance.

In addition, we observed that administering exogenous LPS to the mice blocked the improvements of metformin on insulin signaling and glucose tolerance, while antibiotic treatment showed opposite effects to those of LPS. These findings suggest a previously unrecognized role of metformin in modulating gut bacteria and blood LPS levels in its insulin signal-enhancing and glucose-lowering effects.

Treatment with antibiotics alone produced similar effects as metformin did.
Very interesting, thanks!

Orange juice lowers endotoxin
Really? Are there studies?
And what kind of juice would be better - fresh squeezed or any? Other fruits with such potential?
 
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Messages
10,501
The medical community is in love with metformin. Overwhelming studies are very positive.

For actual use it hasn’t been shown to actually help diabetics. And it has a lot of downsides. I would never use or recommend it.

Association of Metformin, Elevated Homocysteine, and Methylmalonic Acid Levels and Clinically Worsened Diabetic Peripheral Neuropathy
Causes peripheral neuropathy and this may not be due to B12 absorption issues. Probably is not. Contrary to conventional medical thinking.

It increases glycolysis at the expensive of oxidative phosphorylation thus raising lactic acid.

Metformin directly acts on mitochondria to alter cellular bioenergetics
We show that metformin decreases mitochondrial respiration, causing an increase in the fraction of mitochondrial respiration devoted to uncoupling reactions. Thus, cells treated with metformin become energetically inefficient, and display increased aerobic glycolysis and reduced glucose metabolism through the citric acid cycle. Conflicting prior studies proposed mitochondrial complex I or various cytosolic targets for metformin action, but we show that the compound limits respiration and citric acid cycle activity in isolated mitochondria, indicating that at least for these effects, the mitochondrion is the primary target. Finally, we demonstrate that cancer cells exposed to metformin display a greater compensatory increase in aerobic glycolysis than nontransformed cells, highlighting their metabolic vulnerability. Prevention of this compensatory metabolic event in cancer cells significantly impairs survival.
 

schultz

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2014
Messages
2,653
Really? Are there studies?
And what kind of juice would be better - fresh squeezed or any? Other fruits with such potential?

Yah I think this is the classic study... Orange juice neutralizes the proinflammatory effect of a high-fat, high-carbohydrate meal and prevents endotoxin increase and Toll-like receptor ex... - PubMed - NCBI

I think the benefit probably comes from the flavanoids in orange juice (naringenin, hesperidin), so any fruit that has those would probably be beneficial.

The medical community is in love with metformin. Overwhelming studies are very positive.

For actual use it hasn’t been shown to actually help diabetics. And it has a lot of downsides. I would never use or recommend it.

Yah I wouldn't take it. It's possible the endotoxin lowering effect would show quick short term positive effects but in the long run the damage to the glucose metabolism system would manifest. Who knows?
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom