Low carb dieters look so much older

Nebula

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People go low carb because their glucose metabolic pathways are malfunctioning and they can produce more energy with fat oxidation. Glucose pathways are a lot more complicated and fragile than fat oxidation. When a high carb diet is working well it feels euphoric and euphoric states are associated with a youthful metabolism and appearance.

The fact that high carb vegans can sometimes function on such low protein demonstrates how anti stress proper glucose oxidation can be. They would feel even better with a little animal protein and nutrients, but I think they have the right idea with optimizing glucose metabolism.
 

tanya48

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If you think some of the Keto/Carnivore proponents look old for their age, what about Dr. Michael Gregor who eats high carb Vegan diet! He most certainly doesn't look healthy to me. Probably too much soy and not enough good quality protein. However, I don't think we can always judge one's health just by appearance alone. Who knows what his lab tests would show? Perhaps he feels good on his WOE. I'm still constantly experimenting and have been on every diet imaginable in my 72 years on the planet. Currently a combination of a Rainbow/Hypercarnivore diet, with some Ray Peat elements added, works best for me. It's wise to continually listen to one's body and adjust appropriately.
 

Jessie

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People go low carb because their glucose metabolic pathways are malfunctioning and they can produce more energy with fat oxidation. Glucose pathways are a lot more complicated and fragile than fat oxidation. When a high carb diet is working well it feels euphoric and euphoric states are associated with a youthful metabolism and appearance.

The fact that high carb vegans can sometimes function on such low protein demonstrates how anti stress proper glucose oxidation can be. They would feel even better with a little animal protein and nutrients, but I think they have the right idea with optimizing glucose metabolism.
Yeah I think there may be something to the concept of sugar oxidation being fragile. If you have a lot of the "Warburg Effect" going on, generating excessive lactate from sugar can be inflammatory, so switching to beta oxidation may result in less inflammation by reducing lactate, at least temporarily. Problem is, over the long haul beta oxidation results in more reductive stress via less CO2 retention.

It would be interesting to know Ray's opinion about this.
 

OccamzRazer

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tankasnowgod

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Also, it seems like a ton of the keto guys are all on exogenous hormones (TRT, HGH). Sisson is for sure. So is Peter.

And Sinclair uses botox and plastic surgery.

If you're going based on "looks," there are all sorts of things that have nothing to do with diet that can affect it.
 

CLASH

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**In my experience:

1) too low fat causes issues
•low libido
•fatigue
•brain fog
•sluggish digestion
•feeling of "clogged" liver

2) too high fat causes issues
•too full after meals
•decreased appetite
•diarrhea
•cold hands and feet
•indigestion

3) too low protein causes issues
•weakness
•hungry all the time
•loss of muscle mass

4) too high protein causes issues
•constipation
•lowered appetite
•adrenaline rushes
•cold hands and feet

5) too low carb causes issues
•adrenaline rushes
•cold hands and feet
•wired feeling
•stressed feeling
•sleep issues
•mood issues

6) too high carb causes issues
•low libido
•hungry all the time
•alot of carb based foods can cause
digestive issues for people
•hard to eat enough food
•cold hands and feet

7) the wrong types of fats, carbs, and
proteins cause issues
•too much SAFA causes weird
feeling at my liver and give me bile acid
diarrhea (I dont have a gallbladder)
•PUFA's seem to induce inflammation
•too much MUFA's make me spacey
and too relaxed
•starches make me feel good if I have
one meal, on one day randomly
but if I eat them over a few days or
more than one meal a day I get acne,
cold hands and feet, sluggish digestion,
brain fog, joint pain, and loss of
appetite
•Theres a limit to fruit and fruit juice,
at a certain point I just dont want more.
•Plant proteins wreck my digestion
including beans, nuts, seeds, grains,
and many vegetables
•Animal proteins make me feel great
unless I eat too much at once, then I
can get constipation and colonic
irritation

