Is A Peat Diet For Me?

[YuraCZ]

I think you dont understand the point, if you eat high fat low carb, and your metabolism is higher than your fat intake, you will loose weight of course. But if you eat more fat than you burn, you will gain weight.

However, if you eat low fat high carb, even if you are overfeeding, it is hard for the body to store those carbs as fat. It is much much easier for the body to store fat calories as fat, then to store carb calories as fat, that is the point.

So many people have done experiments eating very low fat, and around 1kg of sugar from fruits or whatever, and they dont gain any weight. Why? Because the body enlarges the glycogen storage first, and then preferes to burn the extra sugar as heat, instead of storing it as fat.

However if you eat 500g of sugar, and then add to this a lot of fat, your bodies energy needs are already satisfied with the carbs, and the extra fat is very easily stored as body fat, so many people rapidly gain weight on high carb + high fat diets. The OP is an example of that.

lol you are right but like I said
Statement "the fat you eat is the fat you wear" is nonsense period.

 

[Mufasa]

lol you are right but like I said
Statement "the fat you eat is the fat you wear" is nonsense period.

Ehm yes very much "lol", but I think it is true... But indeed your arguments against are flawless, thanks for enlightening us...

It is not saying, you will definitely get fat from eating much fat, it just says, that the fat you wear comes from the fat you eat. If you eat a lot of fat, and are not fat, you are apparently burning those fatty acids for energy. But IF you are fat, the fat comes from the fat in your diet.

This is true, because protein and carbs are not easily converted to fat... As I tried to explain in my last post...

 

[Revo]

Well just a quick update. I have changed my eating plan to a very ketogenic diet. I have used the guidelines from the Mayo Clinic as well as Dr. Dom D'Amato and his work with the Navy. I have increased my fat intake, which was already high according to some of the folks on this thread. I have greatly reduced my carbohydrates to between 20 and 40 grams per day, with almost no sugar intake. I stopped some of the Peat inspired supplements, such as many of the vitamins and Tyromax. However I have kept the Gelatin, and some basics such as vitamin E,A,entire B complex (done via injection), and K and D. And I get at least an hour per day outside. And I added one supplement, Kegenix which is a compound to introduce ketones exogenously.

What are the results? Well keeping in mind that my that I gained so much weight on the Ray Peat diet I went to my peak weight and then past that rapidly. I have now lost 3.5 lbs in 7 days, (I started 10 days ago) I dont check my weight daily only weekly but when I did my weight is very consistent. As someone on here said weight will fluctuate greatly day to day. This is not the case with me, very consistent. I feel very good, have plenty of energy and my mind is clear. I am sleeping well, I was sleeping well before but now even better. I do not have that bloated feeling I had before on Pete. My clothes are starting to fit me again though still a little tight. My hip to waist ratio even though still high has come down .05 so that is good also. I am still new in this change. I believe I still have a long way to go.

I do get a little upset stomach in the morning after drinking the kegenix, but it is not severe and goes away after about an hour, been told that is normal sometimes when body is learning how to process the ketones. And will eventually not happen. I do miss those sweet shakes and ice cream and orange juice, but not that much. I have had no cravings for carbs or had any cheat episodes. Not a lot of hunger, occasionally I am hungry and I eat some cheese or nuts or olives or a snack of pepperonis, or celery with cream cheese etc. and I am good to go.

I know there has been much discussion about high fat vs low fat. There are some really smart guys on here who know biochemistry a lot better than me. I would love to hear your thoughts.

Also I will be getting some labs done soon, and will report back with these also. At the least it should be interesting.

 

[YuraCZ]

"I know there has been much discussion about high fat vs low fat. There are some really smart guys on here who know biochemistry a lot better than me. I would love to hear your thoughts."
Why everybody wants to do some extremes like low this or low that etc..? But in terms of low carb vs low fat. Low carb over time = decreased metabolism, low glycogen storage, high stress hormones etc.. High carb + enough fat with fat soluble vitamins is better scenario. The more carbs you can eat without gaining excess of fat. The faster metabolism you will have. You will have more energy, more T3 in the blood and low stress hormones. So it's much better then low carb. Simply if you want a lot of energy to live life. Then low carb is not an option..

