Mercury Chelation To Reverse/prevent Idiopathic Cardiomyopathy?

[burtlancast]

Interesting...Cutler and his proponents would say to remove the amalgams BEFORE engaging in chelation therapy. Scary.

Indeed.
Every healer who has worked to detoxify mercury from sick people knows the most dangerous moment in the treatment is when amalgams are removed.
When you drill into an amalgam with a high speed drill, you release mercury vapors the equivalent of 2000 times the amount outgassing by the said amalgam in a day.

And you never, ever use a lipophilic chelator in the first instance of detox.
I consider Cutler one of the worst criminals i've ever came across.
Hi From Germany

 

[Fractality]

Based on my reading, here is my gameplan. I will undergo either an IV or

sick people knows the most dangerous moment in the treatment is when amalgams are removed.

If that's the case, that may have you just been my greatest exposure. Even egnthough I only had 4-5 amalgams (with 1-2 of them being of the large variety), I did have the big ones removed. My plan of action is try an oral DMPS provocation test before I decide on chelation therapy.

 

[yerrag]

You do one IV seance per week, for 7 months. Then you do a provocation test to see how much your mercury levels have come down, and if necessary do a second 7 months course.

You don't do one IV each day because DMPS empties the mercury in the extra cellular fluids, not the one in the cells. Once the extra cellular mercury has been evacuated, cells will slowly release their excess internal mercury until a new equilibrium is reached.You evacuate it again with DMPS, and so on.

It's only at the end of your detox program, when your extra cellular mercury pool has lowered noticeably that you can safely use DMSA, which will enter cells and the SNC neurons and get the remainder mercury inside these cells.
If you do DMSA when the extra cellular mercury pools are high, you will shift it inside the cells and increase your poisoning.

It's too at this moment that you can safely remove the amalgams; if you do it first, the released excess mercury will possibly wreck your already overburdened detox system.

As far as DMPS dosages, here's what i found:
"Oral doses of 200 to 400 mg in 2-3 divided doses increase the mercury excretion and reduce the body burden in adults"

This is where IV chelation is very burdensome. You're looking at 26 sessions, and possibly 52 sessions. How much does a session cost these days? $100? $200? I don't remember how much it costs anymore, as it's been a long time. I'm not arguing against or doubting its effectiveness, as you very well says it as it is. I may very well have to do this in order to fix my lead toxiity.

I'm not seeing much progress with my oral chelation with PectaClear. That's for sure. I'm worried that you would be right in saying there's no other way but to use DMPS, IV or oral. And I'm hoping I could be able to detox the lead in my kidney with a few modications in my protocol with PectaClear.

I'll continue with the twice daily of Pectaclear (on empty stomach), together with Vitamin E, zinc, P5P, NAC, selenomethionine, and B-complex. If there is progress with just these, it is very slow.
But I'm thinking of taking some natural ACE inhibitors, in the form of wakame seaweed, in order to lower my blood pressure, by lessening the constriction of my blood vessels. This would probably undo the body's mechanism of inducing hypoxia, and would lessen the protection I get from uric acid (to protect against lead toxicity). With the reduction in uric acid levels. I would need another anti-oxidant to counter the lead toxicity. I would need to use mega-dosing of Vitamin C, thinking I'll follow this guy on post 99 by @Elderflower j58 : Linus Pauling May Have Been Vindicated - Vitamin C May Treat Cancer

This is how my thinking goes: The lead is trapped in the endothelial cells of the glomerular capillaries because of the constriction of these capillaries. If the constriction is relieved by the ACE inhibitors, the less constricted capillaries will allow for the lead to be chelated out, and be urinated. Because hypoxis is no longer present to induce uric acid production to protect my kidney, Vitamin C would be needed provide that protection, during that time.

I don't know when I can get started on this, but hopefully soon as I have to find some good sources of vitamin C. I just think that I'm not a unique case; many people have lead toxicity, even without the Flint crisis, and they just don't realize it. When they do, and faced with only one option of having to undergo costly IV chelation, they would balk and never do it. This treatment is expensive, and not many people can afford it, and this is never paid for by insurance. It may be that oral chelation with DMPS would be a viable alternative, and it may just be more convenient as well as less costly. Still, the risk with oral chelation is that it's not done under supervision, and many people will skimp on the supplement needed to replenesh the minerals sucked up by the chelating agent, and they will be left with some damage. So I really hope that oral chelation using solutions such as PectaClear, involving modified citrus pectin and alginates, will be effective, even if on a lower order of effectiveness. This type of solution will not leech needed minerals from the body, which is what they mean when they say it's a "gentler" approach.

