Lisuride facilitates delayed gratification by 5HT-2a antagonism; may be helpful for addiction

Mauritio

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A trait of highly successful people is to choose a bigger long-term reward over a smaller short-term reward. The ability control your emotions and impulses.
A process known as delayed gratification.

The study explains the issue, instant gratification, like this: "...the preference for an immediate small reinforcer (SR) over a delayed large reinforcer (LR)."

If you simply follow your impulses in our modern society, you probably end up beeing addicted to one of the common short term pleasure seeking things, like social media , porn or TV. A vicious cycle leading to a continuous narrowing of the things/devices/activieties, that bring you pleasure, through the downregulation of the dopamine receptors. Which in turn causes a continuously smaller dopamine peak from the same activity.
In one word: addiction.

Anyway... controlling your impulses is important.
This study shows that lisuride leads to rats making less impulsive choices.
On the other hand administration of a 5HT-2a agonist increased impulsivity, which was blocked by giving a 5HT2a receptor antagonist (ketanserin).

In light of this study it makes sense how anti-serotonin chemicals like cyproheptadine, lisuride or ketanserin help people treat addictions ,since they help them not making the bad impulsive choice, whatever that may be.

Human equivalent doses of lisuride were between 1-7mg so they are relatively easily achievable by supplementation.
Would be interesting to know if people tend to indulge in instant gratification things less when taking lisuride.

"DOI (0.5 and 1.0 mg/kg) increased impulsive decision-making, and the effects of DOI (1.0 mg/kg) were blocked by the 5-HT2A receptor antagonist ketanserin (1.0 mg/kg) rather than the 5-HT2C receptor antagonist SB-242084 (1.0 mg/kg). Contrarily, lisuride (0.1, 0.3, and 0.5 mg/kg) decreased impulsive decision-making. The effects of lisuride (0.3 mg/kg) were not antagonized by ketanserin (1.0 mg/kg), selective 5-HT1A antagonist WAY-100635 (1.0 mg/kg), or selective dopamine D4 receptor antagonist L-745870 (1.0 mg/kg) but were attenuated by the selective dopamine D2/D3 receptor antagonist tiapride (40 mg/kg)."
- Contrasting effects of DOI and lisuride on impulsive decision-making in delay discounting task - PubMed
 
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BRMarshall

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Excellent find!
Human equivalent doses of lisuride were between 1-7mg so they are relatively easily achievable by supplementation

Well the Lisuride from Idealabs is .025mg, thus requiring quite a bit, 40 drops to reach 1mg, and relative to a bottle with 240 drops, which is not cheap..but perhaps
a certain push in needed to do the trick and reset the system, hopefully, and then evaluate.
 
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Mauritio

Mauritio

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Excellent find!


Well the Lisuride from Idealabs is .025mg, thus requiring quite a bit, 40 drops to reach 1mg, and relative to a bottle with 240 drops, which is not cheap..but perhaps
a certain push in needed to do the trick and reset the system, hopefully, and then evaluate.
Thanks!
Oh right, for some reason I thought it was 1mg/drop. So the dose needed is actually quite high.
But it's not like they tested a lower dose and that dose was ineffective. So lower doses might be effective ,we just dont know it.
And based on the fact that lisuride does have decent affinity for 5ht2a, it seems somewhat likely that it does work in lower doses as well.

Btw I took 2 drops of lisuride today and now that I think about it , I does feel like I'm less interested in instant gratification things. Like I'm more disciplined, more on track with what I should do, without even trying .
 

golder

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Hold on, isn’t 250mcg 0.25mg? Thus 1mg would only be 4 drops of the Idealabs product, not 40?
 
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I get good results with my rat with 1 or 2 drops in my belly button. I used some with the rat last night for what would be called in a person a "headache."
 
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Mauritio

Mauritio

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Does tobacco (beta-carbolines) work in similar way?
I dont know if they also have the specific anti-serotonin effects at 5ht2a and b. But tobacco/nicotine sure has a pro-dopamine effect.
 

BRMarshall

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The first time the lab mammal tried Lisuride, a few drops, observations were positive confirming markers relative to the cited study ....but then did not repeat experiment for a few weeks and really did not get much from it the next times.... I think a larger dose might be warranted as the expiration date is coming on maybe it is losing juice and the study cited gives credence to larger dosages....
 
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Mauritio

Mauritio

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The first time the lab mammal tried Lisuride, a few drops, observations were positive confirming markers relative to the cited study ....but then did not repeat experiment for a few weeks and really did not get much from it the next times.... I think a larger dose might be warranted as the expiration date is coming on maybe it is losing juice and the study cited gives credence to larger dosages....
Maybe you're developing tolerance.
Did you take it orally ?
 

BRMarshall

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The issue of tolerance was on my mind in not seeking to repeat the experience the next day....BTW ingestion was few drops on skin and a drop in the mouth.

I chose the product as it is an analog (if this is the right word) to LSD, but without the visual psychedelic effect of "tripping" and thus with the potential of acting in the realm of a micro-dose.

It should be noted that the thing with LSD is that it is so powerful, for its size, which i do not see with Lisuride or 10-MeO-Harmalan
 
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Mauritio

Mauritio

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The issue of tolerance was on my mind in not seeking to repeat the experience the next day....BTW ingestion was few drops on skin and a drop in the mouth.
Yeah for me it worked, but I have to experiment further to see if it was really the lisuride.
It should be noted that the thing with LSD is that it is so powerful, for its size, which i do not see with Lisuride or 10-MeO-Harmalan
I dont see the issue , it's not like lsd only comes in mg tabs, you can simply take less of a powerful substance.
 

CoconutEffect

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I had this effect with Mirtazepine, 5ht2 antagonist, waking up the next morning with the realization that I have to dedicate way more time to my business. Simultaneously I completely lost interest in the girl I was seeing. I’ve been in business since 2017.
 
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Mauritio

Mauritio

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I had this effect with Mirtazepine, 5ht2 antagonist, waking up the next morning with the realization that I have to dedicate way more time to my business. Simultaneously I completely lost interest in the girl I was seeing. I’ve been in business since 2017.
Interesting .
 
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Mauritio

Mauritio

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I think Lisuride might be helpful to get that calm but focused mindset that so many people are striving for. ADHD patients could benefit as well.
 
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