Low e2 is much worse then high e2

[Hypermnesia]

MUCH WORSE.
High /high normal e2 is absolutely fine and healthy if you’re Testosterone Is also fine.
People tend to think their high estrogen is an issue. It’s an issue when T and other protective hormones are low. It’s simply an imbalance.

I have intentionally lowered my e2 a handful of times and now finally learned my lesson after feeling like a complete sack of ***t for weeks in a row this time. This forumn should stop parroting to just arbitrarily lower estrogen. Idc how many studies are posted saying it’s bad. There are just as many to show it’s protective. And thousands of Anecdotes attesting to feeling awful on low estrogen. And it is 100% the estrogen. I’ve confirmed in blood work over and over. Everything is in check just estrogen lowwww.

Low estrogen

Chronically dehydrated
Horrible skin
Can’t get a pump
Weak as all hell
Constant irritability
Brittle / temporary thinning hair
Complete lack of interest and hope in anything
Body aching /hands trembling

I don’t understand why the majority of the forum can’t even entertain the idea that low estrogen is brutal

I was in your situation because of primobolan and literally thought I was going to die but now I needed aromasin for a couple months after trying to quit TRT with clomid, if you're taking testosterone and lowered your estrogen on purpose you may have just gone too hard on it. Don't think that just because you felt better at the top of the range that your optimal e2 level is higher you might need to keep it more in the middle even if testosterone is high. You should stick to safe ways to balance out estrogen like pregnenolone and avoid aromatase inhibitors if you are sensitive. If you have pretty much any chronic illness you probably don't want high normal e2 it will just feed into it until eventually you stop feeling good and start feeling like ***t again. I was trying to keep my estrogen up for months out of fear of crashing it again but it is quite easy to cause imbalances either direction and can it is harder to clear estrogen from tissues than add new in. If your e2 doesn't recover for some reason just buy estrogen or dbol or fennel tea works extremely well you'd be surprised, maybe hcg especially at high doses but be careful you only need to get your aromatase activity going again and leave it alone your body will self upregulate estrogen back to normal. The fact that you easily crashed your estrogen is a good sign don't change much of what you are doing long term except whatever was powerful enough to block estrogen that hard. I do agree though that low e2 is worse than high in a sense but it is way harder to throw yourself out of a high e2 state than low e2 keep it in mind.

 

[Hypermnesia]

Ummm I get hot before bed , but not rly sweats. Interesting. How do you get rid of high tissue estrogen? I feel like ***t when I take estrogen lowering substances, but I’m not opposed to the idea I have high tissue estrogen

Progesterone is amazing getting estrogen out of tissues but do your research on it. If your estrogen and cortisol is low I think you should see only positive effects and it is difficult to cause low estrogen symptoms on it's own as it is one of the bodies natural ways of opposing estrogen and won't completley block out aromatase like exemestane will. Androgens can also get estrogen out of tissues and modulate it's effects so it doesn't become problematic.

 

[tommyg130]

MAO does break down serotonin so if you inhibit it you may have more floating around, but they are extremely effective for depression unlike the SSRIs. Too little dopamine and noradrenaline really effects your quality of life. But if you know estrogen is the issue you can just try to get estrogen to come up, kind of a weird thing to suggest on a ray peat forum, but! The only hormone I know that directly goes towards estrogen over a few mg dose is DHEA. I think taking that would let you know pretty fast whether you need more estrogen.

Do stimulants do anything for you? They should raise catecholamines a bit. I use cyproheptadine to lower my cortisol and it antagonizes some of my dopamine so I just eat some chocolate and that reverses it. I can't tolerate much caffeine though. Very addicting for me.

So trt would be good here? This happ as I came off trt, so I already had low E bc I had low T so the E follows T. And then I took AIs on top like an idiot . I’m back on trt cream now bc I couldn’t deal w the low estrogen. Also cypro? Works well?? Any side effects ? My cortisol is high and prolactin.

 

[Hypermnesia]

So trt would be good here? This happ as I came off trt, so I already had low E bc I had low T so the E follows T. And then I took AIs on top like an idiot . I’m back on trt cream now bc I couldn’t deal w the low estrogen. Also cypro? Works well?? Any side effects ? My cortisol is high and prolactin.

Cypro is good for high cortisol and testosterone should fix your prolactin especially in a low E2 state. You should restore your estrogen levels just from taking testosterone and adding in dhea as pills will also aromatize more as it passes through the liver.

 

[tommyg130]

Okay thanks for your help .. is it uncommon to have prolactin high and cortisol high? I thought ray always says they go hand in hand ?

Cypro is good for high cortisol and testosterone should fix your prolactin especially in a low E2 state. You should restore your estrogen levels just from taking testosterone and adding in dhea as pills will also aromatize more as it passes through the liver.

 

[tommyg130]

Okay thanks for your help .. is it uncommon to have prolactin high and cortisol high? I thought ray always says they go hand in hand ?

How often and what dose cypro do you take ?

 

[baccheion]

Yeah, the ratios are more important. 40-60:1 test:estr ng/dL:pg/mL. Even getting to 30 does something. Healthy lean males 20-39 have a ratio 14.5:1.

During puberty want the lowest estrogen possible while still being in range (and vital) to not affect linear growth. Especially important during earlier years. Still the same desired ratio.

In adult life, it is about having estradiol in the 20-30 pg/mL range while testosterone hovers near the top of the old range (ie, 1197 ng/dL).

 

[tommyg130]

Yeah, the ratios are more important. 40-60:1 test:estr ng/dL:pg/mL. Even getting to 30 does something. Healthy lean males 20-39 have a ratio 14.5:1.

During puberty want the lowest estrogen possible while still being in range (and vital) to not affect linear growth. Especially important during earlier years. Still the same desired ratio.

In adult life, it is about having estradiol in the 20-30 pg/mL range while testosterone hovers near the top of the old range (ie, 1197 ng/dL).

I agree .. ya I even feel good at 30-50 if Test was all the way at 1200 . Typically ppl who feel like ***t on trt and blame estrogen if it’s under 50 are probably not checking prolactin. Like you said it’s a ratio . If T and DHT are high estrogen rly won’t be an issue ever if you’re not using other oral steroids

 

[Hypermnesia]

How often and what dose cypro do you take ?

I take 2mgs 2-3x a day. My cortisol was above the reference range and I know by feeling that it is much better now.