I don't doubt IV chelation with DMPS, but I want to consider newer forms of treatment. Is a chelation protocol involving PectaClear really unproven? I don't want to throw the developer, Dr. Isaac Eliaz, under the bus just yet. He developed PectaClear, originally known as PectaSol, not long ago, I think maybe around 12 years ago. For a naturopathic solution to be accepted and ingrained takes a long time.

 

[Travis]

I'm riveted by this whole Cutler deal. I wish @burtlancast could elaborate on how Cutler is spreading disinformation.

 

[burtlancast]

I'm riveted by this whole Cutler deal. I wish @burtlancast could elaborate on how Cutler is spreading disinformation.

It's all here.

 

[Fractality]

Are there any dietary interventions for chelating mercury? I can't seem to find any. However, there has been talk about detoxifying enzymes and the like which I expect would have a dietary element. Would a pro-metabolic diet and supplements help?

 

[burtlancast]

Magnesium has been shown to help detoxify heavy metals.

There's a lot of disinformation about Vit C, chlorella, coriander, germanium, organic silicium, pectin, MSM, chitin, polyphenols, shark liver oil, omegas 3 and 6 able to bind and excrete mercury.
French epidemiologist dr Melet tried them all on live intoxicated patients, and none helped to increase mercury excretion.

But i believe garlic has some merit.

By the way, pectin doesn't cross the intestinal barrier and stays in the digestive tract; how could it bind the mercury in your cells??

 

[Travis]

Garlic actually has sulfur molecules (e.g. allicin). Any molecule with two sulfur atoms spaced close together seems to hold mercury pretty well. There are actually animal feeding experiments which demonstrate this.

 

[burtlancast]

Some of Cutler's most unfortunate claims, from his 1999 book "Amalgam illness"

- pg 73: Take your DMSA/ALA or DMPS/ALA like clockwork
- pg 74: After amalgam removal, use 50-100 mg DMSA every 4 hours on alternate weeks for 3 months, then 50-100 mg DMSA + 25-200 mg ALA every 3-4 hours for 3-4 days per week.
- pg 75: .Remove amalgams and other sources of exposure using any reasonable protocol (e. g.dam and independent breathing air). Expect symptom exacerbation regardless of the care taken during removal. Symptoms can be relieved for a few days by intravenous vitamin C. SMALL doses of DMPS given intravenously (e. g. 25-50 mg) will also relieve symptoms with modest risk of side effects.
.Use oral DMPS by mouth every 8 hours on a week on-week off or 10 day on 4 day off schedule starting no earlier than 4 days after the last amalgam removal, and/or DMSA by mouth every 3-4 hours on the same schedule to suppress urine mercury by 80%. Select dosage on an economic basis. DMSA is more economical per unit mercury removed than DMPS, · but DMPS suppresses symptoms more effectively. Reasonable dosages are 50-300 mg. Always test the chelators for side effects by ramping up dosage from 25 or 50 mg the first time.
.Use lipoic acid every 3-4 hours starting at 25-50 mg and working up to 100-200 mg per dose as side effects are tolerated, plus at the same time use DMPS or DMSA per the above schedule. Do this in campaigns of a few days to a few weeks, with rests in between. Continue for 6 months to 2 years until chelation at high levels is not causing much side effects, uririe mercury is low during chelation, and other symptoms are gone and do not recur after several months without chelation.

ALA has been known for a long time in expert chelation protocols to be a dangerous early chelator, due to his liposolubility:

Alpha lipoic acid is a powerful antioxidant that regenerates other antioxidants (e.g., vitamins E and C, and reduced glutathione) and has metal-chelating activity. Both fat and water soluble, it is readily absorbed from the gut and crosses cellular and blood-brain membrane barriers [22, 53]. Clinical experience is that it must be used carefully as it poses particular risks of redistribution of metals.

Chelation: Harnessing and Enhancing Heavy Metal Detoxification—A Review

Secondly, choosing DMSA over DMPS creates the same problem as with ALA:
DMSA has been shown on some animal models to decrease methylmercury content in rat brains to 35%, while DMPS has not; like ALA, it can cross the brain barrier, shift the newly liberated mercury load into the brain, and further poison the subject.

And even if one uses DMPS instead of DMSA, and no ALA at all, the body might not handle the sudden huge mercury load anyway, being already critically overloaded; the patient will contract MS, leukemia, fibromyalgia, etc...

