K2 - Impacted Wisdom

[Ilvar]

Hi all,

Received my Thorne k2/D3 drops in the mail this morning. Tried maybe 10-15 drops over my body throughout the day (scrotum, throat, wrists, jaw, cheeks, brow). Maybe over the top but it’s my first time with k2 and i was excited after reading everybodys’ experiences with it.

Later in the afternoon my bottom right second molar started hurting. An x-Ray from last year shows I only have the bottom set of wisdom teeth, both horizontally impacting against my second molars. Anyway, up until now the pain has been pretty bad, it’s subsiding now but I wonder if the k2 drops have caused this? Looking in the mirror I can see my bottom right second molar has shifted inward in my mouth and this is the first time in a while that it’s hurt.

If I continue the k2 do you think it could help my bottom wisdoms emerge properly? Two orthodontists have said because my jaw is small and the second molars are partially covered by gum, they’ll have to potentially remove at least one of my second molars and then cut into the gum for the wisdoms . I don’t want that, but I read Ray ate a few mgs a day of DHEA which allowed his wisdoms to emerge properly, so I’d like the same to happen. I’ve been peating mostly consistently for the past few months now. Maybe this could be a k2 log.

Anybody else have experiences with k2 and wisdom teeth pain or similar? Also, is it possible to “induce” my missing top set of wisdoms to develop? I feel like my flat cheekbones/midface area could be to do with the fact that I’m missing upper wisdoms?

 

[foodandtheworld]

I don't know the answer to your question, but I'd make sure you are getting enough calcium if you are going to continue this plan. The weird effects I got from K2 (e.g., visible veins in eyes after waking up, or more difficult sleep) I think were due to when I took a lot of K2 as experiments but didn't take enough calcium to support it. They didn't really appear if I took more calcium on higher K2 days (e.g., I remember needing something like 2L+ of milk when I took 15mg of K2 one day). Not saying you'll need that much but consider it if you get weird effects. So a good milk/cheese that you can digest comfortably would be helpful. I don't have experience with calcium supplements.

 

[Ilvar]

I don't know the answer to your question, but I'd make sure you are getting enough calcium if you are going to continue this plan. The weird effects I got from K2 (e.g., visible veins in eyes after waking up, or more difficult sleep) I think were due to when I took a lot of K2 as experiments but didn't take enough calcium to support it. They didn't really appear if I took more calcium on higher K2 days (e.g., I remember needing something like 2L+ of milk when I took 15mg of K2 one day). Not saying you'll need that much but consider it if you get weird effects. So a good milk/cheese that you can digest comfortably would be helpful. I don't have experience with calcium supplements.

Thanks for sharing that with me. I currently drink about 1L of trim milk with added calcium each day, but probably should up it to 2L. Also interested in eggshell calcium which seems potent. According to chronometer my calcium/phosphate ratio is okay but I will add more calcium with this k2.

 

[baccheion]

Ray Peat said something about his molars coming in after taking DHEA (10 mg?).

 

[Gone Peating]

Ray Peat said something about his molars coming in after taking DHEA (10 mg?).

I can attest to the ability of dhea (pansterone) to erupt molars - it worked for me

 

[Ilvar]

I can attest to the ability of dhea (pansterone) to erupt molars - it worked for me

Thanks for your guys responses. Regarding DHEA and Pansterone, I’m only 22 so I’m hesitant to try those out but if it means saving my wisdom teeth then I’ll give them a go .

I’ve had my retainer out over night while I slept last night and all day today, my two top front teeth normally shift back to overlap but they’ve remained flat/straightened for the past 24+ hours which is a good sign. I’m meant to keep this retainer in as ive just come off braces but every time I chew carrots with the retainer in my upper molars get this nagging discomfort, like the carrot material is slicing the gums between the molars and my dental arch wants to expand. I’ve just chewed on a carrot now without the retainer in and no discomfort which was nice.

Day 2 is probably too early to say it’s the k2/d3 drops preventing the tooth overlap and carrot-chewing discomfort, but I’m optimistic. Also, no wisdom tooth pain today but my bottom right second molar is tipping inwards now much more so than my bottom left second molar. Hopefully my wisdoms will eventually emerge without any problems.

 

[Gone Peating]

Thanks for your guys responses. Regarding DHEA and Pansterone, I’m only 22 so I’m hesitant to try those out but if it means saving my wisdom teeth then I’ll give them a go .

I’ve had my retainer out over night while I slept last night and all day today, my two top front teeth normally shift back to overlap but they’ve remained flat/straightened for the past 24+ hours which is a good sign. I’m meant to keep this retainer in as ive just come off braces but every time I chew carrots with the retainer in my upper molars get this nagging discomfort, like the carrot material is slicing the gums between the molars and my dental arch wants to expand. I’ve just chewed on a carrot now without the retainer in and no discomfort which was nice.

Day 2 is probably too early to say it’s the k2/d3 drops preventing the tooth overlap and carrot-chewing discomfort, but I’m optimistic. Also, no wisdom tooth pain today but my bottom right second molar is tipping inwards now much more so than my bottom left second molar. Hopefully my wisdoms will eventually emerge without any problems.

Preg and dhea(as long as you keep it under 10mg a day) are some of the safest things to supplement with, they won't cause suppression of your body's endogenous production

 

[baccheion]

Preg and dhea(as long as you keep it under 10mg a day) are some of the safest things to supplement with, they won't cause suppression of your body's endogenous production

10 mg of each or total?