8) People vary in what works for them:
•Some of my clients do better with
starches
•Some of my clients do better with
sugars from fruit (refined sugars seem
to cause issues in almost everyone
over time)
•Some clients do better with higher fat
•Some do better on lower fat
•Some need more protein
•Some do better with a little less

9) The consistent things I have seen
across the people I have worked with
are:
•Most grains, beans, nuts, and seeds
seem to be problematic for peoples
digestion, especially if not prepared
well. The exception is white rice.
•Milk and dairy are hit and miss. Some
people do great with it, some feel
terrible no matter what they try to
"make it work"
•Almost all processed foods (candies,
sodas, cakes, pastries; the dollar store/
grocery packaged crap) cause issues
for people over time
•Pretty everyone does better removing
PUFA oils from their diet
•Meeting Macronutrient and
Micronutrient requirements is important

10) The range of dietary options I have
seen work best for people has been:
-Yams, tubers, squashes, carrots,
other root vegetables
-Fruits
-Cooked leafy greens (hit or miss)
-Dairy (hit or miss)
-animal protein sources (ruminants,
eggs, lean poultry, seafood)
-Saturated/ monounsaturated fat
sources (macadamia nut oil, butter,
tallow, olive oil, chocolate/ cocoa
butter, coconut oil, fatty beef, egg
yolks)


**Overall I think questions of Keto/ carnivore or Vegan/ plant based are useless. Theres no need to present two opposing sides as if you have to choose between one or the other, its a distraction. I think figuring out what works best for you based on how you feel within certain principles is the goal. Principles in no specific order:

1) Eat nutrient dense foods, with minimal
toxins and high digestibility "you are
what you absorb"
2) Reach your macronutrient goals
3) Reach your micronutrient goals
4) Eat foods that work for your body

There is more nuance to this but in general these are the 20% that get people the 80% in my experience. The nuances get hammered out with awareness and self experimentation overtime.
 

Yucca

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Jan 26, 2021
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That.

If you want to follow a dogma first, you’re wrong, every time.
What works for someone is bad for another.
It’s just better to avoid pufa’s and starches for everyone, and follow a diet who allows higher androgen levels (and lower estrogen), so enough proteins and saturated fats are mandatory. Everything else in the diet can be different, and the right one for you.
 

OccamzRazer

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Feb 13, 2021
Messages
429
That.

If you want to follow a dogma first, you’re wrong, every time.
What works for someone is bad for another.
It’s just better to avoid pufa’s and starches for everyone, and follow a diet who allows higher androgen levels (and lower estrogen), so enough proteins and saturated fats are mandatory. Everything else in the diet can be different, and the right one for you.
Totally agree!

Avoidance of processed PUFA is almost a universal truth. Beyond that, it's important to acknowledge the sometimes-huge variance between individuals and not get dogmatic.

By the way, I would say you look great for your age, but you pretty much look great for any age! Seems obvious enough that keto is working for you.
 

GreekDemiGod

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Something I noticed as well. Low-carbers looks exceptional physique-wise - Shawn Baker, Ted Naiman, but facially they seem to age faster. I think the secret to having a muscular body on any diet is actually High Protein.

I think singer Enrique Iglesias should be a very interesting case. He is 45 now and looks better than 80% of 30 years old men out there.
Obviously him being a celebrity means he paid great attention to his looks, possibly had some enhancement / surgeries, coupled with exceptional genetics.
The best lessons in anti-aging come from celebrities. It seems like they have discovered something greater than Attia, Sinclair et all.





 
Last edited:

Amarsh213

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Feb 26, 2017
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Is it me or do the low carb gurus look significantly older?

Peter Attia, Joe Rogan, Mark Sisson, Gary Taubes, Shawn Baker

They all have one thing in common, their faces (and hairlines) look so much worse but they have shredded physiques.
The Big Problem with low carb dieters are they're also low fat dieters. Shawn Baker, Joe rogan...etc are retards. They eat big lean steaks/meat, anything past 35% of Dailey calories from protein causes tons of problems which clearly shows on their skin/hairlines

Plus humans Livers can only generate 300-400g of glucose from gluconeogenesis, where a "carnivore" easily does 700-800gs.