What must be done instead is:
- use DMPS to slowly decrease the chronic mercury body load and after 6 months or more, remove the amalgams
- after 1-2 years of DMPS, stop it and complete the detox with DMSA and/or ALA to remove any mercury still lodged in brain cells

- pg 15: Two currently popular protocols which do not stand up to any cursory check of efficacy and which have frequent adverse patient reactions are: DMPS injections of 3 mg/kg, or 250 mg, given iv or im monthly; and DMSA 200+ mg by mouth,every other day. These should never be used. The most common DMPS injection adverse reactions follow from redistribution of mercury to the liver and pancreas with consequent damage. The symptoms often appear psychiatric.
- pg 54: The "DMPS challenge" is not a legitimate diagnostic test since over half the population will give a positive result but most of them do not appear to have amalgam illness. In addition there is a high incidence of adverse drug reactions during it, including permanent disability and death. It should never be used. DMSA challenge tests that involve the administration of 500mg - 3g of DMSA as a single dose are also dangerous and not diagnostic. More appropriate challenge tests are described. DMPS and DMSA challenge tests measure the amount of mercury in the kidneys.

Poppycock.
There is simply no evidence in the scientific litterature of "permanent disability and death" or of "redistribution of mercury to the pancreas" from DMPS challenge tests. Cutler is giving no reference for these claims.

Here's a 2009 chelation study for autistic children (3 to 8 years) using a DMSA challenge test of 10mg/kg of DMSA three times a day (thus 30mg total) repeated over 3 days . A 6 year old weighs 20 kilos; that's 600 mg per day, 1800mg in 3 days. Cutler warning of "500mg-3gr" is largely enfringed,with children nonetheless.

Here's another 2009 study where 191 people were administered oral challenge tests with different chelators: the dosage was 10mg/kg DMPS or 30mg/kg DMSA. Considering oral doses are absorbed at 50% for DMPS , it gives us (for an average 70 kg man) 350mg of DMPS, and 2200mg of DMSA, which again are largely above Cutler's warnings.
Incidently, the article states:

DMSA and DMPS: these have been in use as effective chelating agents particularly for Hg,
lead (Pb) and arsenic (As) for many years in Russia (and the USSR), China, Japan,
Germany and the US. They are used orally and parenterally, DMPS more by the latter
route than DMSA [34±37, 41±44]. Therapeutically effective doses of the agents have
proved to be well tolerated, relatively non-toxic and with a wide therapeutic index. They are readily excreted by the kidneys with no nephrotoxicity being reported [35±37, 41, 45,
46]. They can increase the excretion of Cu, and that of Zn somewhat, but other trace
elements do not appear to be significantly affected when therapeutically reasonable doses
are employed [35].

Here's an example of a 37 year old who received 30mg/kg a day of oral DMPS for 5 straight days. That's 1050mg/day for 5 straight days= 5250mg DMPS for a 70kg man, after considering only 50% gets absorbed.

DMPS has been proven not to redistribute mercury to the kidneys and brain in animal models.
It has been officially designated as a safe and effective treatment of mercury and lead poisoning in Germany for the past 40 years.

Now, one might ask why these silly lies by Cutler, especially when himself uses lower doses of DMPS. Cutler's hit job on DMPS and DMSA challenge test fall straight in line with Wikipedia's DMPS page, and especially, with the infamous Stephen Barrett of QUACKWATCH.

Mercury is found in the earth's crust and is ubiquitous in the environment. Thus, even without amalgam fillings, everyone has small but measurable blood and urine levels. Amalgam fillings raise these levels slightly, but this has no clinical significance.

Dubious Mercury Testing

Barrett's article clearly demonstrates how the dentistry industry is deathly afraid of DMPS proving amalgam fillings induce mercury toxicity.
Cutler serves both the purpose of decredibilizing heavy metal diagnostic challenge tests and the treatment it provides, since many people following his criminal advice will feel worse.

 

[yerrag]

I happened upon this clip on Vitamin C Foundation's website:



It's a long video presentation by Jaffe. I'm glad I didn't skip. It gives plenty of good information regarding Vitamin C as a chelator, and he mentions magnesium, and sulfur sources such as garlic, as well as selenomethionine. I'm in the process of putting vitamin C, magnesium, and garlic together in devising a protocol for my own use, and this video seems to affirm I'm headed in the right direction. This is a presentation for the IAOMT. @burtlancast, what are your thoughts on the ideas presented?

 

[burtlancast]

I happened upon this clip on Vitamin C Foundation's website:



It's a long video presentation by Jaffe. I'm glad I didn't skip. It gives plenty of good information regarding Vitamin C as a chelator, and he mentions magnesium, and sulfur sources such as garlic, as well as selenomethionine. I'm in the process of putting vitamin C, magnesium, and garlic together in devising a protocol for my own use, and this video seems to affirm I'm headed in the right direction. This is a presentation for the IAOMT. @burtlancast, what are your thoughts on the ideas presented?

