MB & Red light - danny’s latest GE podcast episode

[fever257]

Georgi and dannt discuss MB + red light on danny’s latest podcast.

G: Have you seen the patents Pfizer filed, they call it photodynamic therapy with methylene blue and red light?

R: Uh, Yeah, but that’s to kill viruses basically.

G: Uh, they also claim - I mean the patent is specifically for cancer, they’re saying instead of giving you toxic drugs that increase ROS, which is gonna give you methylene blue and hen irriadiate you, and then they’ll achieve the same ROS generation, which, I think is dangerous, right?

R: “Yes, it’s the same as most chemotherapies. They hope it’s more specific to the cancer than to your brain cells. But, it always kills a lot of your brain cells.”

G: If someone, especially in this day and age of covid, if they’re really afraid of the virus, and they think they have it, would like a controlled version of this - let’s say just a few mg of MB and red light, would that a be a good antiviral therapy?

R: Only good in the sense that it’s less toxic as some other things. But, I wouldn’t recommend it.


I won’t lie i’m annoyed. I was under the impression that this was safe. My understanding was that ALL quinones are safe, energy optimizing molecules. Apparently they’re not. Thoughts?

 

[Art1h_]

Bump

 

[Grapelander]

Methylene Blue As A Photosensitizer in Light Therapy
Mentions methylene blue, curcumin and riboflavin as photosensitizers.
Based on prior post - probably good to take any of these with caffeine.

 

[golder]

Yeah I won’t lie, I’m now completely confused by MB + light, or any quinone + light.

 

[forterpride]

Yeah I won’t lie, I’m now completely confused by MB + light, or any quinone + light.

Me too. I always thought that Danny championed Methlyn Blue and Red Light. What the heck?

 

[Nebula]

Me too. I always thought that Danny championed Methlyn Blue and Red Light. What the heck?

That was haidut. I have my doubts about how safe it is too. One summer I was taking large doses for a week and sunbathing a little. My skin felt like it was getting sun burnt one afternoon but it wasn’t. Something else was happening, maybe excessive ROS?

 

[forterpride]

That was haidut. I have my doubts about how safe it is too. One summer I was taking large doses for a week and sunbathing a little. My skin felt like it was getting sun burnt one afternoon but it wasn’t. Something else was happening, maybe excessive ROS?

I only take one drop of methlyn blue and use my red light helmet 3x a week for 20 minutes. Can’t give up my red light helmet though as it effectively stopped my shedding

 

[David PS]

I have been careful with MB since I learned that it builds up in the liposomes over time. I have found Ray to be strangely silent about methylene blue. It was good that he voiced some disapproval.

I like to try to evaluate substances in terms of a benefit vs the burden analysis. There are lots of good information of on the forum about the benefits of MB. The accumulation of MB in the liposomes is the main burden that concerns me. Taking a maintenance amount of MB everyday would make it a persistent man-made chemical in my body. I cycle it.

In Vitro Photodynamic Activity of a Series of Methylene Blue Analogues​

ABSTRACT​

We have synthesized a series of symmetrical phenothiazines in which the methyl groups of methylene blue have been substituted by longer alkyl chains. Intrinsic photosensitizing ability was not altered by increasing the chain length. However, in vitro phototoxicity after 2 h incubation of RIF-1 murine fibrosarcoma cells followed the order n-propyl > n-pentyl > n-butyl > n-hexyl > ethyl > methyl, with ethyl and n-propyl analogues being 14- and 130-fold more phototoxic than methylene blue, respectively. All analogues also had an improved ratio of phototoxicity : dark toxicity (4:1 to 27:1) compared with methylene blue (3:1). Phototoxicity did not correlate with cellular phenothiazine levels, suggesting that the site of subcellular localization may be more important. After 2 h incubation of RIF-1 cells with the phototoxicity LD50 concentration, methylene blue and all analogues were observed to be localized in the lysosomes by fluorescence microscopy. On exposure to light, methylene blue relocalized to the nucleus, the ethyl analogue did not relocalize, whereas the more phototoxic n-propyl –n-hexyl analogues relocalized to the mitochondria. Relocalization to the mitochondria was associated with an octanol : buffer partition coefficient ≥ 1. Therefore, the longer-chain analogues of methylene blue show significantly improved phototoxicity in vitro and, in addition, are expected to avoid the problems of mutagenicity associated with the nuclear localization of methylene blue.

