Losing Faith In Ray Peat

[Xisca]

What is Chlorophyllin Copper Complex
you can buy it here, it is cheap, but I would like them to indicated ALL ingredients!

 

[kayumochi]

You have lost faith, you say? Wonderful news! I haven't eaten SAD in 30 years and have lost faith in everything along the way so have never had the misfortune to develop a Food Religion that lasted for very long. What I do have faith in is my willingness to try and do everything necessary to get and stay healthy and that has carried me far ...

 

[haidut]

Royal jelly was said to reduce suppression quite a lot during steroids use:
Royal Jelly maintains testosterone levels during modest steroid cycle
@TubZy @haidut

Royal Jelly is quite estrogenic. Peat has written about this and the main study in the thread on Gonadin about the androgenic effects of MP and MO also mentions it. It contains some chemicals that activate the pituitary in mammals and taking it is probably similar to getting an hCG injection of anything else that boosts LH/FSH.

 

[Daniel11]

I haven't heard of chlorophyllin. But have looked it up since. What is your experience with it Daniel11 and how did it help you?

My first research with Chlorophyllin was what i call the “double blind beauty salon study.”

Beauty salons are intense olfactory experiences, the air is filled with all kinds of synthetic terpenoids that have always had a strong and almost immediate estrogenic and uncomfortable effect on my physiology. I can actually smell the same perfumes and chemicals coming out of my skin, under my arms and even in my urine for 24-48 hours after i am away from the source.

Alas the person that styles my hair is skilled and lovely to chat with so i have always tolerated the experience.

Even after i started regaining my health with the red light i still was effected by environments with strong chemical odors and cleaning products like found in beauty salons, grocery stores, department stores, offices, new cars, hotel rooms, the list goes on.

I always found grocery stores to be some of the worst experiences because the strong artificial perfumes of the laundry soap and cleaning supply section of the store would permeate every other product in the store. If i bought a bought package of cheese several isles over form the cleaning section the plastic package of the cheese would have very strong chemical smell when i got home, even depending on how the food was packaged, the food inside would have the same unpleasant smell.

Its challenging because now days there is lots of good natural foods at regular grocery stores, but they are tainted with chemical odors from laundry soap section and chemicals in the cleaning isle, also often the very dangerous scented candles, that many stores these days sell.

I firmly believe that chemical scents from body care products; soaps, makeup, shampoo, laundry soaps, cleaning products, scented candles and those chemical perfume products you plug in to release volatile scents in the air are some of the worst things for ones health, especially when you are sensitive, like many children born in to this world are these days.

I have heard from some women that when they changed their lipstick and makeup to an all natural brand they started feeling better. Our skin is the largest organ of our body, what you put on it or near it will get absorbed in to your tissue, lymphatic vessels, liver, kidneys, brain….

Its one of the main reasons i have always shopped at places like whole foods is they do not sell the really offensive chemical cleaning products.

I have tried Chlorophyll over the years and noticed some minor benefits but nothing substantial, then i read some research on Chlorophyllin being more water-soluble then Chlorophyll and much more effective in binding to environmental toxins and mutagens.

So i decided to give Chlorophyllin a try, i started the day before i had a appointment at the hair salon. (I call it double blind beauty salon study because neither the hair stylist or the person that washes my hair at the salon knew about my research study, very scientific!!)

When i walked in to the salon i of course still smelled all the normal strong scents but they they did not to have the same uncomfortable physiological effect they normally had and the experience was much more enjoyable. After i got home i still showered to remove most the strong odors but i felt fine and did not have the usual experience of smelling the chemical scents on my body, it was as a great sense of freedom.

I still do not like strong chemical smells, i keep them out of my home and do my best to avoid them when possible, but i am no longer so physically and emotionally effected by them. It feel like the environment and the world wherever i am is more comfortable and enjoyable.

I also feel that Chlorophyllin has enhanced other aspects of my health, including digestion, sleep, focus and emotional balance.

I usually take 1 capsule 2-3 times a day with meals, this is the brand i use.

