Low Dose Caffeine Effective For Premature Ejaculation

[haidut]

Don't think many Peatarians struggle with this problem, but I thought that it may be an interesting study since the people who have this problem are generally told that there are no effective treatments except SSRI. The SSRI don't really treat anything but rather remove the desire for sex altogether.
The dose of caffeine was 100mg, which is conservative even in Peat-land. I suspect the effects is both on the smooth muscles and also on the serotonergic system.

The effect of on-demand caffeine consumption on treating patients with premature ejaculation: a double-blind randomized clinical trial. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[nikotrope]

I have been struggling with this problem all my life! And the paleo diet I did 4 years ago made the problem worse. I have had low temps, low pulse, weight problems (currently at 30% BF) and probably liver problems, estrogen dominance for a good part of my life.

I have started supplementing caffeine (400-800mg a day) a month ago and I have seen a big improvement in controlling ejaculation. It is still far from perfect but it made my muscles smoother. I don't "crave" the ejaculation (dopamine?) as much as before.

When I started supplementing caffeine I took 3x200mg of caffeine on the fourth day and I was able to fully control ejaculation (and my libido was way up). It made me jittery and maybe the effect was due to something like high pulse, high adrenaline, high dopamine, I don't know. I would like to be able to reproduce this effect but now I can take 3x200mg without feeling jittery at all.

I never drunk coffee before a month ago. I drink lots of tea so I am sceptic about the 100mg of the study.

I never saw people talking about that with a Ray Peat context. How could I improve my condition?

 

[Gl;itch.e]

I think high histamine levels can exacerbate "PE". Anything that lowers high histamine may prove useful. .

 

[haidut]

I think high histamine levels can exacerbate "PE". Anything that lowers high histamine may prove useful. .

This would explain why cyproheptadine helps in such cases. But on the other hand, people taking common allergy medication like cetirizine report complete lack of libido. So, the cyproheptadine is doing something more than just lowering histamine, but I don't know what...It's likely not due to lower serotonin since other anti-serotonin drugs do not work on PE like cyproheptadine.

 

[Gl;itch.e]

I think high histamine levels can exacerbate "PE". Anything that lowers high histamine may prove useful. .

This would explain why cyproheptadine helps in such cases. But on the other hand, people taking common allergy medication like cetirizine report complete lack of libido. So, the cyproheptadine is doing something more than just lowering histamine, but I don't know what...It's likely not due to lower serotonin since other anti-serotonin drugs do not work on PE like cyproheptadine.

If histamine is blocked or reduced too much that would make sense. People with high histamine apart from having PE also tend to have high sex drives. So I guess there needs to be a balance or specific level for everything to work best.

 

[nikotrope]

After stopping supplementing salt in my diet in December (I was still having ~2g of sodium with milk and salty foods) I decided to resume salt with one tablespoon a day through small doses (1g of salt with each cup of liquid). Before I was having broths and put salt a bit in everything, I was probably overestimating the amount I had so I probably never had as much as a tablespoon of salt.

Anyway, it's been a week that I added salt back and I immediately had effects. Better skin, better bowel movement, clearer nose, less water retention and to my surprise PE vanished. Unlike the first time where I took too much caffeine and was suppressed for only a day, this time it has been consistent on multiple days. It is not just that PE disappeared, but ejaculation is far more satisfying.

Salt being an antihistamine I thought about this thread. Since I hadn't had any of these effects before even with 1-2 tsp of salt, it might be the caffeine and the better liver health that have enable my body to use salt properly or have additive effects.

I also realized that my body has been more flexible since I began salt. I have been doing a few exercises and I made more progress in a week than in the months before. So there may be a reason involving my muscles being smoother too in my suppressed PE.

 

[charlie]

nikotrope, what kind of salt are you using?

 

[koganmj]

Interesting stuff.

So supplementing caffeine - are the amounts in a daily quart of coffee as a lot of Peaters tend to get comparable to the doses used in that study? How do you go about supplementing caffeine? I looked for caffeine on iherb and found nothing. Would you mind sharing niko exactly how you're supplementing it - doses and times of day. The study haidut linked experimented with giving the dose 2 hours prior to intercourse. Have you tried experimenting with that also?