US10335488B2 - Method for treating cancer by photodynamic therapy - Google Patents​

The present invention discloses a method for treating cancer disease by photodynamic therapy. The photodynamic therapy in the present invention uses a methylene blue nanoparticle as a therapeutic agent. The methylene blue nanoparticle of the present invention for use as a topical cancer...
patents.google.com

 

[encerent]

Ray has not mentioned support for MB in a while. Most notably he did not include MB in his recommendations for covid :

Q: What would be your go-to medicines/food etc, if you started to develop "Covid" like symptoms like shortness of breath and fever?

RP: Aspirin, antihistamines, and antibiotics (azithromycin has been tested in covid), vitamin D, milk, orange juice,nebulized 4% saline, lidocaine (nebulized or oral), progesterone.

 

[Ben.]

G: Uh, they also claim - I mean the patent is specifically for cancer, they’re saying instead of giving you toxic drugs that increase ROS, which is gonna give you methylene blue and hen irriadiate you, and then they’ll achieve the same ROS generation, which, I think is dangerous, right?

R: “Yes, it’s the same as most chemotherapies. They hope it’s more specific to the cancer than to your brain cells. But, it always kills a lot of your brain cells.”

Wait wait ... what? ... MB and red light (which we get in nature aswell) kills of brain cells? ... Dafuq ...

accumulation of MB in the liposomes is the main burden that concerns me. Taking a maintenance amount of MB everyday would make it a persistent man-made chemical in my body. I cycle it.

That is kind of concerning ... I didn't like the idea of cell staining dye, however if we are honest every persons body is full of man-made chemicals and exposed to it everyday. On the other hand what if it improves lifequality? This world of health contradictions realy seems like no chemical or compound is safe in the sense that context always matters.

My MB experience thus far is fairly ambivalent. On the one hand it seems to kind of mopp the floor with the microbiome and i experience quite some inflammation and herxheimer reactions like feeling insanely cold at times no matter what or how much i wear all over the body, cold hand/feet, especially my inflamed/receding gums are concerning me on the other hand i feel as if my skin and my appearance to be "younger/healthier" again and the spots where i started to develop "geheimratsecken" as we say in german, which loosely translates to receding hairline at the temples are regrowing. Lots of new baby hairs there its not even imagination theres quite alot happening there its crazy. I am hoping it will translate to regrow some hair on the top of my thinning scalp aswell. Hair "quality" is amazing too, can't stop touching the hair because they feel so great. Also hair and nails are growing faster again, much like before i became so ill and started to age "prematurely".

 

[golder]

Wait wait ... what? ... MB and red light (which we get in nature aswell) kills of brain cells? ... Dafuq My MB experience thus far is fairly ambivalent. On the one hand it seems to kind of mopp the floor with the microbiome and i experience quite some inflammation and herxheimer reactions like feeling insanely cold at times no matter what or how much i wear all over the body, cold hand/feet, especially my inflamed/receding gums are concerning me on the other hand i feel as if my skin and my appearance to be "younger/healthier" again and the spots where i started to develop "geheimratsecken" as we say in german, which loosely translates to receding hairline at the temples are regrowing. Lots of new baby hairs there its not even imagination theres quite alot happening there its crazy. I am hoping it will translate to regrow some hair on the top of my thinning scalp aswell. Hair "quality" is amazing too, can't stop touching the hair because they feel so great. Also hair and nails are growing faster again, much like before i became so ill and started to age "prematurely".

your experience of MB doesn’t sound ambivalent at all, it sounds incredibly good! What dosage were you using?

