Iodine making hypothyroid symptoms worse?

[Makrosky]

Thats false, I discussed with Jam several times and he said Ray only had an issue with iodine, not with iodide. He implied several times that Ray believes high doses of iodide are helpful/have no side effects! I did email Ray to clarify on that and he said it doesnt matter whether its iodide or iodine he still doesnt recommend supplementing it.
By all means, you can continue to supplement, experiment with iodine... I dont have an issue with that at all. Im saying it is misleading to say that its Peat approved... like there are certain scenarios Peat has approved of even iron (excessive blood loss) and PUFA (organ transplant). im sure theres some unique conditions where Peat may believe high iodine usage is worth the risks/side effects.

That's the official explanation for iodized salt, but it is similar to the explanations given for fluoridated water, vaccines, fortified vitamins in milk, fortified vitamins in breads... and many other things. so there is a trend of something starting because of a supposed health benefit and maybe there was a need/benefit at the time, but all these things have risks and of course the conspiracy theorists believe these were added intentionally to harm our health.

I havent looked into povidone, is that a special povidone iodine solution they use, or is it just povidone by itself that contains lots of iodine? I know iodine has been used as a disinfectant, but the thing is that is used topically on wounds, not orally, moreover it is just a one time thing. a one time instance likely wont have significant effects. When I took 3-4mg, once a week, after the first week I was at the same weight... after the second week it was a few pounds heavier, then the third/fourth/5th and 6th weeks there was significant gain in weight (all fat/water gain), and a lot of hair thinning on the scalp, and even testicle shrinkage and some nipple tenderness. end result was 21 pounds heavier in just 6 weeks! Ive looked on youtube and theres many people with similar experiences. important to note, as Ray has said, people selling iodine supplements have an incentive to market and exaggerate/lie about their claims... on the other hand common folk have nothing to gain from being against supplementing one specific nutrient in high doses

for surgeries it obviously outweighs the risks of thyroid damage. its also just a one time incident, not a repeated oral intake. moreover keep in mind mainstream medicine/fda has upper limit of iodine set to 1000mcg as the daily safe upper limit so they consider that to be the maximum amount you can take daily and not overdose. I cant say really how much iodine would be absorbed in the body, especially by the thyroid, from the surgeries which involve topical application of iodine

That's fine. Don't take iodine.

 

[Jam]

I will give Mr. Bollox the benefit of the doubt and post this one last time:


From "The transparency of life: Cataracts as a model of age-related disease" by Ray Peat.

One of the best-known free radical scavenging substances that has been widely used as a drug is iodide. It has been used to treat asthma, parasites, syphilis, cancer, Graves’ disease, periodontal disease, and arteriosclerosis. Diseases that produce tissue overgrowth associated with inflammation--granulomas--have been treated with iodides, and although the iodide doesn’t necessarily kill the germ, it does help to break down and remove the granuloma. Leprosy and syphilis were among the diseases involving granulomas* that were treated in this way. In the case of tuberculosis, it has been suggested that iodides combine with unsaturated fatty acids which inhibit proteolytic enzymes, and thus allow for the removal of the abnormal tissue.

In experimental animals, iodide clearly delays the appearance of cataracts. (Buchberger, et al., 199l.)

Inflammation, edema, and free radical production are closely linked, and are produced by most things that interfere with energy production.

Endotoxin, produced by bacteria, mainly in the intestine, disrupts energy production, and promotes maladaptive inflammation. The wide spectrum of benefit that iodide has, especially in diseases with an inflammatory component, suggests first that it protects tissue by blocking free radical damage, but it also suggests the possibility that it might specifically protect against endotoxin.


So let me be clear:

- There is not an ounce of criticism towards the usage of iodide in that article. Quite the opposite, in fact.

- The above article is the only place I have seen Ray talk explicitly about medicinal usage of iodide, and it is what I explicitly referred to in a previous post on the subject.

- I never once stated that Ray Peat is for or against the usage of iodide as a nutritional supplement. For the last time, please stop misrepresenting the facts.

- If he has changed his mind regarding the benefits of iodide for anti-oxidant and anti-inflammatory purposes, then he should redact / retract the above article.
​

 

[Dr. B]

I will give Mr. Bollox the benefit of the doubt and post this one last time:


From "The transparency of life: Cataracts as a model of age-related disease" by Ray Peat.

One of the best-known free radical scavenging substances that has been widely used as a drug is iodide. It has been used to treat asthma, parasites, syphilis, cancer, Graves’ disease, periodontal disease, and arteriosclerosis. Diseases that produce tissue overgrowth associated with inflammation--granulomas--have been treated with iodides, and although the iodide doesn’t necessarily kill the germ, it does help to break down and remove the granuloma. Leprosy and syphilis were among the diseases involving granulomas* that were treated in this way. In the case of tuberculosis, it has been suggested that iodides combine with unsaturated fatty acids which inhibit proteolytic enzymes, and thus allow for the removal of the abnormal tissue.