 

[Ilvar]

Day 3: had a remarkably good sleep last night. I did wake up twice but that’s normal since I have to go to the bathroom and I like to check my alarm for work early in the morning. What stood out most about last nights sleep is how peaceful and relaxed I felt, a sense of relaxation I haven’t normally experienced and the sleep quality was great. Enough energy to get up early for the train to work too. Maybe this can be attributed to decreased cortisol/other stress hormones?

No tooth pain, teeth are still straight without my retainer. Wisdom tooth has a bad odour which is minimised through warm salt water gargling. Minor gum swelling around the impacted second molar/wisdom but no pain. Applying the k2/d3 drops onto my teeth to see if I can reduce the brown spots on my molars.

I need to try be more consistent, I’ve probably applied around 20 drops altogether around scrotum, throat, wrists and face, teeth.

 

[Gone Peating]

10 mg of each or total?

You want to keep dhea under 10mg per day since it can aromatize at higher doses, so anything beyond 10mg is supposed to be pointless and mostly detrimental

According to Peat you can take high doses of preg but after a certain point it's superfluous and the body doesn't use it. Also apparently when applied topically at low doses like 3-5mg preg highly favors the androgenic route. Haidut has a thread on this

 

[baccheion]

You want to keep dhea under 10mg per day since it can aromatize at higher doses, so anything beyond 10mg is supposed to be pointless and mostly detrimental

According to Peat you can take high doses of preg but after a certain point it's superfluous and the body doesn't use it. Also apparently when applied topically at low doses like 3-5mg preg highly favors the androgenic route. Haidut has a thread on this

So 5 mg DHEA 2x/day (with 5 mg pregnenolone each time)? 2.5 mg DHEA + 2.5 mg pregnenolone 2x/day?

 

[Kray]

So 5 mg DHEA 2x/day (with 5 mg pregnenolone each time)? 2.5 mg DHEA + 2.5 mg pregnenolone 2x/day?

You want to keep dhea under 10mg per day since it can aromatize at higher doses, so anything beyond 10mg is supposed to be pointless and mostly detrimental

According to Peat you can take high doses of preg but after a certain point it's superfluous and the body doesn't use it. Also apparently when applied topically at low doses like 3-5mg preg highly favors the androgenic route. Haidut has a thread on this

Does anyone know if the androgenic response happens at low doses in women, too? If so, does this mean women should do MORE topical pregnenolone, or does oral route benefit women better for some reason?

 

[ddjd]

Preg and dhea(as long as you keep it under 10mg a day) are some of the safest things to supplement with, they won't cause suppression of your body's endogenous production

any idea why dhea might cause insomnia?

 

[danishispsychic]

just get those wisdom teeth out , it's not a big surgery.

 

[BigChad]

I don't know the answer to your question, but I'd make sure you are getting enough calcium if you are going to continue this plan. The weird effects I got from K2 (e.g., visible veins in eyes after waking up, or more difficult sleep) I think were due to when I took a lot of K2 as experiments but didn't take enough calcium to support it. They didn't really appear if I took more calcium on higher K2 days (e.g., I remember needing something like 2L+ of milk when I took 15mg of K2 one day). Not saying you'll need that much but consider it if you get weird effects. So a good milk/cheese that you can digest comfortably would be helpful. I don't have experience with calcium supplements.

So k2 massively lowers calcium in the body?
What if you did 5mg or 7mg k2 instead.
Id rather not increase calcium to handle k2, im already at like 1500mg, seems ridiculous and dangerous to have to boost calcium to handle k2, if thats the case who knows what else the k2 and calcium are depleting or imbalancing downstream

 

[Gone Peating]

just get those wisdom teeth out , it's not a big surgery.

I respectfully disagree, it can be potentially harmful, especially if taken out all at the same time. No one wisdom tooth is the same, and often they can be difficult to remove - keep in mind even with modern advancements dentists often have to revert to literally yanking them out. During the process, nerves and soft tissue can be damaged and those types of injuries can take considerable time to heal.

My dentist that treated me for tmj did a lot of studies and collected tons of data through the help of other participating dentists over the years, and one of the things that caused tmj at a statistically significant level was getting all of your wisdom teeth removed at the same time.

 

[Gone Peating]

So 5 mg DHEA 2x/day (with 5 mg pregnenolone each time)? 2.5 mg DHEA + 2.5 mg pregnenolone 2x/day?

i think either one would work fine, if you are doing the 5mg dhea maybe also take a little vitamin e or k to help prevent aromatization

 

[Gone Peating]

Does anyone know if the androgenic response happens at low doses in women, too? If so, does this mean women should do MORE topical pregnenolone, or does oral route benefit women better for some reason?

that's a good question tbh, i'm not sure. i know the higher the dosage the more that is supposed to be converted into allopregnenelone and progesterone. Though i imagine pregnenelone overall is less likely to go down the androgen pathway in females as it is in males but i am not sure

 

[Gone Peating]

any idea why dhea might cause insomnia?

lol i do not. was it taken on its own or alongside preg/progest?

people notice different effects from preg/progest/dhea from what i have noticed on this forum, i think it mostly just depends on one's individual hormonal profile

 

[BigChad]

lol i do not. was it taken on its own or alongside preg/progest?

people notice different effects from preg/progest/dhea from what i have noticed on this forum, i think it mostly just depends on one's individual hormonal profile

are dhea and pregnolone okay to take in a hypothyroid state. what about an autoimmune hypothyroid state. do thyroid nodules need to be removed somehow before attempting any metabolic/thyroid boosting adjustments? someone mentioned that but did not expand on it