 

[Ben.]

your experience of MB doesn’t sound ambivalent at all, it sounds incredibly good! What dosage were you using?

????

Increased overall inflammation along side many symptoms that only appear when inflammation is realy high + intensifying gum issues vs some skin/hair improvement.
Not sure this sounds like a good tradeoff. It seems like energizing and accelerating the good and the bad.

I started with a drop or two per day (300-400mcg per drop) increased to 2 mg after a few days and in the name of science just went for 10-15mg the past 4-5 days.

 

[Ritchie]

From what I’ve seen I dont think Peat is a fan of methylene blue… particularly in regards to its interaction with iron..

RP in regards to MB posted by someone in another thread :

" I think it could work like ascorbic acid or glutathione in the presence of iron or copper, creating a stream of oxidations and reductions. I think it can produce harmful free radicals. There are chelators that help remove excess iron, but just drinking coffee helps."

Another email exchange :

Would methylene blue be dangerous or beneficial in an iron overload state?

RP's reply :
Like ascorbic acid, it can reduce ferric iron to the ferrous form, which creates the most toxic free radicals.

Would be interesting if someone emailed him about it in general to see if he can give some clarity about his position in supplementing it.. or if he ever thinks it’s beneficial too at all.

 

[TheCodez]

I've been using MB at 3X5mg daily for several months now. Interestingly it has COMPLETELY resolved my 16 year intractable fatigue. Nothing else has ever helped and I've tried EVERYTHING I've run across that looked remotely reasonable. Definitely not entirely comfortable with it though.

 

[Ben.]

I've been using MB at 3X5mg daily for several months now. Interestingly it has COMPLETELY resolved my 16 year intractable fatigue. Nothing else has ever helped and I've tried EVERYTHING I've run across that looked remotely reasonable. Definitely not entirely comfortable with it though.

Have you tried to see if it helped you permanently by staying off it for a week or so?

 

[TheCodez]

Have you tried to see if it helped you permanently by staying off it for a week or so?

After the first 13 contiguous fatigue free days, I stopped the MB. The fatigue returned in 3 days.

 

[Broken man]

I emailed Peat few months ago with using methylene blue and he wrote me that around 1 mg is safe, told me to avoid sunlight after using it...... Thing is that my experience is totally different. First, I would like to say that I am member of this forum for around 5-6 years. Most of that time I was trying to implement the ideas Ray Peat has and his word was like law for me. For the curious ones I can show you picture of my physique, how it changed. In short, my health is still destroyed and got fatty liver. I knew about MB from the start of me being here but never tried more than 0.5 mg. I was using that amount for few months, saw no effect on my body or mood/mental capacities... Its few months ago that I decided to try test and found good fb group with alot of info, I also accidentally found few members of that forum that are using methylene blue as nootropic. The guys are using 50+ mg. I started to chat with one that was willing to answer me and he sended me info/studies abotu safety of methylene blue so decided to give it a try. I bought few bottles from mitolab. I wanted to start slowly at 10 mgs 3 x per day. Guys I can tell you that it was the best feeling ever. I can say that I got huge energy boost plus I had like tunnel focus, working on tasks was really easy ( at work ) and my gaming performance went up alot too. Not just alot of energy but I was also motivated to do it by myself, that is the biggest benefit for me. Since that day I was using it almost every day with few breaks. I was feeling good on that dose but if you combine methylene blue with sunlight its another level.... Its hard to describe so I would recommend to everybody to try it. Its much better than dopamine agonists that I tried over time. Before MB I was unable to drink more than 1 cup of coffee and had bad reaction to aspirin. I have no problems with both now, even 6 cups of coffee and 1 g of aspirin are no problem for me now. The reason for me writting this long text is because if I had the courage and the information I have today I could start much earlier and saved tons of time while having much better life. I want to say that when I switched to MB from ebay for better price I found that my MB is much stronger than the one from mitolab!!!!! Its also much darker color when dissolved...... The only negative about taking MB is that when I had breaks due to waiting for next batch or just because I wanted to know how I feel without it I found that I am like a real weak sh*t..... So I am carrying it with myself everywhere and get used to it so much that I even dont care when my friends are staring at me because I am putting something blue into my coffee... I know some of you are scared about the potential side effects... I am member of atleast two fb groups where people are using 50 mg and 100 mgs for years without problems.... One group is focusing on using MB for treatment of Bartonella and are using doses like 800 mg !!!! Some of them are using MB and SSRI at the same time without problems. I will do my own thread about my journey with alot of info about Mb and other thing I am using.

