Kidney Health

[marikay]

Hi. I'm looking for a few good posts regarding kidney health. Specifically I'm wondering if anyone has advice for keeping infections away. This past January, I ended up in the hospital with a pain on my left side the was unbearable and, after many unnecessary tests, learned I had a wicked kidney infection. I was prescribed cypro (which didn't work till I was through almost two rounds of the stuff) and then I emailed Ray to ask what antibiotic I might order from Mexico and keep around in case the nasty business ever came back. He responded.

Well, now it looks like it's baaaack. The pain is not as bad this time around but it is definitely there. I started taking Pen-Vi-K (Penicillin Potassium) I got from farmacia del nino just this evening. The pills come in 250mg's each. I'm guessing from the various websites I read that I need to take one pill every six to eight hours for ten days to get a full dose of the anitbiotic. If anyone knows anything useful about this stuff, please let me know as I'm flying without much guidance here.

But mostly I am wondering if there are any foods or supplements I should increase, or any I should avoid to keep this problem away. Also, does anyone know if there a specific excipients in supplements that can cause kidney problems.

Any thoughts will be much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

[tara]

HI,
I don't know much about kidney issues and what to do about them.
I know infections there are not good and need to be treated seriously with antibiotics.
And I know they sometimes arise from UTIs.
I was getting recurring UTIs for a while. I got systemic infection from one once (trying to treat it naturally, cause I was sick of taking so many antibiotics), and was very sick. They pretty much stopped when I started drinking a little cranberry juice regularly. It's not enough to stop an active infection, but it does seem to help prevent them for me (along with relevant hygiene, etc). Others report success with D-mannose to treat UTIs.

 

[marikay]

Thanks tara. Before this, I never had any kind of UTI (and I am now in my 50's). I hope that this problem wasn't caused by the peat protocol cause I won't be able to keep following it if I am in danger of losing a kidney. I am hoping the peat forum members have some experience with this (or have read of something somewhere) that can shed some light on the subject for me. I don't have any of the habits normally suspected of causing UTI's and the symptoms I am experiencing aren't the mild (treat with over the counter drugs or supplements) type of symptoms. It's a serious thing. And I'm worried.

 

[Amazoniac]

It was with a DMSA (or DMPS not sure) challenge test with urine. I narrowed it to the kidneys. I had low serum albumin and high albumin excretion through urine. This points to a problem with the kidneys. Not sure about lead toxicity being limited to the bones though.

@burtlancast might know details about testing, I doesn't.

It's easier for me to change protocols with supplementation that with foods. I've already tried more than 2o combinations of electrolytes/anions and I'm now having success in lowering my blood pressure (thru chelation of lead in my kidneys) with a combination of magnesium ascorbate/potassium ascorbate/potassium bicarbonate. Still having to validate it with a week-long trial. The nice thing is the raw materials to make these are very low in cost: magnesium carbonate, l-ascorbic acid, potassium carbonate, and carbon dioxide. I get to play around with various electrolyte/anion pairings as well to find ones that work.

I'm still drinking fresh juices from various tropical fruits - currently pineapple, papaya, and satsuma oranges. I'm also drinking coconut water, from mature coconuts. It's easier though for me to connect the dots though using mineral supplementation. For example, I'm finding that if I take magnesium ascorbate between meals, I seem to be able to effect the lowering of my blood pressure easily.

I've taken plenty of bicarbonates before (both magnesium and potassium), and they lead me to an excessively alkalotic state, and that's where I find myself urinating a lot. I don't get that effect in using ascorbates as the anion, plus I needed the vitamin C to aid in chelating lead. The ascorbate anion is a godsend, as it is not leading to either an acidic state or an alkalotic state, and it isn't costly (unlike amino acid chelates), and it doesn't have a large mass as an anion, so I don't have to consume a large amount of the mineral salt to get my mineral requirements. And lastly, I can use the GLUT4 and SVCT1 transporter to get the mineral in together with its ascorbate anion.

Those are good points. Why do you suspect that it's a problem of lack of electrolytes?
Ascorbic acid might react with impurities and enhance their absorption, similar to what happens with iron. I'm mentioning this because it might be better to take unreacted ascorbic acid, in juice or something.