 

[Emstar1892]

"I know there has been much discussion about high fat vs low fat. There are some really smart guys on here who know biochemistry a lot better than me. I would love to hear your thoughts."
Why everybody wants to do some extremes like low this or low that etc..? But in terms of low carb vs low fat. Low carb over time = decreased metabolism, low glycogen storage, high stress hormones etc.. High carb + enough fat with fat soluble vitamins is better scenario. The more carbs you can eat without gaining excess of fat. The faster metabolism you will have. You will have more energy, more T3 in the blood and low stress hormones. So it's much better then low carb. Simply if you want a lot of energy to live life. Then low carb is not an option..

I agree, having spent a year in ketosis (2013-14) myself. Lost a lot of (water) weight, gained a sharp (cortisol-driven) mind, and all my ailments/symptoms disappeared (until they reappeared, much, much worse).

I wish you luck whatever happens though, and I suggest that you keep a very close eye on your body and mind, and make sure you separate that from anything you believe/read :) implicit bias is the worst!

 

[800mRepeats]

I agree, having spent a year in ketosis (2013-14) myself. Lost a lot of (water) weight, gained a sharp (cortisol-driven) mind, and all my ailments/symptoms disappeared (until they reappeared, much, much worse).

Yep. I felt AMAZING - all was right in my world - until it wasn't.

I didn't crash; instead, I just started a slow decline. All of the old annoyances that a ketogenic diet *fixed* were still at bay; so, I still thought I was on the right track. But ... eventually (after about a year) I realized that I was tense all the time, couldn't get my shoulders down out of my ears, hypervigilant, and ill-tempered. Started trying to correct that (unsuccessfully) while keeping the *good* stuff. Then (about 2 years in) noticed other things were off - slow healing, running performance not improving, hair and nails had stopped growing (low maintenance! but not right), etc.

Now, over the past 2 years, I've been re-introducing carbs, adopting and adapting Peatish practices - trying to find my sweet spot. (Which, admittedly is a bit more challenging as I've continued as an endurance athlete - balancing fitness, performance, and health.)

Good luck on your journey, Revo.

 

[Emstar1892]

Yep. I felt AMAZING - all was right in my world - until it wasn't.

I didn't crash; instead, I just started a slow decline. All of the old annoyances that a ketogenic diet *fixed* were still at bay; so, I still thought I was on the right track. But ... eventually (after about a year) I realized that I was tense all the time, couldn't get my shoulders down out of my ears, hypervigilant, and ill-tempered. Started trying to correct that (unsuccessfully) while keeping the *good* stuff. Then (about 2 years in) noticed other things were off - slow healing, running performance not improving, hair and nails had stopped growing (low maintenance! but not right), etc.

Now, over the past 2 years, I've been re-introducing carbs, adopting and adapting Peatish practices - trying to find my sweet spot. (Which, admittedly is a bit more challenging as I've continued as an endurance athlete - balancing fitness, performance, and health.)

Good luck on your journey, Revo.

Sucks, doesn't it 800mRepeats.

One other thing I forgot to mention, but that I think is integral to gauging health status, is libido. Mine ended up disappearing a year into keto. Entirely. Now that I've reintroduced carbohydrate it's like I'm on fire haha.

 

[800mRepeats]

Sucks, doesn't it 800mRepeats.

One other thing I forgot to mention, but that I think is integral to gauging health status, is libido. Mine ended up disappearing a year into keto. Entirely. Now that I've reintroduced carbohydrate it's like I'm on fire haha.

Oh, yeah. Almost forgot about that!

 

[Revo]

Thanks for the comments they are appreciated. Long term will tell me a lot. I will keep an eye on the other symptoms you all talk about and report back.

Yuracz you talk about people wanting to go low carb or low fat. I dont want to do either. I want to eat everything and not become a fat tub of lard. Unfortunately that does not happen. One thing to keep in mind. I am the initial phase of ketosis so I have very low carbs. But in the future I will add more carbs later on, and try to remain in ketosis. And we will see how that goes.