*for your reference niko, there is some discussion of salt in the getting ripped thread; pboy has some interesting thoughts towards the bottom of the page. I'm glad to hear you've been having good results thus far, but perhaps long term 1tbsp salt/day won't be necessary? viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4328&start=75


EDIT: determining caffeine content of coffee appears to be complicated - http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-livin ... t-20049372

 

[koganmj]

Some personal insights I can share from having taken in the past Lexapro and Venlafaxine: the effects on ejaculation delay are pretty extraordinary (sometimes you can't even "get there"), and I was lucky enough not to suffer from decreased sex drive either or erectile problems (though I am a pretty ravenous 26 year old).

 

[nikotrope]

nikotrope, what kind of salt are you using?

I don't know! I'm kidding but I did not choose it and doesn't have the package to know exactly. It's common salt without anticaking agents but I don't know if there is iodine or not.

 

[mujuro]

I think high histamine levels can exacerbate "PE". Anything that lowers high histamine may prove useful. .

This would explain why cyproheptadine helps in such cases. But on the other hand, people taking common allergy medication like cetirizine report complete lack of libido. So, the cyproheptadine is doing something more than just lowering histamine, but I don't know what...It's likely not due to lower serotonin since other anti-serotonin drugs do not work on PE like cyproheptadine.

It's odd that you say this, as cyproheptadine turns me into a 2 minute man, however bromocriptine allows me complete control over my stamina.

 

[nikotrope]

Interesting stuff.

So supplementing caffeine - are the amounts in a daily quart of coffee as a lot of Peaters tend to get comparable to the doses used in that study? How do you go about supplementing caffeine? I looked for caffeine on iherb and found nothing. Would you mind sharing niko exactly how you're supplementing it - doses and times of day. The study haidut linked experimented with giving the dose 2 hours prior to intercourse. Have you tried experimenting with that also?



*for your reference niko, there is some discussion of salt in the getting ripped thread; pboy has some interesting thoughts towards the bottom of the page. I'm glad to hear you've been having good results thus far, but perhaps long term 1tbsp salt/day won't be necessary? viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4328&start=75


EDIT: determining caffeine content of coffee appears to be complicated - http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-livin ... t-20049372

I don't like coffee so I took caffeine supplements. I began with 4x100mg then I stopped at 3x200mg (8AM, 12PM, 4PM) with some days I experimented at 4x200mg. I don't use it regularly anymore, probably just 200mg in the morning if I felt tired these past few days.

No luck on iherb, I got it on amazon (France) and you can get caffeine powder on purebulk or bulk supplements.

I did not try 2 hours prior to intercourse. Will try it.

I am aware of pboy views on salt. As long as your body is not salt depleted and doesn't dump salt because of stress hormones, maybe 1 tbsp of salt is not necessary. I don't know how it feels to have excess salt, so I don't know if it's going to be necessary long term! Note that I almost didn't sweat since I took more salt, even in a hot bath and that my sweat have a milder odor.

 

[haidut]

I think high histamine levels can exacerbate "PE". Anything that lowers high histamine may prove useful. .

This would explain why cyproheptadine helps in such cases. But on the other hand, people taking common allergy medication like cetirizine report complete lack of libido. So, the cyproheptadine is doing something more than just lowering histamine, but I don't know what...It's likely not due to lower serotonin since other anti-serotonin drugs do not work on PE like cyproheptadine.

It's odd that you say this, as cyproheptadine turns me into a 2 minute man, however bromocriptine allows me complete control over my stamina.

You may have high prolactin, so cypro is not working for you. Hence, the bromocriptine benefits for you.

 

[Frankdee20]

What is the real cause of PE ?

 

[Prosper]

What is the real cause of PE ?

Expecting to find one singular cause is pointless, but one often overlooked cause one is postural imbalances. There are muscles in the hip/pelvic area that encourage ejaculation and there are muscles that inhibit it. Premature ejaculation and impotence can be symptoms of chronic dysfunctional way of engaging the hips in everyday movements. Having full control over the muscles in this area gives great control over ejaculation.

 

[Frankdee20]

Not that meany Peatarians struggle with this problem, but I thought that it may be an interesting study since the people who have this problem are generally told that there are no effective treatments except SSRI. The SSRI don't really treat anything but rather remove the desire for sex altogether.
The dose of caffeine was 100mg, which is conservative even in Peat-land. I suspect the effects is both on the smooth muscles and also on the serotonergic system.

The effect of on-demand caffeine consumption on treating patients with premature ejaculation: a double-blind randomized clinical trial. - PubMed - NCBI

Caffeine does not help it, can make it worse.