I'm not sure if you missed the notification, but do you get enough B12 (and digest it well)?
- The association between vitamin B12, albuminuria and reduced kidney function: an observational cohort study

- Chronic Kidney Disease Alters Vitamin A Homeostasis via Effects on Hepatic RBP4 Protein Expression and Metabolic Enzymes
- Vitamin A in the treatment of renal disease | Nephrology Dialysis Transplantation | Oxford Academic (not the one we know)

The problem with B12 supplementation is that it has to be supported not only by the entire B-complex, but also by all nutrients that support vitamin A metabolism. Most people consume enough carotenes, so it's usually other nutrient or condition that's limiting its proper function.

 

[yerrag]

Those are good points. Why do you suspect that it's a problem of lack of electrolytes?

It's really not so much suspecting a lack of electrolytes at first buy just knowing I need to take magnesium to chelate the lead out. Same with ascorbic acid being needed for chelation. But I would experience irregular heart beat later on, and found that if I take potassium, the irregularity goes away.

I also knew that a magnesium deficiency would inhibit calcium absorption. As I take both magnesium and potassium, I also find my cramps going away. As well as arthritic knee pain and seborrheic dermatitis. It must have to do with having enough potassium making it possible to eliminate mto bacteria causing the arthritic and seborrheic dermatitis conditions.

Ascorbic acid might react with impurities and enhance their absorption, similar to what happens with iron. I'm mentioning this because it might be better to take unreacted ascorbic acid, in juice or something.

I'm not taking ascorbic acid now, but magnesium and potassium absorbates.

I'm not sure if you missed the notification, but do you get enough B12 (and digest it well)?

I'm good on the b-vitamins. Have enough b12.

 

[Amazoniac]

It's really not so much suspecting a lack of electrolytes at first buy just knowing I need to take magnesium to chelate the lead out. Same with ascorbic acid being needed for chelation. But I would experience irregular heart beat later on, and found that if I take potassium, the irregularity goes away.

I also knew that a magnesium deficiency would inhibit calcium absorption. As I take both magnesium and potassium, I also find my cramps going away. As well as arthritic knee pain and seborrheic dermatitis. It must have to do with having enough potassium making it possible to eliminate mto bacteria causing the arthritic and seborrheic dermatitis conditions.

I'm not taking ascorbic acid now, but magnesium and potassium absorbates.

I'm good on the b-vitamins. Have enough b12.

Aren't you concerned about ascorbic acid enhancing the absorption of impurities of these supplements?
What about lacking (ultra) trace minerals that always appear with electrolytes in foods? Organs accumulate these, do you think it's toxicity since birth? They appear in milch as well, is it incidental? With supplements you also get some but they should be an industrial kind of impurity: less useful and more toxic.

Bicarbonate salts should not deplete someone of chlorides because they're recovered as digestion proceeds. Carbonate salts must be more difficult and they might involve greater losses. And if chloride needs to be replenished, it's better to do it with sodium since this is how the body is adapted to best given that life originated from ocean (Alberto, whocares), and as far as I know you can't find in nature a lot of it without sodium.

 

[yerrag]

Aren't you concerned about ascorbic acid enhancing the absrption of impurities of these supplementes?

What impurities are you referring to? Iron? I haven't given this much thought. I'm much more concerned about removing the existing lead in my kidneys, using both magnesium and ascorbic acid as chelators. This is the threat that is more immediate. I'm more concerned with the existing harm than the potential harm coming from my supplementation. It is a source of ROS that is slowly destroying my kidneys. I've lost enough time over the years not knowing this condition exists, and even after knowing of the condition and of the cause of it, more time has passed before I finally find something that is actually working. My blood pressure has come down from 240/140 to 170/110, and my serum albumin has increased from 38 to 44, the range being from 36-50. The kidneys are improving its resorption of albumin so less albumin is being excreted. This points to an improving kidney condition.

What about lacking (ultra) trace minerals that always appear with electrolytes in foods? Organs accumulate these, do you think it's toxicity since birth? They appear in milch as well, is it incidental? With supplements you also get some but they should be an industrial kind of impurity: less useful and more toxic.

I'm still taking whole foods, but supplanting mineral supplements with whole foods is not very practical for me. If I needed 800 mg of magnesium daily, how much whole food will give me 800 mg? It would be a lot of green leaves, and even then, how sure am I the green leaves don't come with toxins? And secondly, buying and preparing such food is a burden that can only distract me from properly adhering to my protocol. Faced with a choice between being very safe but tedious and being loose and easy to do, I choose the latter. I would rather do something I can feel reasonably able to accomplish than put myself in a position where I end up not doing it.

