Mass vaccination against Covid-19 might lead to emergence of truly deadly strains

[tankasnowgod]

Nonsense, covid is real mate but they are using it to become more 1984

Well, the propaganda campaign is real. I've seen it now firsthand for 14+ months. But there is no reason to believe this jumped-from-a-bat-in-December-2019-coronavirus is, considering it's alleged to cause everything from no symptoms and good health to death, and everything in between, mostly common cold symptoms, the flu, and pneumonia. It's never even been detected in any country, outside of maybe China, as the tests don't test directly for any sort of virus.

 

[Regina]

But if the vaccine doesn't work, it's not their fault, it's just your mental state

Look after yourself: how your state of mind could affect your Covid jab

Psychological burdens from stress to loneliness to lack of sleep have been shown to affect immune responses to other vaccinations

www.theguardian.com

? gaslight ?

 

[Giraffe]

There is an article on the website of Children's Health Defense.

Rebuttal: The ‘Not-So-Hidden Agenda’ Behind Bossche’s Concern Over COVID Mass Vaccination

Bigtree and Coleman virtually unquestioningly accept and amplify Vanden Bossche’s views. They strongly insinuate to their overwhelmingly credulous subscribers that there’s virtually no fact-checking or pause for sober second thought required.

But from my experience as a former long-time medical writer and journalist (1988-2016) — particularly a four-month stint with media-relations giant FleishmanHillard in 1994 (yes, I’ve worked for the dark side) — this has all the hallmarks of a astroturf campaign.

 

[achillea]

What makes you think that there are more virulent strains out there? Is it because main stream media say so? And Boris Johnson? Or this Fergusson guy who has always been way off with his models? Bossche himself?

Bossche's professional background



This man now demands a huge vaccination campaign with an NK cell-based vaccine. Suspect any conflict of interest?

He is a veterinarian
Ghent (1980-1983)
- Doctoral degree in Veterinary Medicine from State University of Ghent (1983)
- Postdoctoral training in Equine Medicine and Surgery at the Free University of Berlin, Germany
(1984-1987)
- Postdoctoral Fellowship in Virology at James A. Baker Institute for Animal Health, Cornell
University, Ithaca, NY 14850, USA (Sept 1990- mid 1991)
- Research scientist in Virology, Immunology and Molecular Biology at the Robert Koch
Institute in Berlin, Germany (1987- 1990)
- Board certified in Veterinary Virology (1990)
- Senior Research Scientist and Head of Environmental Virology at University of Hohenheim,
Stuttgart, Germany (1990-1994)
- Board certified in Veterinary Microbiology and Animal Hygiene (1992)

 

[LeeLemonoil]

Moderna is intending to trial with kids and eventually vaccinate pre-puberty children.
How can that be? Those kids don’t suffer from SarsCov2 infection at all, no they even adapt to it with longterm immunity making cov2 virtuely harmless for the rest of their lives.
And they want to put mRNA experimental tech into kids?
It’s sickening

 

[Regina]

Moderna is intending to trial with kids and eventually vaccinate pre-puberty children.
How can that be? Those kids don’t suffer from SarsCov2 infection at all, no they even adapt to it with longterm immunity making cov2 virtuely harmless for the rest of their lives.
And they want to put mRNA experimental tech into kids?
It’s sickening

Indeed.

Moderna becomes first to start trialing Covid-19 jab on kids aged 6 months to 11 years

US pharmaceutical firm Moderna has commenced trials of its Covid-19 vaccine on kids ranging from just 6 months to 11 years old, the youngest so far to receive any Covid jab.

www.rt.com

 

[Giraffe]

"The evidence above supports that immunity evasion – though a theoretical possibility – is very unlikely. Mutant variants, emerging overseas or domestically, are an inevitable biological reality once a virus is in the population. Closing international borders will not stop new mutations of the SARS-CoV-2 virus circulating in the population. It is a futile endeavour with no scientific basis."

How Worried Should We Be About the Variants? – The Daily Sceptic

by Dr Michael Yeadon and Marc Girardot As the SARS-CoV-2 […]

lockdownsceptics.org

 

[tara]

Too bad most are too stupid to see what’s happening

By stupid, do you mean not making up unfounded fantasies and assuming they are true?