Emstar, you say it took about a year for things to fall apart. That is interesting, what changed in a year that you would not have seen in the first couple of months? Im curious how do you know you were loosing water weight? How do you tell this vs you are losing fat or muscle weight? Did your clothes size change significantly?
As for the libido, so far so good. I will definitely keep an eye on that. lol

Thanks for the info 800m. I am fascinated by this change in physiology so far down the road. 2 Years and then things go wrong. It seems like such a long time to see symptoms when we eat 3 times a day, every day. But then I am not a runner so maybe there is something there. When I get my blood work done I am going to have a test for cortisol to see where I am at. Also have them test for inflammation even though at this time I have no ailments or taking any medications. I want to see where I am at.

 

[800mRepeats]

@Revo The "change" didn't happen 2 years in - I didn't *notice* the changes (and put it together) until then. Like boiling a frog.

It's not the foods that cause the symptoms, per se; it's the cumulative effects of the overall diet.

The body needs *sugar* and has mechanisms to ensure that it gets it even when deprived of it in the diet - effectively cannibalizing the body's lean tissues to get it. (You've no doubt read about that here and in Peat's articles etc.) *Unnecessary* processes (such as hair & nail growth, reproduction/fertility) are scaled back in this time of scarcity as metabolism slows going into *power saving mode* to preserve the body.

 

[Area-1255]

I read the part about Cysteine which is definitely interesting.

 

[Revo]

800m You are right I dont get it. Are you saying the body, when it does not have sugar or carbs eats its own lean tissue mass to make sugar?

Please explain I do not understand if the body is getting protein and fat and some carbs and water and minor elements. Why it would then turn to cannibalizing its own body. Why not use the food that is in its own digestive tract?

Isnt the body's own tissue protein and fat, why would it choose this over the food it is being fed?

 

[Emstar1892]

800m You are right I dont get it. Are you saying the body, when it does not have sugar or carbs eats its own lean tissue mass to make sugar?

Please explain I do not understand if the body is getting protein and fat and some carbs and water and minor elements. Why it would then turn to cannibalizing its own body. Why not use the food that is in its own digestive tract?

Isnt the body's own tissue protein and fat, why would it choose this over the food it is being fed?

On a truly ketogenic diet, the body wouldn't cannibalise. However, its actually very difficult to achieve true ketosis. The body takes weeks to months to adapt (sometimes never does), so during the transitional stage you stand to lose a lot of tissue - as it's used to burning sugar it raises your cortisol to sky high levels to try and make glucose from lean tissue. Then, it gives up on this and starts producing ketones - even at this stage, the body is not *utilising* the ketones, though they will show up in the blood with tests like keto meters and ketostix. Down the line, if you're lucky, you eventually convert. The best measure is to compare ketone level to glucose level. Both should be around 4, glucose no higher and ketones no lower. Cortisol minimal. Insulin minimal. At this stage, you've reached true ketosis, though of course, you are then insulin resistant and not adapted to carbohydrate, so any metabolic remedy hoped for is an illusion, unless you are simply hoping for a permanently ketogenic life.

You asked me how I knew it was water weight - because the return to carbohydrates made weight gain instantaneously revert to pre-keto levels. We're talking hours to days here for the reversal.

You also asked me what happened down the line after a year that wouldn't have shown up in the first 2 months - my metabolism slowed and thyroid levels dropped, and I gained a lot of weight (fat). In the first 2 months, I had been lean and muscular. I also lost the ability to work out and when doing intense cardiovascular exercise I would crash and stay crashed after around 15 minutes - in the first 2 months, I'd had boundless energy. I also saw the hurrendous and exacerbated return of candida symptoms towards the end, which in the first 2 months seemed to have disappeared. Lastly, I became depressed and emotionally numb (and sexually disengaged), to the point that I couldn't make the same jokes with friends, rarely laughed, and just wasn't witty or animated any more. In the first 2 months, I'd had more personality than ever.

The things that improved and stayed improved, for reference, were: the elimination of acne/pimples - my skin was glowing and clear. My digestion was smooth and I didnt bloat after meals (although my slow metabolism meant that i 'went' every 3 days). I didn't have horrible blood sugar spikes after meals. I was very focused at work.