Bicarbonate salts should not deplete someone of chlorides because they're recovered as digestion proceeds. Carbonate salts must be more difficult and they might involve greater losses. And if chloride needs to be replenished, it's better to do it with sodium since this is how the body is adapted to best since life originated from ocean (Alberto, whocares), and as far as I know you can't find in nature a lot of it without sodium.

I can use some bicarbonate salts but have to be cognizant of not overdoing it. But it's hard to know when I would be overdoing it so I end up on the side of caution by not taking too much of it. However, when I get to test my urine pH, I could use more bicarbonates knowing I'm not going to be overdoing it. I don't want to overdo carbonates either. But I can easily convert carbonate salts to bicarbonates, ascorbates, and acetates, and that helps keep me from producing gas. I'm not too keen on adding chloride to my supplements as I already get enough sodium chloride from food.

 

[Amazoniac]

What impurities are you referring to? Iron? I haven't given this much thought. I'm much more concerned about removing the existing lead in my kidneys, using both magnesium and ascorbic acid as chelators. This is the threat that is more immediate. I'm more concerned with the existing harm than the potential harm coming from my supplementation. It is a source of ROS that is slowly destroying my kidneys. I've lost enough time over the years not knowing this condition exists, and even after knowing of the condition and of the cause of it, more time has passed before I finally find something that is actually working. My blood pressure has come down from 240/140 to 170/110, and my serum albumin has increased from 38 to 44, the range being from 36-50. The kidneys are improving its resorption of albumin so less albumin is being excreted. This points to an improving kidney condition.


I'm still taking whole foods, but supplanting mineral supplements with whole foods is not very practical for me. If I needed 800 mg of magnesium daily, how much whole food will give me 800 mg? It would be a lot of green leaves, and even then, how sure am I the green leaves don't come with toxins? And secondly, buying and preparing such food is a burden that can only distract me from properly adhering to my protocol. Faced with a choice between being very safe but tedious and being loose and easy to do, I choose the latter. I would rather do something I can feel reasonably able to accomplish than put myself in a position where I end up not doing it.

I can use some bicarbonate salts but have to be cognizant of not overdoing it. But it's hard to know when I would be overdoing it so I end up on the side of caution by not taking too much of it. However, when I get to test my urine pH, I could use more bicarbonates knowing I'm not going to be overdoing it. I don't want to overdo carbonates either. But I can easily convert carbonate salts to bicarbonates, ascorbates, and acetates, and that helps keep me from producing gas. I'm not too keen on adding chloride to my supplements as I already get enough sodium chloride from food.

Does it complex with iron only? Is neutralized ascorbic acid as effective as plain in removing heavy metals from the body? If it works as chelator for lead excretion, can't it chelate for absorption as vvcll? No sarcasm on any of these questions. Depending on it, it might be better to take ascorbic acid in juices without other supplements.

It seems that in various cases a lot of the benefit from bicarbonates is due to carbon dioxide in compensating the impaired production from weak metabolism.

 

[yerrag]

Does it complex with iron only?

I don't really know.

Is neutralized ascorbic acid as effective as plain in removing heavy metals from the body?

I suppose you are referring to mineral ascorbates when you say neutralized ascorbic acid. If so, mineral ascorbates are half as effetive as plain l-ascorbic acid. I had to double the amount of ascorbic acid used to compensate for it.

If it works as chelator for lead excretion, can't it chelate for absorption as vvcll?

It could, which is why I have to take detox supplements such as zinc, selenomethionine, NAC, and PectaClear so as to make sure the chelated lead is kept from recirculating and instead would be excreted.

No sarcasm on any of these questions.

None detected at all.

Depending on it, it might be better to take ascorbic acid in juices without other supplements.

It's not possible. Taking ascorbic acid from whole foods severely limit the amount of ascorbic acid I can take. The level of dosage would make it ineffective. I cannot megadose with whole foods-based vitamin C.

It seems that in various cases a lot of the benefit from bicarbonates is due to carbon dioxide in compensating the impaired production from weak metabolism.

The kidney still has to convert the bicarbonates to carbon dioxide, and this takes time. When there is too much bicarbonates, it would create a metabolic alkalotic condition, and this condition cannot be quickly relieved as the kidneys are limited in its ability to respond quickly.