What is all the fuzz about mutations? They occur all the time. Everyone knows this except the MSM and their believers. Am I missing something?

Yes, people who know anything viruses know this. I don't think there's any reason to believe MSN-viewers specifically are ignorant of it.
It's one of the important reasons for wanting to limit spread of the infection - the more of it there is circulating, the more long-term infections develop and run on, the more opportunity there is for mutations, and the more likelihood that one or more of them will be much nastier than the current strains.
Public health measures such as physical distancing, mask-wearing and contact tracing to limit spread of infection can be important for this.

already known to have occurred with vaccinations in livestock, eg Mareks disease.

There are many issues with high-density and large flock/herd industrial animal farming. Worsening the risk of dieases is amongst them.

The Mareks disease vaccine looks as though it was a live vaccine.

 

[Giraffe]

It's one of the important reasons for wanting to limit spread of the infection - the more of it there is circulating, the more long-term infections develop and run on, the more opportunity there is for mutations, and the more likelihood that one or more of them will be much nastier than the current strains.
Public health measures such as physical distancing, mask-wearing and contact tracing to limit spread of infection can be important for this.

What you call public measures will neither stop the spread of the virus nor prevent mutations. There are only downsides to it. Better to accept the way nature works. Make sure your vitamin D level is optimal. And if you catch the virus: get enough rest, keep warm and take vitamin C. All this fearmongering, social isolation and having a petri dish in front of your nose is making people sick.

 

[Regina]

Great interview -- Dr Sherri Tenpenny and Reinette Senum

 

[tara]

Make sure your vitamin D level is optimal. And if you catch the virus: get enough rest, keep warm and take vitamin C.

I agree with taking care of health in other ways too, including maintaining good vit-D levels. If I catch COVID, vit-C will be amongst the first things I throw at it.

Chronic fear can contribute to poorer make people sick. I don't recommend living in a state of chronic fear.
However, COVID-denial (lack of realistic respect for the risks of fear of COVID-19) does not seem to provide reliable protection against the disease. Hospitals are treating many COVID-deniers.

Social isolation is indeed hard on many people. The quicker the pandemic can be controlled, the better. It is physical distance that is useful for hindering spread. Making a point of using other means of maintaining social contact can make a difference.

Regularly changing and washing reusable masks is recommended.

 

[tankasnowgod]

However, COVID-denial (lack of realistic respect for the risks of fear of COVID-19) does not seem to provide reliable protection against the disease. Hospitals are treating many COVID-deniers.

Well, the ones that are still open are-

47 hospitals closed, filed for bankruptcy this year

From reimbursement landscape challenges to dwindling patient volumes, many factors lead hospitals to shut down or file for bankruptcy. At least 47 in the U.S. have closed or entered bankruptcy this year, and the financial challenges caused by the COVID-19 pandemic may force more to do the same.

www.beckershospitalreview.com

Fact Sheet: COVID-19 Pandemic Results in Bankruptcies or Closures for Some Hospitals | AHA

As the COVID-19 pandemic has persisted and again surged across the country, infecting more than 10 million people and resulting in over a quarter million deaths, America’s hospitals and health systems continue to face historic challenges. Since the start of the pandemic, hospitals and health...

www.aha.org

Anyway, "Hospitals Treating Patients" certainly isn't proof that the COVID 19 virus exists. After all, hospitals have existed my entire life, and well before. So, if it does, then COVID has existed my entire life. Which, if the supposed virus does exist, might be accurate. There are potentially trillions upon trillions of viruses out there, so the idea that Chinese Researchers discovered a new one in in the very first patient ever, back in December of 2019 after she ate a bat, is just ludicrous.

 

[LeeLemonoil]

I agree with taking care of health in other ways too, including maintaining good vit-D levels. If I catch COVID, vit-C will be amongst the first things I throw at it.

Chronic fear can contribute to poorer make people sick. I don't recommend living in a state of chronic fear.
However, COVID-denial (lack of realistic respect for the risks of fear of COVID-19) does not seem to provide reliable protection against the disease. Hospitals are treating many COVID-deniers.

