Manganese And Its Scarcity

[Giraffe]

The RDA is 2.3 mg yet I barely get over half of that amount.

There is no RDA for manganese. The number you gave is the AI (= adequate intake).

The AI is a recommended intake value based on observed or experimentally determined estimates of nutrient intake by a group of healthy people that are assumed to be adequate. An AI is established when an RDA cannot be determined.

Manganese | Nutrient Reference Values

Balance studies are problematic because of the rapid excretion of manganese into bile and because balance studies over short to moderate periods do not appear to give results proportional to manganese intakes (Greger 1998, 1999).

 

[Lin]

@Blossom, years ago, when I was a kid, I learned in Home Econ. that baking soda destroys b-vitamins. I don't know if that is still taught, though. However, Adele Davis said that milk would neutralize oxalic acid, so she had recipes calling for cooking spinach in milk. Usually, I would end up with a layer of scorched milk stuck to the bottom of the pan. So, I tried an alternative approach--adding powdered milk to the cooking water at the end of cooking, and making a creamed spinach. I know some here object to powdered milk...
Sometimes we can get really caught up over thinking small details... But here is a chart of oxalic acid content of different plants. Oxalic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Kale has a lot less than spinach.

 

[Lin]

Here is a link for the baking soda... seems it destroys more than b-vitamins. Does baking soda destroy nutrients in vegetables? - The Boston Globe

 

[natedawggh]

I've been thinking about manganese recently. It seems to be the least present dietary mineral in all foods (in terms of the RDA). The only 'Peaty' sources I can think of are shellfish, spinach and rice. Given our evolutionary past as forest-dwelling primates, these foods simply weren't available to them. How did they get enough manganese? The RDA is 2.3 mg yet I barely get over half of that amount.

I also find it strange that manganese deficiency is reportedly rare in humans, and that magnesium and calcium (both of which are consumed in abundance on a Peat-inspired diet) supposedly inhibit manganese's absorption.

Any thoughts? Do you take care to consume enough manganese?

The two highest plant sources of manganese in western countries is maple syrup, with more than %100 dv per serving, and pineapple.

 

[Blossom]

Sometimes we can get really caught up over thinking small details..

So true, thanks so much Lin.

 

[Peat Tong]

When I use ceylon cinnamon, I also use cloves, for its manganese.

 

[raypeatclips]

Given our evolutionary past as forest-dwelling primates, these foods simply weren't available to them. How did they get enough manganese?

Maybe they didn't.

 

[Spokey]

3.5mg? i dont think its that hard to get that amount.
tea is easiest way to get bioavailable manganese, but some users in forum have concerns about estrogen content of tea,so i dont know is it good to have lots of tea or not.
-----
also manganese becomes more important when we supplement thiamine!
Manganese and Vitamin B1

From that link:
"Experiments with animals have recently shown that an excess of vitamin B1 may develop disturbances in lactation and maternal instinct associated with cannibalism."

That, is pretty metal.

 

[Tenacity]

Recently I've suspected that it's probably better to eat whole foods, where possible, than processed counterparts (with some exceptions).

I've been wondering if coconut is one of these exceptions. I'm experimenting with eating fresh coconut rather than consuming the oil. It has an abundance of minerals and some carbs, which is nice.

One of these nutrients, I noticed, is manganese. 100g provides 1.5mg of manganese.

I think species of palm tree are very important in our nutritional history, given the religious and cultural significance of dates and coconuts.

 

[tara]

One of these nutrients, I noticed, is manganese. 100g provides 1.5g of manganese.

I'm guessing that is mg?
Are you eating flesh or drinking coconut water or both? Young and soft or mature and tough?

 

[Tenacity]

I'm guessing that is mg?
Are you eating flesh or drinking coconut water or both? Young and soft or mature and tough?

You're right, the typo demon got me!

I've bought pre-cut chunks of coconut flesh. Tastes tough and a little dry. Reminds me of desiccated coconut. There's a sweetness to it though.

 

[jpgio]

Manganese and Vitamin B1[/URL]

That is such an interesting concept! Great find!

Just had about 2 tbsp maple syrup in my coffee with a a teaspppom of coconut oil and I got a good sense of well being from it. Maybe I’ve become deficient in manganese from supplementing b1 for so long

 

[DaveFoster]

Dr. Peat thinks there's sufficient manganese in a normal diet regardless of the RDA.