 

[Amazoniac]

- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 1: Causes
- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 2: Intervention

- A Review of Dietary Supplement-Induced Renal Dysfunction

Toxin exposure from mineral supplements can be brutal over time, cadmium seems notable for kidneys:
- Toxicity, mechanism and health effects of some heavy metals

@charlie @Jennifer

@yerrag, citric acid in foods that isn't unpalatable should be very low on the list of priorities.
- Trace element speciation in human milk

 

[yerrag]

@yerrag, citric acid in foods that isn't unpalatable should be very low on the list of priorities.
- Trace element speciation in human milk

Thanks. It wasn't an easy read for me, but I'll go with you on citrate. If it's not unpalatable, then food with some citrate should be okay.

 

[yerrag]

- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 1: Causes :

Interesting to see that a person (B) from the 95th percentile at 90 years, has a higher glomerular filtration rate than a person (A) from the 5th percentile at 20 years old :

 

[yerrag]

- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 1: Causes :

Interesting to see that a person (B) from the 95th percentile at 90 years, has a higher glomerular filtration rate than a person (A) from the 5th percentile at 20 years old :

How does one get to put oneself at the 95th percentile?

The answer lies in:

- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 2: Intervention

This includes:

1. Decrease total toxic load on the kidneys.
2. Aggressively reduce exposure to nephrotoxins.
3. Increase microcirculation of kidneys.
   1. Beetroot juice
   2. Gotu Kola
   3. Dark chocolate
4. Protect the kidneys from oxidative stress
   1. blueberries
   2. curcumin
   3. ginkgo biloba
   4. ginger

It's interesting that blueberries not only increase GFR in normal kidneys, but " far more importantly completely protects the kidneys from the dramatic lowering of GFR caused by gut toxins in those with impaired function." I wonder if this has implications also in lowering cases of UTI. Same can be said for ginkgo biloba.

Nice find @Amazoniac!

 

[Blossom]

It's interesting that blueberries not only increase GFR in normal kidneys, but " far more importantly completely protects the kidneys from the dramatic lowering of GFR caused by gut toxins in those with impaired function." I wonder if this has implications also in lowering cases of UTI. Same can be said for ginkgo biloba.

I believe a couple forum members have noticed improved kidney filtration from berries.

 

[Jennifer]

- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 1: Causes
- The Kidney Dysfunction Epidemic, Part 2: Intervention

- A Review of Dietary Supplement-Induced Renal Dysfunction

Toxin exposure from mineral supplements can be brutal over time, cadmium seems notable for kidneys:
- Toxicity, mechanism and health effects of some heavy metals

@charlie @Jennifer

Thanks for tagging me! I appreciate it. :)

 

[Amazoniac]

Are you okay, G?

More or less after reading this estimation of cadmium intake from foods:

- Cadmium in foods and the diet

↳ [28] Cadmium Contents in Foods and the Estimation of Cadmium Uptake from Foods

No need to avoid my name!

 

[Jennifer]

I believe a couple forum members have noticed improved kidney filtration from berries.

Berries are said to be excellent for endocrine gland health and since the adrenals turn the kidneys on and off, essentially, it makes sense to me why some of us here have seen an improvement in our kidney filtration while consuming berries. :)

More or less after reading this estimation of cadmium intake from foods:

- Cadmium in foods and the diet

View attachment 11307​

↳ [28] Cadmium Contents in Foods and the Estimation of Cadmium Uptake from Foods

View attachment 11304​

Fair enough. Mystery it is then.

Thanks for sharing the estimations. I was willing to give up the habit of sniffing paint and licking batteries, but not fruit consumption. Melon is life!

No need to avoid my name!

Okay, good! Writing it like that, I always felt like the G was lonely without his ustavo.

 

[michael94]

I believe a couple forum members have noticed improved kidney filtration from berries.

whortleberries = immunocompetent

 

[michael94]

Berries are said to be excellent for endocrine gland health and since the adrenals turn the kidneys on and off, essentially, it makes sense to me why some of us here have seen an improvement in our kidney filtration while consuming berries. :)

Fair enough. Mystery it is then.

Thanks for sharing the estimations. I was willing to give up the habit of sniffing paint and licking batteries, but not fruit consumption. Melon is life!

Okay, good! Writing it like that, I always felt like the G was lonely without his ustavo.

do Grumbeere count?
what about Erdäpfel or Grundbirnen

@Amazoniac

 

[Amazoniac]

In case you've missed..
- The Vitamin K Metabolome in Chronic Kidney Disease
- Vitamin K Deficiency in Chronic Kidney Disease: Evidence Is Building Up

IMN victim count: 3.