Social isolation is indeed hard on many people. The quicker the pandemic can be controlled, the better. It is physical distance that is useful for hindering spread. Making a point of using other means of maintaining social contact can make a difference.

Regularly changing and washing reusable masks is recommended.

Catching Covid is no joke for some, butfor the overwhelming majority of affected/infected it’s a manageable, temporary nuisance.

Are there unknown longterm health risks and Sequaele from Covid? Possibly. Most viral infections hold these risks including other colds and people never fuss about that. Every infection also heightens the risks of developing so called auto-immune disorders. And, many don’t know that, so do vaccines.

Most at risk are s small cohort of either very old individuals or individuals with physiological/immune situations that resemble the states in old age. That’s life. That’s evolution. At any given time in our evolution as a species there are physiological states most suspectible for environmental factors.

My personal ethical pov is that the side effects and damages of Lockdown and social distancing measures are not in proper relations to the life’s they potentially safe.
It’s different in individual nations and states, but speaking of my home „we“ don’t manage to protect the elderly enough despite said meandered while over-proportionally damage the very Young and juvenile = School Kids, afoledecebes and Young adults needing education and play with their peer groups while the latter need social action to seek sexuality, mates, partners and establishing reliable social circles in new sourroundings and so forth.


What do you exactly mean with controlling the pandemic or the virus if you please?
I can’t see that. SarsCov2 is around forever. In will live in Waves. Sometimes hardly active, sometimes rapidly spreading again. There will always be a contagious variant living in some human being (or animals too) somewhere on earth.
Herd immunity would need near simultaneous infection of all human beings with 80%+ efficiency. Thats beyond achievable.

Best hope in my opinion are vaccinations of the most suspectible or hysterical with whole-Virion vaccines. One of those is likely coming to the USA btw soon, manufactured by India.

And we need research and Medicaments for acute treatment of seriously affected. It can’t be that we treat viral diseases like idiots

 

[Sefton10]

A friend of mine (59) had the Oxford vaccine on Monday, It has nailed him - very sore arm, fever, aching all over, hasn’t slept for 2 days. He feels like he’d have been better just catching COVID and is very nervous of a second dose now. Then he sees it probably isn’t even that effective anyway and will likely need even more boosters etc. That must be a horrible place to be as once you’ve had it you’ve had it, there’s no going back or undoing it no matter how much you regret it.

 

[Lord Cola]

Wouldn't this assume that the so-called vaccines are somewhat working in the first place?

 

[Inaut]

@tara please quote me properly in the future. You ignored the first part of my statement which is rather misleading when discussing the context of my statement. Thanks.

 

[Perry Staltic]

... COVID-denial (lack of realistic respect for the risks of fear of COVID-19) ...

A freudian slip that reveals the true disease.

 

[Nebula]

Real virus released on purpose. I don’t see how anything else is possible at this point. The question is now how to adapt to a world where elites are willing to develop and release pathogens to scare and harm the masses. I guess optimal metabolic health is a matter of basic survival now.

 

[Sefton10]

I guess optimal metabolic health is a matter of basic survival now.

This has been my conclusion. It is more essential than ever.

 

[tara]

Catching Covid is no joke for some, butfor the overwhelming majority of affected/infected it’s a manageable, temporary nuisance.

I guess different people have different views of what seems overwhelming. 1% of hundreds of millions is a lot of people, and in some places teh cases have overwhelmed hospitals. (Though it could of course be worse, if a more virulent strain or virus were on the loose. This is on the cards according to zoonotic disease expert).

It puzzles me that USers accepted significant action when their govt said it was needed to combat some kinds of terrorism after ~3000 people were killed in a terrorist attack 20 years ago, but treat the deaths of hundreds of times more fellow citizens as though it is trivial and not justifying significant preventive action now.

In the US, by now about 0.16% (and rising) of the population have died of COVID-19 so far. For every person who dies, there are several who become severely ill - beyond nuisance - and some who develop ongoing debilitating symptoms.
Many people take out insurance against lower risk events than this.

For some particularly vulnerable groups, the risks seem very high. Elders' lives matter, diabetics' lives matter and Black lives matter, etc (all more likely than average to die of COVID-19 than the average USer). But even young apparently healthy whites have succumbed in significant numbers.

