Iron Chelation

Discussion in 'Messtafarian' started by messtafarian, Sep 8, 2013.

  1. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    It's not that I want to remove more, Its just I rather do it at home.

    Yes blood donation is every 2 months. I have been donating around 1.5 years now I think.
     
  2. HDD

    HDD Member

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    Being able to do it at home would be a good option for those that are not allowed to donate. Leeches, anyone? :eek
     
  3. Peata

    Peata Member

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    Thank goodness for my menstrual cycle (words that are pretty much never said otherwise).

    I'm interested in what you guys come up with though, as eventually I won't have my monthly "donation" for iron removal.
     
  4. edwardBe

    edwardBe Member

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    It's not that simple.

    First, the last time I checked, you can't walk into a pharmacy and buy syringes and needles without a prescription, in the US, anyway. They assume that you are going to use the needles and syringes to inject drugs, for some reason, and all they will sell you is an insulin syringe which holds 1 ml at the most and has a 27 (tiny) gauge needle that is usually permanently attached to the end.

    Second, you need at least an 18 gauge needle, a 16 gauge is even better, both of which are hard to buy, unless you go to a livestock supply store, and you need to look like you are involved with livestock or they may not sell them to you. This size needle is necessary to get a decent flow rate without having to pull hard on the syringe attached to the needle and collapsing the vein. Sticking yourself with a 18 or 16 gauge needle is no fun, I can assure you after using them to cannulate the fistulas and grafts of diaysis patients for many years. They get used to it, but many of them still insist on local anesthesia beforehand.

    Third, there is no such thing as a 450 - 500 ml. syringe, so you need to pipe the blood into a bag like they do when you donate blood or else have some way of disconnecting the syringe, emptying it and then reconnecting it without letting your blood run out the back of the needle. it would be difficult legally to buy the kind of sterile tubing you need to connect to the back of the needle, and the kind of sterile bag to collect the blood, I suspect. The biggest syringe I've seen with a luer lock connector is 50 ml, which also is only available at a livestock supply place. That size syringe means drawing the syringe full of blood 9 or 10 times to get the 450 to 500 mls you want to lose. If you try to do that, the blood in the needle will clot at some point, as will the blood in the syringe, unless you anti-coagulate yourself with heparin or coumadin first which is dangerous by itself. Even the blood in the tubing may clot even if you can get the tubing. The tubing in blood donation places is pre-treated to keep the blood from clotting, as is the collection bag.

    Fourth, all this needs to be done using sterile technique so that you don't give yourself an abscess at the puncture site. This means swabbing your skin with betadine or something similar and letting it sit for a few minutes beforehand.

    Finally, and this is by no means all of the little complications, it is illegal to dispose of blood, syringes and needles without incinerating them.

    All this hot air is based on decades of experience with hemodialysis patients both in clinics and hospitals, I haven't done any of this for a couple of years, but this is not something that changes quickly. Of course, things may different where you live, but do a lot of research before you try to phlebotomize yourself at home. If you know a nurse, ask them how you could do it. She/he may not be willing to help you for legal reasons and will probably think you are nuts, since this is well outside their training. Sort of like asking a dietitian about a good source of saturated fat.
     
  5. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Party pooper. :lol:
     
  6. 4peatssake

    4peatssake Member

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    Yeah well, I won't be trying that at home. :lol
     
  7. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Looks like we are back to leeches. :rolling
     
  8. 4peatssake

    4peatssake Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  9. edwardBe

    edwardBe Member

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    Sorry. I wish there was an easier way to do it. I can't donate, as I said. I really don't think I have any mad cow prions, although I do tend to moo softly to myself occasionally and then giggle afterwards.

    I actually did walk through a leech-filled mud puddle when I was little. They were very small and utterly painless, but scared the bajoobas out of me. I tore them off in a state of panic. and ran home bleeding like crazy for about 15 minutes or so. Yucch!
     
  10. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    :rolling

    Hey no worries I appreciate you chiming in. :hattip
     
  11. 4peatssake

    4peatssake Member

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    I know that terror.

    When I was a kid, I had a huge one sucking my thigh for several hours, unnoticed until blood start running down my leg!! That experienced freaked me out for years and I'd come out from swimming and examine my body from head to toe. It hurt like hell only after my mom got the thing off me, using salt if I remember correctly. :cry:
     
  12. burtlancast

    burtlancast Member

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    Finding the needles/ syringe shouldn't be a problem, as even cheap printing cartridges come with them. I have bought in France syringes and needles without the slightest problem.

    Dealing with hemodialysis patients is completely different than everyday people; their veins have scarred over time because the frequent punctures.
    You don't need anesthesia to puncture normal skin; the pain is perfectly bearable ( if you're the sensistive type, use DMSO).
    Anti clotting with heparine isn't necessary if you take 800IU of Vit E/ day.
    And all the measures of avoiding spilling blood don't apply here, since you're doing the puncture on yourself.

    I have done on myself sub cutaneous injections more times i care to count; the first time is a little intimidating, then you quickly get used to it.

    If i try to do this in the future, i will try to post the results here.
     
  13. Mittir

    Mittir Member

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    I believe Leech Therapy is much safer and suitable for at home self experimentation
    compared to needle and syringe .There are companies that supplies the right kind of leech by courier service.
    I have seen some youtube videos on people using leech for Arthritis.
     
  14. Peata

    Peata Member

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    Just doing a quick search, I saw a website where you can get a pound of large - jumbo size leeches for $30. They aren't available til Spring 2014. This is a bait website -they also sell nightcrawlers, crickets, mealworms, etc.

    Do you need a certain "medical breed" though, as if it would be more sanitary?
     
  15. jyb

    jyb Member

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    Would you consider 4-8 times a year frequent? That's what would one get with a few blood donation and the odd blood test.
     
  16. burtlancast

    burtlancast Member

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    "Chronic hemodialysis is usually done three times per week, for about 3–4 hours for each treatment"

    That's 144 punctures/ year. Every year.

    No wonder their veins get scarred.

    8 times/ year is nothing.
     
  17. Peata

    Peata Member

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    Found a website selling school science equipment and products, where you can get a 6-pack of leeches for about $23 or 3 leeches for about $12. But live items ship for $12.50 - 30.00 depending on how many you're buying.

    They do look different than the bait leeches I mentioned earlier.
     
  18. Peata

    Peata Member

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    So is anybody up for trying leeches?
     
  19. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Hmmmmmmmm.
     
  20. HDD

    HDD Member

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    NOT EVER!!!!!


    :eek :eek :eek :eek :eek :eek
     
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