Chlorophyllin, 100 mg 100 capsules | Life Extension

 

[StrongMom]

@Daniel11

I am still sick but started using red light more regularly. Since I am sick and on a lot of medications, i will need some time to understand the real impact. I am using it for 7 min on thyroid and another 5-7 on eyes. I am able to do it only once when I am back from work at around 6:30 Pm. Over the weekends, I do it twice, once in the morning and once in the evening. My impression that it has some metabolism boosting effect as I tend to feel hungry after the red light session. I will update once I recover from this unknown infection. I've already seen two doctors; there is an obvious swelling on my throat but they are not sure what it is.


@Luna

I have been looking at wai's website and thinking that there might be some truth. I am not sure who he is, I suppose a Paleo guy...Even though I cannot eliminate grains totally, I will start experimenting with a gluten free diet with low starch consumption. I will try to increase fruit juices and be careful with snacking (i.e. low/no protein snacks). Even though he says one should not eat dairy, I will continue with full-fat dairy and ice cream. I've already started implementing some but since I am still stick, I do not feel ready to do it fully. I plan to go with that improved diet for a while and observe the constipation, gas associated with the food items I eat. I plan to modify as I observe. I know it is not perfect but a reasonable starting point for me.

 

[Xisca]

infection. I've already seen two doctors; there is an obvious swelling on my throat

Throat is the ony case I have seen that I am better off dairy and sugar until it is cleared!

I know it is not perfect but a reasonable starting point for me.

You can start any path only from where you are, so this is very wise to have such a plan as you have come out with, congratulations!

 

[Footscray]

My first research with Chlorophyllin was what i call the “double blind beauty salon study.”

Beauty salons are intense olfactory experiences, the air is filled with all kinds of synthetic terpenoids that have always had a strong and almost immediate estrogenic and uncomfortable effect on my physiology. I can actually smell the same perfumes and chemicals coming out of my skin, under my arms and even in my urine for 24-48 hours after i am away from the source.

Alas the person that styles my hair is skilled and lovely to chat with so i have always tolerated the experience.

Even after i started regaining my health with the red light i still was effected by environments with strong chemical odors and cleaning products like found in beauty salons, grocery stores, department stores, offices, new cars, hotel rooms, the list goes on.

I always found grocery stores to be some of the worst experiences because the strong artificial perfumes of the laundry soap and cleaning supply section of the store would permeate every other product in the store. If i bought a bought package of cheese several isles over form the cleaning section the plastic package of the cheese would have very strong chemical smell when i got home, even depending on how the food was packaged, the food inside would have the same unpleasant smell.

Its challenging because now days there is lots of good natural foods at regular grocery stores, but they are tainted with chemical odors from laundry soap section and chemicals in the cleaning isle, also often the very dangerous scented candles, that many stores these days sell.

I firmly believe that chemical scents from body care products; soaps, makeup, shampoo, laundry soaps, cleaning products, scented candles and those chemical perfume products you plug in to release volatile scents in the air are some of the worst things for ones health, especially when you are sensitive, like many children born in to this world are these days.

I have heard from some women that when they changed their lipstick and makeup to an all natural brand they started feeling better. Our skin is the largest organ of our body, what you put on it or near it will get absorbed in to your tissue, lymphatic vessels, liver, kidneys, brain….

Its one of the main reasons i have always shopped at places like whole foods is they do not sell the really offensive chemical cleaning products.

I have tried Chlorophyll over the years and noticed some minor benefits but nothing substantial, then i read some research on Chlorophyllin being more water-soluble then Chlorophyll and much more effective in binding to environmental toxins and mutagens.

So i decided to give Chlorophyllin a try, i started the day before i had a appointment at the hair salon. (I call it double blind beauty salon study because neither the hair stylist or the person that washes my hair at the salon knew about my research study, very scientific!!)

When i walked in to the salon i of course still smelled all the normal strong scents but they they did not to have the same uncomfortable physiological effect they normally had and the experience was much more enjoyable. After i got home i still showered to remove most the strong odors but i felt fine and did not have the usual experience of smelling the chemical scents on my body, it was as a great sense of freedom.

I still do not like strong chemical smells, i keep them out of my home and do my best to avoid them when possible, but i am no longer so physically and emotionally effected by them. It feel like the environment and the world wherever i am is more comfortable and enjoyable.

I also feel that Chlorophyllin has enhanced other aspects of my health, including digestion, sleep, focus and emotional balance.

I usually take 1 capsule 2-3 times a day with meals, this is the brand i use.