 

[DonLore]

D

????

Increased overall inflammation along side many symptoms that only appear when inflammation is realy high + intensifying gum issues vs some skin/hair improvement.
Not sure this sounds like a good tradeoff. It seems like energizing and accelerating the good and the bad.

I started with a drop or two per day (300-400mcg per drop) increased to 2 mg after a few days and in the name of science just went for 10-15mg the past 4-5 days.

Maybe you have die-off reaction which, while good thing and better for your long-term health, sucks in the short term. But if something gives die-off symptoms, it would mean there is too much ***t in your body and you need to get rid of it

 

[Tansia]

I emailed Peat few months ago with using methylene blue and he wrote me that around 1 mg is safe, told me to avoid sunlight after using it...... Thing is that my experience is totally different. First, I would like to say that I am member of this forum for around 5-6 years. Most of that time I was trying to implement the ideas Ray Peat has and his word was like law for me. For the curious ones I can show you picture of my physique, how it changed. In short, my health is still destroyed and got fatty liver. I knew about MB from the start of me being here but never tried more than 0.5 mg. I was using that amount for few months, saw no effect on my body or mood/mental capacities... Its few months ago that I decided to try test and found good fb group with alot of info, I also accidentally found few members of that forum that are using methylene blue as nootropic. The guys are using 50+ mg. I started to chat with one that was willing to answer me and he sended me info/studies abotu safety of methylene blue so decided to give it a try. I bought few bottles from mitolab. I wanted to start slowly at 10 mgs 3 x per day. Guys I can tell you that it was the best feeling ever. I can say that I got huge energy boost plus I had like tunnel focus, working on tasks was really easy ( at work ) and my gaming performance went up alot too. Not just alot of energy but I was also motivated to do it by myself, that is the biggest benefit for me. Since that day I was using it almost every day with few breaks. I was feeling good on that dose but if you combine methylene blue with sunlight its another level.... Its hard to describe so I would recommend to everybody to try it. Its much better than dopamine agonists that I tried over time. Before MB I was unable to drink more than 1 cup of coffee and had bad reaction to aspirin. I have no problems with both now, even 6 cups of coffee and 1 g of aspirin are no problem for me now. The reason for me writting this long text is because if I had the courage and the information I have today I could start much earlier and saved tons of time while having much better life. I want to say that when I switched to MB from ebay for better price I found that my MB is much stronger than the one from mitolab!!!!! Its also much darker color when dissolved...... The only negative about taking MB is that when I had breaks due to waiting for next batch or just because I wanted to know how I feel without it I found that I am like a real weak sh*t..... So I am carrying it with myself everywhere and get used to it so much that I even dont care when my friends are staring at me because I am putting something blue into my coffee... I know some of you are scared about the potential side effects... I am member of atleast two fb groups where people are using 50 mg and 100 mgs for years without problems.... One group is focusing on using MB for treatment of Bartonella and are using doses like 800 mg !!!! Some of them are using MB and SSRI at the same time without problems. I will do my own thread about my journey with alot of info about Mb and other thing I am using.

Thank you for sharing your experience! Can you link here your thread about your journey with alot of info about Mb and other thing I you're using? I'm looking forward to read it :)

 

[Broken man]

Thank you for sharing your experience! Can you link here your thread about your journey with alot of info about Mb and other thing I you're using? I'm looking forward to read it :)

I will do it this or next week, sorry but I have alot of things that I must fo first.