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Low Nitric Oxide Causes Insomnia

Discussion in 'Ask For Help or Advice' started by Joeyd, Jan 6, 2018.

  1. Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    So I've been going full throttle on all the nitric oxide antagonists: MB, Niacinamide, Progesterone, caffeine, lysine etc etc.

    I feel great in the day but my sleep is steadily getting worse and worse every night.

    I discovered that adenosine is responsible for inducing sleep. And geuss what is required to produce adenosine.... Nitric Oxide!

    So I wanted to know, is anyone else noticing also getting worse the more nitric oxide inhibitors they take?

    Check out this article:

    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/09/060908094456.htm
     
  2. Westside PUFAs

    Westside PUFAs Member

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    Eat greens.
     
  3. Wagner83

    Wagner83 Member

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    At what of the day do you stop taking them? Do you combine all of those? As said above, I often find kale broth relaxing.
     
  4. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    For Nitric oxide?
     
  5. Westside PUFAs

    Westside PUFAs Member

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    Yes.
     
  6. jb116

    jb116 Member

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    This is again another example of researchers framing only the portion of research they want to prove to be right. Nitric oxide is something that is pushed in the industry. In small amounts, locally created in the body, it shouldn't do any harm. Dr. Peat has spoken about in wound recovery, how some NO is necessarily created i.e. stress or injury response. Heavy exogenous exposure or chronically elevated levels become an issue. The slight of hand here is that you can show a result by some means and link the result to something that's good. Does that mean the thing used for that result is always necessarily good? I'd say no. In the case of NO induced adenosine, that is most likely a compensatory, survival response just as in tissue injury. Well, good sugar metabolism and a good functioning liver also help with adenosine levels. Along with good cellular respiration, ATP is converted to adenosine.
     
  7. Terma

    Terma Member

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    I've experienced sleep problems from too low nitric oxide, at least I believe, and gotten better sleep from eNOS promoters, at least for short periods - eventually they stop working; you can seek them out but your success won't last. I assume your article means eNOS, didn't check. AFAIK progesterone increases eNOS so that's a non-issue. People use lysine + arginine as a sleep promoter and anxiety treatment, so you can just do 1:2 arg:lys or so, it won't kill you - everyone here eats gelatin which is 2:1 arg:lys. MB and caffeine reliably ruin my sleep taken past 2:00pm - I'd put them in a different category than the others.
     
  8. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    Thanks for this terma. Good that there's someone else like me!
    I'm still trying to get my head around it. I know there's 3 different types of Nitric oxide receptors but I'm trying to work out how each of them affects me. So is ENOS the one to worry about most? Any further explanation or experiences from you would be much appreciated!
     
  9. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    It's quite frustrating that peat says just reduce nitric oxide but doesn't explain that there's so many different versions of NO. He says Progesterone reduces Nitric oxide but as you say it increases ENOS which is my experience too. So which type of NO does he want us to focus on decreasing?
     
  10. Terma

    Terma Member

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    iNOS is usually the most damaging, nNOS can be damaging too. eNOS isn't much concern in my opinion unless it were chronically high. Progesterone, theanine, high-dose aspirin can all increase eNOS, and is even mistakable for thyroid effects if you go by feeling alone. eNOS is very useful for increased blood flow for healing wounds, sometimes nothing else works.

    iNOS gets triggered in immune cells (macrophages, liver, mast cells) in response to immune events and oxidative stress. Usually it's smarter to target the inflammation/source/event than targeting the downstream NO, but if you suffer an extreme event then something like MB can prevent a lot of needless damage. The exception is infections, where you probably don't want to lower NO. Arginine is closely linked to iNOS, but taking Arg doesn't mean you generate iNOS, the immune system or macrophages have to be polarized or otherwise triggered for it to produce much (otherwise goes to ornithine). So you mostly want to prevent those states.

    Similar for nNOS, usually you can just target upstream instead, such as NMDA antagonism. But again there are cases where inhibiting more directly prevents needless damage.

    I see no problem inhibiting all these enzymes during the day (unless you have infections all the time), but based on my own experience, I'd leave eNOS alone at night, or compensate with something that might take it to a "baseline" level if it were low in the evening. Kind of have to wing it.
     
  11. tisho23

    tisho23 Member

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    You are most likely getting worse because lysine inhibits the formation of nitric oxide, so it cancells the arginine.

    Caffeine inhibits arginase and this allows the arginine to be turned into NO and not into ornithine, so i guess it is for the best to take arginine/citrulline supp plus coffee in the morning.
     
  12. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    You should never supplement arginine.
     
  13. tisho23

    tisho23 Member

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    Just pointed out why the other use might have lost her results.
     
  14. Frankdee20

    Frankdee20 Member

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    Citrulline at night helped me sleep well.
     
  15. Wagner83

    Wagner83 Member

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    It gives me awful asthma/allergies.
     
  16. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    Doesn't that increase nitric oxide?
     
  17. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    Do you find taurine, minocycline, make you really tired also?
     
  18. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    Why do you think eNOS is important at night?

    And also do you know of any link between shingles and one of the NO types?
     
  19. OP
    Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    Also are you sure Aspirin increases eNOS, I read somewhere that it lowers it..
     
  20. Lejeboca

    Lejeboca Member

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