Chlorophyllin, 100 mg 100 capsules | Life Extension

Thank you for your great answer and your wonderful posts recently. I am finding this thread very informative. 'Stressed mom' from over here in Australia my thoughts and prayers are with you. I hope you can change your forum name to 'Super mom' or 'healthy mom' even if you are not there yet?
The fact that you got hungry with the red light could be a good sign that your metabolism is improving?
Best of health.

 

[Daniel11]

Royal Jelly is quite estrogenic. Peat has written about this and the main study in the thread on Gonadin about the androgenic effects of MP and MO also mentions it. It contains some chemicals that activate the pituitary in mammals and taking it is probably similar to getting an hCG injection of anything else that boosts LH/FSH.

Thats interesting, it does not feel estrogenic, whats your thoughts on this study...

“In conclusion, six-month ingestion of RJ in humans improved erythropoiesis, glucose tolerance and mental health. These may be due to secondary effects of T with acceleration of conversion from DHEA-S to T by activation of 3β-HSD2 and/or 17β-HSD3 through anti-oxidant enzyme potential of RJ. A RCT with larger number of subjects will be necessary to further verify the effects of RJ in more detail.”

Effect of royal jelly ingestion for six months on healthy volunteers

 

[Daniel11]

@Daniel11

I am still sick but started using red light more regularly. Since I am sick and on a lot of medications, i will need some time to understand the real impact. I am using it for 7 min on thyroid and another 5-7 on eyes. I am able to do it only once when I am back from work at around 6:30 Pm. Over the weekends, I do it twice, once in the morning and once in the evening. My impression that it has some metabolism boosting effect as I tend to feel hungry after the red light session. I will update once I recover from this unknown infection. I've already seen two doctors; there is an obvious swelling on my throat but they are not sure what it is.

Hey there, have you tried the Larch Arabinogalactan?

 

[StrongMom]

Hey there, have you tried the Larch Arabinogalactan?

No. I don't think my digestion system is not good enough to handle any prebiotics. My plan is to gradually eliminate various foods until i see a significant improvement. I just had some lamb stew with fruits and fruit juices and i have such gasnow i feel like i am going to explode.

I might try at some point but definitely not at this point.

 

[Daniel11]

No. I don't think my digestion system is not good enough to handle any prebiotics. My plan is to gradually eliminate various foods until i see a significant improvement. I just had some lamb stew with fruits and fruit juices and i have such gasnow i feel like i am going to explode.

I might try at some point but definitely not at this point.

Im not sure why you would drink fruit juice with that meal, and what kind and brand of fruit juice…

The prebiotic qualities of the Larch is the least of its effects, it greatly enhances immune system functioning, you may have a couple days of going through some changes but nothing like your experiencing right now, my digestion felt better from the first day so have others i recommended to and Larch would be my first choice for infections.

If it was me i would get off the meds and start on the Larch, 1tbs 2-3 times a day.

I understand you have to feel your own timing, but maybe you could change it…

Putting the red light on the tummy and liver area after a big meal can help.

 

[StrongMom]

Im not sure why you would drink fruit juice with that meal, and what kind and brand of fruit juice…

The prebiotic qualities of the Larch is the least of its effects, it greatly enhances immune system functioning, you may have a couple days of going through some changes but nothing like your experiencing right now, my digestion felt better from the first day so have others i recommended to and Larch would be my first choice for infections.

If it was me i would get off the meds and start on the Larch, 1tbs 2-3 times a day.

I understand you have to feel your own timing, but maybe you could change it…

Putting the red light on the tummy and liver area after a big meal can help.

Why do you think that fruit juice is wrong with that meal? Too much liquid? I just don't feel getting enough carbs with fruits. Fruit juices are more filling for me when i don't eat starch.

I will reconsider the Larch. I guess i am too afraid at this point. Red light on the tummy is a good idea, will try.

 

[StrongMom]

Hey there, have you tried the Larch Arabinogalactan?

Btw, i ordered atlantil you mentioned. When i look it up, the first thing came up was about gas, bloating associated with constipation. That looked like describing me( especially the figure you see); it might help at this point.

 

[Daniel11]

Btw, i ordered atlantil you mentioned. When i look it up, the first thing came up was about gas, bloating associated with constipation. That looked like describing me( especially the figure you see); it might help at this point.