It looks to me the presenter, Mr Jaffe, is mixing truth with falsehood.

It is true Vitamin C accelerates lead excretion; it does not mercury.

Jaffe is claiming (06.55 in the video) an obscure 2002 scientific article proves ascorbates chelate heavy metals, including mercury (Plant responses to abiotic stresses: heavy metal‐induced oxidative stress and protection by mycorrhization)

This article has absolutely nothing to do with heavy metal chelation in humans.
Jaffe shows a slide of his work proving ascorbates chelate mercury without elaborating on the mention "unpublished data" that accompanies it.

The truth has already been written by Thomas Levy:

Because vitamin C has been so effective in clinically reducing
the toxicity of mercury, many have just assumed that vitamin C
chelates (binds) the mercury and hastens its urinary excretion from
the body. However, this does not appear to be the case

 

[yerrag]

Thanks burtlancast for your usual close attention to detail. It is fascinating what Vitamin C does.

Today, I did a vitamin C-flush and got to the flush point at 9 grams of ascorbic acid. I'm still far off from being very healthy, but glad I am not too unhealthy. The less ascorbic acid it takes to get to flush point, the healthier, one is, as explianed in that video. A very healthy person would need only 1000mg to reach flush point, while about 80% of the population need from 10-30g to reach flush point. Above 30 grams are the very unhealthy people.

 

[lollipop]

The less ascorbic acid it takes to get to flush point, the healthier, one is, as explianed in that video. A very healthy person would need only 1000mg to reach flush point, while about 80% of the population need from 10-30g to reach flush point. Above 30 grams are the very unhealthy people.

This is actually very interesting @yerrag and could be a simple way to assess our health as another biomarker like temps and pulse. In my more unhealthy state it took about 15gm. Now there is one thing I remember learning, that there is a tolerance build up over time using Vit C consistently. Might need to use this sort of assessment as a one off when not taking regularly. @Janelle525 have you noticed needing more Vit C over time for the same results?

 

[yerrag]

This is actually very interesting @yerrag and could be a simple way to assess our health as another biomarker like temps and pulse. In my more unhealthy state it took about 15gm. Now there is one thing I remember learning, that there is a tolerance build up over time using Vit C consistently. Might need to use this sort of assessment as a one off when not taking regularly. @Janelle525 have you noticed needing more Vit C over time for the same results?

Indeed I feel the same way about the use of this C-Flush test. Since this test this also used as the basis for daily Vitamin C intake (75% of the amount needed to flush), daily intake of the determined amount is supposed to correct many conditions such that the need for Vitamin C is reduced gradually over time. So, it is recommended to do a C-Flush test from time to time, to determine if the daily intake of Vitamin C can be reduced. The idea is to keep lowering Vitamin C requirements to such pont when daily intake is less than 1000mg, at which point you will be at a very good level of health. So, it seems that tolerance is not supposed to build up over time, but actually the resistance to vitamin C will be developed, in the sense that the body won't take such huge amounts of Vitamin C when it is does not need it anymore. Vitamin C, to me, is like a crutch that does not want to be a crutch.

 

[Travis]

Indeed.
Every healer who has worked to detoxify mercury from sick people knows the most dangerous moment in the treatment is when amalgams are removed.
When you drill into an amalgam with a high speed drill, you release mercury vapors the equivalent of 2000 times the amount outgassing by the said amalgam in a day.

And you never, ever use a lipophilic chelator in the first instance of detox.
I consider Cutler one of the worst criminals i've ever came across.
Hi From Germany

I've read a few Shelton books, Tilden books, Ehret books, and other such books about ten years ago. Do you recall, if you don't mind me asking, how many cases of changes in visual acuity were noted? I do remember hearing some, but I can't recall which author had written the most about this topic.

I am highly interested in eyesight at the moment.

 

[burtlancast]

I havn't read these people yet.

 

[Travis]

I havn't read these people yet.

Oh. I'd just assumed that you had given the Gerson pic (but probably not a fair assumption considering the only two Huxley books I've read had been A Brave New World and Chrome Yellow). I've read a few books on fasting a long time ago but I can't recall ever reading a Gerson book. Let me try to refresh my memory on the soilandhealth.org website.. . . Nope. They're all in German and I don't know German well‐enough to read it efficiently.

I'm thinking that some forms of myopia could be subclinical cataract; that is to say, the same eyechanges which occur during cataract occur normally albeit at a slower rate. These are called either methylglyoxal–arginine adducts, 'glycation' reactions, or Maillard products—depending on who you read. The cornea is collagen, and methylglyoxal appears to play a role in forming the crosslinks as it ages. These same products are found in the urine and used as a marker for bone turnover, as the bone is largely aged collagen and hydroxyapatite.