 

[Capt Nirvana]

I've been thinking about manganese recently. It seems to be the least present dietary mineral in all foods (in terms of the RDA). The only 'Peaty' sources I can think of are shellfish, spinach and rice. Given our evolutionary past as forest-dwelling primates, these foods simply weren't available to them. How did they get enough manganese? The RDA is 2.3 mg yet I barely get over half of that amount.

I also find it strange that manganese deficiency is reportedly rare in humans, and that magnesium and calcium (both of which are consumed in abundance on a Peat-inspired diet) supposedly inhibit manganese's absorption.

Any thoughts? Do you take care to consume enough manganese?

On one website, the "Top 10 Foods Highest in Manganese" are all non-Peaty. Since manganese is a well-known contributor to most varieties of dementia, maybe that's a "good" thing!

 

[BigChad]

Dr. Peat thinks there's sufficient manganese in a normal diet regardless of the RDA.

do you have quote or links regarding what he said?
even drinking water, meat, milk, etc, have manganese? or do you need certain fruits/veggies or other foods

 

[Capt Nirvana]

I've been thinking about manganese recently. It seems to be the least present dietary mineral in all foods (in terms of the RDA). The only 'Peaty' sources I can think of are shellfish, spinach and rice. Given our evolutionary past as forest-dwelling primates, these foods simply weren't available to them. How did they get enough manganese? The RDA is 2.3 mg yet I barely get over half of that amount.

I also find it strange that manganese deficiency is reportedly rare in humans, and that magnesium and calcium (both of which are consumed in abundance on a Peat-inspired diet) supposedly inhibit manganese's absorption.

Any thoughts? Do you take care to consume enough manganese?

Maybe its scarcity can be a good thing? Same as iron, it's definitely a player in Alzheimer's and other omega-3 fatty acid dementia-related diseases.

 

[BigChad]

Maybe its scarcity can be a good thing? Same as iron, it's definitely a player in Alzheimer's and other omega-3 fatty acid dementia-related diseases.

do you think the rda for manganese and molybdenum are vastly overestimated? 2.3mg and 45mcg or 75mcg? or are these nutrients in the water supply and animal products in such high amounts that basically noone is deficient in molybdenum or manganese whether they eat animal or plant based diets?

one of the formulators for the legion triumph multivitamin said that the reason they left out manganese and molybdenum in their multivitamin was because deficiencies of those two nutrients are almost unheard of.
their multivitamin also doesn't contain copper or iron because they believe most people obtain too much or sufficient amounts of those to begin with.
however it does contain 200mcg of chromium picolinate, 30mg zinc, 30mg or so b6, and that zinc amount on its own would probably create a copper/iron deficiency over time if you already have a moderate iron high zinc diet.

I also wonder if manganese requirements are dependent on iron intake, since they both balance each other out. getting too much of one in comparison to the other can cause imbalances. if the daily values are correct (2.3mg manganese 18mg iron), then around a 1:10 ratio of manganese to iron may be ideal

 

[ANDREW CHIN]

The quote below is from this thread: I Have Low Cholesterol (How Can I Raise It?)

Chocolate and coconut have quite a bit of manganese. I prefer coconut butter over dried coconut flakes. The Polynesians didn't like dried coconut flakes, maybe because the fibers can be irritating to the gut. Also, Ray Peat doesn't seem to be a big fan of coconut in general because of that study that found women cooking with coconut milk were more likely to develop cancer. In my opinion, coconut butter might be okay, since it's been ground into a smooth nut butter (less likely to be irritating to the gut).

Also, hazelnuts, pili nuts and macadamias are high in Mn and pretty low in PUFA.

As far as fruits go, see if your co-op has wild frozen blueberries. Great source of Mn. Much higher in this mineral than cultivated blueberries. :)

 

[DaveFoster]

do you have quote or links regarding what he said?
even drinking water, meat, milk, etc, have manganese? or do you need certain fruits/veggies or other foods

I asked him that question personally over the phone during an interview.

 

[BigChad]

I asked him that question personally over the phone during an interview.

Do you recall if he meant meat, milk, water supply have manganese or fruits and veggies