What is atlantil i referred to, maybe different spelling...

 

[StrongMom]

What is atlantil i referred to, maybe different spelling...

Sorry, I meant @Xisca

But, i also ordered the larch just a few minutes ago...

 

[Daniel11]

Sorry, I meant @Xisca

But, i also ordered the larch just a few minutes ago...

Cool, that should really help, have a nice weekend!

 

[Wagner83]

Royal Jelly is quite estrogenic. Peat has written about this and the main study in the thread on Gonadin about the androgenic effects of MP and MO also mentions it. It contains some chemicals that activate the pituitary in mammals and taking it is probably similar to getting an hCG injection of anything else that boosts LH/FSH.

Thats interesting, it does not feel estrogenic, whats your thoughts on this study...

“In conclusion, six-month ingestion of RJ in humans improved erythropoiesis, glucose tolerance and mental health. These may be due to secondary effects of T with acceleration of conversion from DHEA-S to T by activation of 3β-HSD2 and/or 17β-HSD3 through anti-oxidant enzyme potential of RJ. A RCT with larger number of subjects will be necessary to further verify the effects of RJ in more detail.”

Effect of royal jelly ingestion for six months on healthy volunteers

Thanks, from the gonadin thread:
Androgenic effect of honeybee drone milk in castrated rats: roles of methyl palmitate and methyl oleate. - PubMed - NCBI
"The oestrogenic effect of a fraction of DM has recently been reported in rats. However, no information is available on the androgenic effects of DM."
"The crude DM increased the relative weights of the androgen-dependent organs and the plasma testosterone level in castrated rats and these actions were flutamide-sensitive. DM increased the tissue mRNA and protein level of SLAP, providing further evidence of its androgen-like character."

Drone milk: boosts testosterone and has an anabolic effect too

Drone milk is not the same as Royal Jelly. Honeybees make Royal Jelly as a special nutrient for the queen bees, but give drone milk to worker bees, or drones. Drones are male and one of their tasks is to provide the sperm to fertilize the queen's eggs.

Drone Milk is available as a supplement on the market. The Russian company Apidom produces Frozen Drone Larvae Royal Jelly; the Romanian Biofarm manufactures Apilranil Potent. The Hungarians used fresh drone milk for their experiments, which they had obtained from a professional beekeeper.
The researchers gave castrated rats 11, 110 or 1100 mg drone milk per kg bodyweight for 10 days, and discovered that the 110 mg dose had androgenic and anabolic effects. The human equivalent of this dose would be 17.8 mg per kg bodyweight. So if you weigh 80 kg, you'd need about 1420 mg fresh drone milk daily.
Drone milk [DM] caused the rats' penis to grow and increased the weight of their levator ani muscle, both indications of anabolic and androgenic effects. Synthetic testosterone [T] worked better than drone milk, and the anti-androgen flutamide [F] negated the effects of drone milk.

Not sure if Royal Jelly wouldn't be estrogenic though, ain't estrogens associated with abnormal growth/cell division? The queen is massive.

 

[chrismeyers]

Do you have any idea how a hopeless mom feels like? I doubt that. I am also surprised that you survived this forum last long if you think that supplements, thyroid drugs are crap. Yes, for various reasons I might have overdone it but we benefited from them various ways. One of my sons used to have cold hands and feet, and had constant infections. He was getting antibiotics almost every few weeks at some point. Once he was on thyroid that all stopped. The other guy had eczema; he took thyroid and eczema was gone. Now that I am trying to reduce the dosage, very very slowly, the symptoms are coming back. We have some eczema and my other son is losing his hair like crazy. They were helping!

I, myself, am totally off progesterone now and reduced the pregnenolone to 100mg, down from 600-800mg range. I am right now dealing with high estrogen symptoms. We will see how it will go. I tried to be off thyroid a few months ago (again gradually reducing, waiting for some normalization in my body) I started suffering from severe insomnia, weight gain, extreme bloating and constipation. I felt miserable. I decided that I am going to continue with thyroid, but I can try to be off progenelone and progesterone.