If you were to eat low carb, you would want 50% of calories from ruminant mammal fat and 30% protein, and 20% carbs to avoid ketosis. The Sort of Diet WAPF reccomends.

Somthing like Cream+Egg Yolks+Coffee, Small grass fed beef patty 80/20, Goat Cheese and a big spoon heap of Honey in coffee.

Not 200 grams of lean protein, Lol
 

OccamzRazer

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The Big Problem with low carb dieters are they're also low fat dieters. Shawn Baker, Joe rogan...etc are retards. They eat big lean steaks/meat, anything past 35% of Dailey calories from protein causes tons of problems which clearly shows on their skin/hairlines

Plus humans Livers can only generate 300-400g of glucose from gluconeogenesis, where a "carnivore" easily does 700-800gs.

If you were to eat low carb, you would want 50% of calories from ruminant mammal fat and 30% protein, and 20% carbs to avoid ketosis. The Sort of Diet WAPF reccomends.

Somthing like Cream+Egg Yolks+Coffee, Small grass fed beef patty 80/20, Goat Cheese and a big spoon heap of Honey in coffee.

Not 200 grams of lean protein, Lol
Sounds like the dreaded 'rabbit starvation.'

I'm interested in your perspective on this.

How much protein/day is too much? Should it be a ratio of total calories...or an absolute amount based on bodyweight?

I'm under the 33% Dr. Peat has mentioned, but get over 250 grams of protein many days. So far still looking young for my age - but would like to keep it that way.
 

VendettaRed911

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If you think some of the Keto/Carnivore proponents look old for their age, what about Dr. Michael Gregor who eats high carb Vegan diet! He most certainly doesn't look healthy to me. Probably too much soy and not enough good quality protein. However, I don't think we can always judge one's health just by appearance alone. Who knows what his lab tests would show? Perhaps he feels good on his WOE. I'm still constantly experimenting and have been on every diet imaginable in my 72 years on the planet. Currently a combination of a Rainbow/Hypercarnivore diet, with some Ray Peat elements added, works best for me. It's wise to continually listen to one's body and adjust appropriately.
Pretty sure Gregor and that Mic the Vegan guy and Vegan Gains all overconsume pufas (nuts, seeds) and eat a ton of lentils and focus more on the plant part (eating greens) than the fruitarian / high carb part of the diet.

Durian rider is straight high GI carb and says do not cut calories and go hungry.

Also, I don't know if it's fair to hold active doctors under the same standards...having to work those insane hours probably means a higher than normal cortisol load.
 

VendettaRed911

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And Sinclair uses botox and plastic surgery.

If you're going based on "looks," there are all sorts of things that have nothing to do with diet that can affect it.
To be fair, a lot of what someone looks like is affected by what's going on inside...
 

OccamzRazer

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If you think some of the Keto/Carnivore proponents look old for their age, what about Dr. Michael Gregor who eats high carb Vegan diet! He most certainly doesn't look healthy to me. Probably too much soy and not enough good quality protein. However, I don't think we can always judge one's health just by appearance alone. Who knows what his lab tests would show? Perhaps he feels good on his WOE. I'm still constantly experimenting and have been on every diet imaginable in my 72 years on the planet. Currently a combination of a Rainbow/Hypercarnivore diet, with some Ray Peat elements added, works best for me. It's wise to continually listen to one's body and adjust appropriately.
Looking at Dr. Gregor, we can only conclude that the optimal human diet is exactly the opposite of what he's done lol.

I feel best on a carnivore + Peat diet too. Listening to one's body as changes are made really is key!
 

OccamzRazer

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She looks worse now, it could be natural aging or I think she's changed her diet up...
View attachment 23232
Looks like she needs some collagen!!

According to Durianrider himself, the thing that ages a person fastest is unforgiveness.

I think he has a video along these lines, titled something like "why are all my ex girlfriends fat and crazy?" or something 🤣
 
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