Metabolic Advantage / Fat Free / Foods / Athlete

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tca300

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@tca300 Get you. Hmm same amount of salt i used then. I started taking some creatine today to see if that could help. But yeah i just dont want to rely on all supplements and stuff to fix it. Dammit i want that water retention away so bad.
When I use to take creatine I noticed less water retention under the base level of skin and of course more in the muscle, like it shifted places. Since ATP controlls water balance, its most likely an ATP issue. Creatine probably will help, especially if you do a loading phase, but if you use caffeine or coffee, it might have weird results since it seems they dont get along very well.
 
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tca300

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@superhuman I've personally gotten the most effects from Inosine, topical magnesium chloride, and creatine. Never tried creatine in addition to the other two though.
 
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superhuman

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@tca300 Thank you. I will try the creatine now to see and magnesium. Im doing 3-5 grams a day since im to afraid of the loading/bloating stuff :D

Also have you experimented with fluid intake in terms of water intake when you where not drinking that much milk?
 
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tca300

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@superhuman I haven't. Cheese is lower in nutrition compaired to milk, while fat free varieties are hard to find, typically made with whey, and very expensive. I'm also very hot and would need to drink a bunch of water to make up for the lack of liquid. Meat isn't an option for me for numerous reasons, so milk is my choice for protein.
 
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tca300

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@superhuman I actually did ( not by choice ) lower liquid intake when I was in the hospital for about 1 month ( staying with my wife ) I did cheese and raisins with water for the time I was in there, and I noticed no difference in water retention.
 
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superhuman

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@tca300 i was wondering your take on the estrogen and drinking milk/dairy that a lot of people talk about esp in the bb community. What has been your experience when drinking that much milk vs drinking less etc etc in terms of the testosterone and estrogen side of things
 

Jsaute21

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Not really lol. Maybe 12 hours without eating at most. I read a human study in regards to the 16/8 fasting and even though calories were the same in both groups it showed a drop in T3, testosterone, and co2 in the fasting group. I've been trying to dig it up, but am having trouble finding it. I can lose fat faster and be much warmer now than in my fasting days, plus with my high volume consumption, it would be very difficult, and unpleasant to try to consume all that in 8 hours.

Do you still eat around 6x a day?
 
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tca300

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@tca300 i was wondering your take on the estrogen and drinking milk/dairy that a lot of people talk about esp in the bb community. What has been your experience when drinking that much milk vs drinking less etc etc in terms of the testosterone and estrogen side of things
Before I gave milk a college try, I thought the same. Maybe there is truth to it, but I would imagine it would mostly be a concern as the fat % of the milk went up. Although as travis has pointed out, it seems estrogen in milk binds to the protein, not fat, but the studies are conflicting, so who knows. Also, with how horrendous Ray thinks estrogen is, I cant imagine he would mess with milk if it was that bad. Various people including Ray have had blood estrogen checked while drinking 3+ quarts of milk per day and have normal estrogen levels, myself included. I cant prove anything, just going by my experience, which was weird at first, but after a month or so, never better. Most meats gave me much worse estrogenic symptoms than milk. Beef seemed ok, but I think milk is superior for my personal needs, and what I believe to be true about health and the organism functioning at its highest. You could always experiment!
 
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grenade

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I've been thinking about fat gain and macronutrients recently. In Do Carbohydrates Turn Into Fat? No the image posted indicated that 25% of the energy gained by carbohydrate in an energy excess is used to convert the carbohydrate into fat. In theory, that means you can eat more energy and not gain weight so long as you increase carbohydrates and decrease fat in a certain proportion.

So let's say you start with a diet of 600/60/140 grams of carbs/fat/protein respectively. That would represent a caloric intake of 3500kcal.

Let's say you reduced fat by 20g. That represents a 180kcal reduction, which we can get back by adding 45g of carbohydrate. But, if we consider the above effect, that 25% of carbohydrate energy at a surplus is used and not stored, then we could in theory add 56g of carbohydrate to make up for the loss of 20g fat.

Essentially, what I'm saying is:

600/60/140 (3500kcal) represents the same amount of fat storage (if that were a surplus) as:
656/40/140 (3544kcal).

In short the less fat you eat, the more carbohydrates you can eat (energetically speaking) without gaining weight. Is this conclusion correct? @haidut @Westside PUFAs

If a 600/60/140 (3500kcal) diet represented a calorie maintenance level for a person (no weight gained or lost), then on a fat free diet you could increase carbohydrates by 168g (so 768g total), which would increase total energy intake by 132 calories. So not a lot really, but it's something - certainly a 'metabolic advantage'.

I currently eat around 40g of fat a day, and about 650g of carbohydrate. I don't seem to be getting fatter, although my weight is increasing (which I'd presume to be lean mass).

One thing that isn’t accounted for is the effect of carbs increasing thyroid. That itself would theoretically allow you to even more calories from carbs vs. fat without gaining weight.
 

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