When it comes to a whole foods Peat inspired diet, my feeling is that it helps to people who were born healthy (RP sense) but destroyed their metabolism with pufa, stress, and other things that reduce the metabolism. What if you are born unhealthy? Do foods really solve the problem by themselves? Look. I have PCOS from a young age. My mom had PCOS, my grandmother had PCOS. My boys were born with low metabolism. Can foods raise your metabolism that much? On the other hand, there are a lot of people around here that just eat crap but maintain their high metabolism. I do not have that much hope on RP organic diet.

You do bring up a good point. These Peat forums do seem to bring out a greater percentage of supplement hustlers and miraculous cures. They are hocking everything from hormones to red light now I guess. Which if you actually read Peats work is a minimal part of what he talks about. Mostly its simple. No nut seed or vegetable oils and dont be afraid of sugar.

 

[StrongMom]

Thank you for your great answer and your wonderful posts recently. I am finding this thread very informative. 'Stressed mom' from over here in Australia my thoughts and prayers are with you. I hope you can change your forum name to 'Super mom' or 'healthy mom' even if you are not there yet?
The fact that you got hungry with the red light could be a good sign that your metabolism is improving?
Best of health.

Thanks. I have a few other suggestions for name change. I was thinking of strongmom.

When i first discovered RP's work, i realized that my metabolism was low and my body was compensating with stress hormones. In addition to that, the lifetime stress, and hence stressedmom...

 

[Daniel11]

Thanks, from the gonadin thread:
Androgenic effect of honeybee drone milk in castrated rats: roles of methyl palmitate and methyl oleate. - PubMed - NCBI
"The oestrogenic effect of a fraction of DM has recently been reported in rats. However, no information is available on the androgenic effects of DM."
"The crude DM increased the relative weights of the androgen-dependent organs and the plasma testosterone level in castrated rats and these actions were flutamide-sensitive. DM increased the tissue mRNA and protein level of SLAP, providing further evidence of its androgen-like character."

Drone milk: boosts testosterone and has an anabolic effect too

Not sure if Royal Jelly wouldn't be estrogenic though, ain't estrogens associated with abnormal growth/cell division? The queen is massive.

Thanks for info, i would not want to take anything that was overtly estrogenic, but my main reason for using Royal Jelly is not for increasing testosterone levels directly, Cordyceps Mushrooms would be good for that as well as the red light.

Its essential appeal for me is enhanced cellular functioning and cellular protection. Royal Jelly is hepatoprotective, it also enhances and protects the cellular functioning of the endocrine glands.

Through antiquity it has been said that Royal Jelly imparts charm and appeal to those that ingest it. Royal Jelly was reported to be Cleopatra’s secret to her fame, courage and beauty, i am sure Mark Antony would agree. It would be fun if the great Ancient Library of Alexandria was still here, i bet we would find many illuminating references to its long historical use in medicine. Hypocrites, and Pliny both believed Royal Jelly offered many health benefits.

Royal Jelly is secreted from the glands in the hypo-pharynx of worker bees. It is abundant in bioavailable; proteins, lipids, minerals, amino acids and vitamins.

Royal Jelly has many novel proteins beneficial for human health that are just starting to be discovered, studies show it offers excellent protection of cellular DNA, this cascades in to numerous biological benefits along with contributing to intra and extracellular homeostasis regulation.

“A total of 13 novel proteins and 42 novel N-linked glycosylation sites in 25 N-glycosylated RJ proteins have been identified here. Of the glycosylated proteins, most were related to metabolic activities and carry multiple N-linked glycosylation sites. This is important for young larvae and the fertile egg-laying queen, since their high metabolic fuel demands may be achieved through the regulation of the enzymatic activities related to the metabolic process. The glycosylated proteins related to the improvement of human health suggest N-glycosylation plays a key role in helping RJ proteins accomplish their biological functions. The large scale assignment of N-glycosylated sites represents a crucial first step toward systematically revealing the functionality of N-glycosylated RJ proteins. In addition, the identification of novel proteins mainly associated with metabolic process and promoting human health significantly extend the proteome coverage of RJ.”

Comprehensive identification of novel proteins and N-glycosylation sites in royal jelly

The effects of royal jelly on liver damage induced by paracetamol in mice. - PubMed - NCBI

Protective effect of royal jelly on the sperm parameters and testosterone level and lipid peroxidation in adult mice treated with oxymetholone. - PubMed - NCBI

Contribution of lipids in honeybee (Apis mellifera) royal jelly to health. - PubMed - NCBI