How can that be? Those kids don’t suffer from SarsCov2 infection at all, no they even adapt to it with longterm immunity making cov2 virtuely harmless for the rest of their lives.

This is not true for all children, though I agree it's much less common. Some young children have also become very ill and/or died from COVID-19, including some with no known underlying conditions predisposing them.
You are right that some people are more vulnerable. It varies form place to place, but at one point in New York the stats were something like nearly half the deaths were in over 75year olds, and nearly a quarter in the next younger elders, and another nearly quarter in the rest of the over 45s, with just a few percent in the under 45s.

What you call public measures will neither stop the spread of the virus nor prevent mutations.

Depends how effective they are. If they are well implemented, they can reduce the spread, and that can reduce the risk from mutations. Strong public health measures have protected people very effectively in some places.
Have you looked at the rates for e.g. Taiwan? Last I looked, fatalities were 10 (for the whole 23+ million population over the whole pandemic).
I think some countries learned to get serious about preventing infection after SARS-1 and MERS, both of which had much higher IFRs than SARS-COV-2.

Are there unknown longterm health risks and Sequaele from Covid? Possibly. Most viral infections hold these risks including other colds and people never fuss about that.

People who don't know about it don't concern themselves. Those who suffer long drawn out symptoms do.

What do you exactly mean with controlling the pandemic or the virus if you please?

Good question. Some of it would be protecting many lives, protecting health workers and other front line workers, preventing health systems from getting overwhelmed, so that everyone who needs care (for this or other conditions) can get it, and health workers can protect themselves effectively. Bringing the pandemic down from a flood to a trickle (or better yet, none at all, but I don't know that that's possible).
Some places are managing to effectively keep the pandemic from running rampant. These are good examples to study. Any measures that protects millions of lives over the next 2-4 years may provide time to develop more effective treatments and prevention.

Other epidemics have been largely brought under control in the past. Vaccination has been an important factor in some of them, e.g. polio (many schools and other public places closed then too, and hygeine was taken very seriously). Small pox has been basically eliminated. People who saw or suffered from polio, or whooping cough, or TB, etc weren't denying it - they were eager for vaccines. Some vaccines are more effective than others, but they all made a significant difference.

But I think you may be right in predicting that SARS-COV-2 will carry on for many years. My hope is that it becomes rare and better treatable.

It’s different in individual nations and states, but speaking of my home „we“ don’t manage to protect the elderly enough despite said meandered while over-proportionally damage the very Young and juvenile = School Kids, afoledecebes and Young adults needing education and play with their peer groups while the latter need social action to seek sexuality, mates, partners and establishing reliable social circles in new sourroundings and so forth.

I know isolation is hard on people, and that disruption of work etc affects many people's livelihoods. Those places that have had fast effective containment strategies in the face of very small numbers have endured less restrictions over the last year, and those that have supported their population ell during trying times have mitigated the hardships. Effective strategies may be able to stop the spread even now, and allow life to become more social again. Wuhan got back to relatively normal life (with masks) after a few months.

And we need research and Medicaments for acute treatment of seriously affected.

Yes.

Wouldn't this assume that the so-called vaccines are somewhat working in the first place?

Not sure what you are responding to, but some of the vaccines have studies showing them to be better than 90% effective against severe disease.

A freudian slip that reveals the true disease.

Thanks for spotting that typo (not freudian). I meant to say:
However, COVID-denial (lack of realistic respect for the risks of COVID-19) does not seem to provide reliable protection against the disease.

@tara please quote me properly in the future. You ignored the first part of my statement which is rather misleading when discussing the context of my statement. Thanks.

I didn't ignore your story, I responded to it. (I didn't see any benefit in repeating the story. Just realised the forum mechanisms have changed so it's not quite as easy for readers to track back from quotes as in the previous style.)

I don’t see how anything else is possible at this point.

Zoonotic disease experts predict that more diseases will emerge from animals, as many have before. The possibility that covid-19 jumped from wildlife to humans is quite plausible. Less likely sources might be possible at a stretch, though. Until there is evidence of the where/how it started in humans, it's speculation.
We are likely to face more zoonotic diseases in the future, either way.