Low copper and low ceruloplasmin - need advice please

[Ippodrom47]

Hi everyone! For the last couple or even several months I've been feeling like total crap, especially after eating - extreme fatigue/brain fog/ cold hands and feet/anxiety. I've been eating a diet pretty high in copper (no supplements, though) containing lost of buckwheat and wholewheat noodles, some beans and potatoes here and there. My daily copper intake would easily pass over the RDA. I did a blood test a couple hours after eating (in order to "catch" the symptoms) in late March 2022 and they were as follows:

Total copper: 13.00 (range 10.99-21.98) ummol/L (which is 82.59 ug/dL)

Ceruloplasmin: 168 (range 200-600) mg/L → low

I calculated free copper:

82.59 - 16.8x3 = 32,19 (google says range is 10-15μg/dL)

Free copper percentage = 39%, which is quite a lot.

I realized then that I was eating was too little animal protein and increased it.

My results as of May 29 (also after eating 2 bananas, then buckwheat with chicken steak in an egg for breakfast):

Total copper: 10.8 (range 10.99-21.98) ummol/L (which is 68.61 ug/dL) → low

Ceruloplasmin: 167 (range 200-600) mg/L → low

Zinc: 14.6 (range 11.1-19.5) → okay

C-reactive protein: less than 0.14 → okay

Free copper is around 18%, which is high, but not too much,

I've been eating more animal protein lately, but total blood protein is okay, and I know that it works as my total iron bound capacity/transferrin has increased even despite an increase in serum iron, meaning my body absorbs all that protein and the liver is capable of making the proteins it's supposed to be making.

So, given my high-copper diet, the question is: can copper overload lead to low serum copper AND low ceruloplasmin? As well as a range of naughty symptoms after eating foods high is copper?
Thanks!

Edit: Wilson's disease has been excluded based on genetic testing.

 

[artist]

Do you have symptoms of deficiency beyond fatigue? What makes you think copper is the source of the problem? If know you don’t have Wilson’s I would just try a copper supplement. However, serum copper does not really tell you your copper status from my understanding. If you have too much iron stored (which can happen for various reasons) that can mess with your body’s ability to store copper in your liver. If you consume a lot of fructose this will also dramatically lower your copper status.

 

[youngsinatra]

Food sources are just too depleted in this criticial mineral these days, in my opinion. It‘s really depleted in the soil - less is in plants - less in animal products - less in us.

The only exception might be shellfish or grass-fed ruminant animal liver.

I know many people with low copper status on blood tests. (especially ceruloplasmin)

Do you have symptoms of low norepinephrine?

 

[InChristAlone]

True deficiency causes anemia, low hemoglobin. You need vitamin C for the unbound copper as that will destroy you.

 

[Beastmode]

Besides not eating that list of foods, what else might be facilitating these issues?

Most of the soil in the world is depleted of copper, like @youngsinatra, so if you're going to get GF animal liver, it might be worth finding a source like Polyface farms or White Oaks farm as a source since they have proven track records of regenerating soil over generations. Therefore, you're most likely to get a "better" source of copper from them compared to the local GF animal liver.

Still exploring this, but some believe iron overload as a driver of not having enough copper and ceruloplasmin. I'm about to do my 2nd blood donation which apparently helps in this process. Still too soon to report, but I do feel another level of energy throughout the day. It was good before to be fair.

 

[InChristAlone]

I'm wondering how you know the soil is depleted of copper? Copper fungicides are extremely common. They've actually had to stop them using them for certain fruit crops because the soil was so toxic in copper it killed the plants! Grapes, mangoes, oranges anything that can get fungus you will see use of copper fungicides.

 

[Beastmode]

I'm wondering how you know the soil is depleted of copper? Copper fungicides are extremely common. They've actually had to stop them using them for certain fruit crops because the soil was so toxic in copper it killed the plants! Grapes, mangoes, oranges anything that can get fungus you will see use of copper fungicides.

I've got my info over the years from regenerative farmers. Glyphosate and things like NPK fertilizer are 2 of the main things that create this from what I'm told.

Open to new info.