Methylglyoxal is well‐regulated within the cell: Extracellular methylglyoxal however, as in diabetes, can contribute to collagen aging (crosslinking.)

Refractive changes of the lens have been measured in cataracts, and refractive changes of the lens occur in myopia. Hyperglycemia has long been shown to cause vision disturbances—in fact, nothing is more correlated. I think the same chemical mechanisms of collagen crosslinking can be applied to the cornea—which is, fundamentally, collagen—and can be considered the fundamental mechanism of cataract and refractive changes (although, more subtle forms of myopia appear to be cornea‐independent: associated with the retinal rod and cone cells.)

 

[TreasureVibe]

Is succinic acid safe for mercury when still having amalgam fillings? And at high doses? A low dose made me feel very unfocused in the brain But a high dose made me more clear minded.

 

[Travis]

Is succinic acid safe for mercury when still having amalgam fillings? And at high doses? A low dose made me feel very unfocused in the brain But a high dose made me more clear minded.

I think it should be safe. Mercury seems to have a peculiar affinity for thiols, so whatever is not in the filling is likely bound to glutathione or structural cysteine. Succinate doesn't appear to have much affinity for mercury as it can be separated from them using amines. I think electron donors and/or acceptors are more of a risk factor, and just having another metal in the mouth besides mercury—having a different redox potential—is thought to increase Hg²⁺ liberation. Of course pH is also a factor, so keeping the fillings as basic as possible might be a good idea. (And perhaps even coated with lipids such as those found in cheese, chocolate, and coconuts).

 

[TreasureVibe]

I would not do chelation therapy in your state. I have done comparison in testing intracellular levels, hair, urine etc. Apparently no-one that I know has bothered to check how quickly you can change levels intracellularly. I have and have been surprised that levels can change overnight intracellularly. To see changes in the hair takes minimum of three months and I have seen no changes in some nasty heavy metals over a 5 years period in individuals that have undergone chelation therapy. These individuals have come to me after disastrous decline in their health after chelation.

I have only tested myself from one meal to the next in trying to shift levels. The guy who demonstrated the intracellular equipment to me has been testing for 30 years said that I must be a super responder. I absorb minerals efficiently. I don't think that I am any different to other people. How can he say this as no-one has tested to see how quickly levels can be manipulated in a number of individuals. I tested it because I was curious and had the technology available to me to trial for free. He told me that he has never seen it happen beause no-one is going to pay the money to test themselves from one meal to the next. Mind you I shifted the changes in the nutrient minerals and heavy metals like mercury with food and not supplements. He kept trying to convince me that I needed to take supplements to get my levels optimised. I showed him how easy it was to do it with food. He put it down to me being an efficient absorber and having extremely permeable cells. Must be from all the potassium rich foods and juices.

Eatng lamb and liver the nigh before corrected my zinc to copper ratio by the next day mid morning. Last year I tested eating prawns and oysters to see whether my selenium bumped up to normal overnight and mercury came in at normal levels. My zinc/copper ratio came in perfect. This year I focussed on bringing up molybdenum and chromium. These two have been really difficult for me to bring into optimal range. Molydenum into normal but chromium needs more focus in shifting into the normal range.

The most shocking for me was iodine. My urinary iodine looks perfect but intracellularly looks shocking. After seeing my results, I don't trust the urinary iodine test. I have upped my shellfish consumption back to 3 times a week and milk. I had drop the amount of milk I was drinking and replaced it with tea. Tea is high fluoride which displaces iodine; so not good for me.



Most likely cause is a thiamine deficiency and if you combine it with hypothyroidism = heart failure. Copper is important for the heart and is the reason I would not attempt chelation therapy unless you know your copper status. Your mother may have had a thiamine deficieny or it may have been passed down through generations. Are/were your relative big drinkers??

Genetic conditions are often due to mineral and vitamin deficiencies that are never corrected and passed on to the next generation.

Thiamine supplementation on its own can reverse heart failure. So I would start here. If you have been placed on duretics like frusemide, then thiamine will be depleted at a faster rate resulting in heart failure.

Beriberi (Thiamine Deficiency) Clinical Presentation: History and Physical Examination

You need to do IV thiamine if you condition is serious. There are no known side-effects from taking high dose thiamine.

I would also look at thyroid hormones and progesterone but not chelation therapy.

What chelation agents lower body copper levels and can this be dangerous for aneurysm, like abdominal aortic aneurysm?