In experimental animals, iodide clearly delays the appearance of cataracts. (Buchberger, et al., 199l.)

Inflammation, edema, and free radical production are closely linked, and are produced by most things that interfere with energy production.

Endotoxin, produced by bacteria, mainly in the intestine, disrupts energy production, and promotes maladaptive inflammation. The wide spectrum of benefit that iodide has, especially in diseases with an inflammatory component, suggests first that it protects tissue by blocking free radical damage, but it also suggests the possibility that it might specifically protect against endotoxin.


So let me be clear:

- There is not an ounce of criticism towards the usage of iodide in that article. Quite the opposite, in fact.

- The above article is the only place I have seen Ray talk explicitly about medicinal usage of iodide, and it is what I explicitly referred to in a previous post on the subject.

- I never once stated that Ray Peat is for or against the usage of iodide as a nutritional supplement. For the last time, please stop misrepresenting the facts.

- If he has changed his mind regarding the benefits of iodide for anti-oxidant and anti-inflammatory purposes, then he should redact / retract the above article.
​

I have already checked with Peat and he does not care whether it's iodine or iodide. He does not believe in one being safer or better than the other nor has he advised supplementing iodine as an anti oxidant or anti inflammatory product. On the contrary he believes iodine and iodide supplementation cause oxidative damage to the thyroid gland. As I mentioned before, you are free to use, recommend and experiment with any substance including iodines, pufa, iron, zinc, whatever. But given the fact this is ray peat forums and many people on here do respect the views of Peat and danny roddy and others, its misleading to claim Peat recommends usage of iodine or iodide as an anti oxidant or anti inflammatory supplement... I dont think he's going to retract the above article unless you specifically ask him. Peat might agree with iodide being used as treatment for those specific diseases, I know he is extremely conservative with iodine and iodide usage.

The Myth of Iodine Deficiency: An Interview with Dr. Ray Peat – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

he has specifically referenced Dr. Abraham several times when being critical of iodine. He even references iodines anti inflammatory effect but mentions why its a problem despite that. Also Ray uses terms like iodine/iodide and estrogens interchangeably... from the above interview he states:


Dr. Peat: “A dosage of 150 mcg (micrograms, not milligrams, e.g., ug not mg) is a safe amount of iodine. There are excellent references describing the effect of a moderate iodine excess (even below a milligram per day) on the thyroid. An iodine deficiency can cause hypothyroidism (rare now), but so can an excess. Iodine deficiency is an unusual cause of hypothyroidism, except in a few places, like the mountains of Mexico and China, and the Andes.

“Most goiters now are from estrogen-like effects, but they used to be from iodine deficiency. Chronic excess iodine tends to cause thyroiditis, regardless of the gland’s size. The amounts used by Abraham and Flechas are much larger than this — very toxic doses, enough to cause severe thyroid problems.”

Is the Iodine Test Kit (from Dr. Abraham) valid and does it reveal thyroid deficiency?

“Guy Abraham and some of his followers claim that an iodine deficiency can be shown by the quick disappearance of a spot of iodine painted on the skin. The skin test of iodine deficiency is completely unscientific. Iodine is converted to colorless iodide by reductants, including vitamin C, glutathione, and thiosulphate. “G. Abraham’s Iodine Test Kit contains iodine overdose pills. The test is completely irrational. It implies that the body should be saturated with iodine.”

Is there a rational way to determine iodine deficiency or excess?

“It’s easy to recognize a chronic iodine deficiency, because it causes the thyroid gland to enlarge. Goiters can be caused in various ways, for example by being exposed to various goitrogens, including excess iodine, or by excessive estrogen and deficient progesterone, as well as by an iodine deficiency. “However, a chronic excess of iodine is harder to recognize, because it can produce a variety of degenerative changes. Measurement of the average daily iodine intake or excretion in the urine would be needed to confirm an excess. High iodine intake can suppress TSH, and since high TSH is pro-inflammatory, the iodine can have some protective anti-inflammatory actions, but in the long run, the thyroid suppression becomes a problem.”

Mary Shomon: Do you think the majority of people with hypothyroidism get too much or too little iodine? Should people with hypothyroidism add more iodine, like kelp, seaweeds, etc.?

Dr. Ray Peat: 30 years ago, it was found that people in the US were getting about ten times more iodine than they needed. In the mountains of Mexico and in the Andes, and in a few other remote places, iodine deficiency still exists. Kelp and other sources of excess iodine can suppress the thyroid, so they definitely shouldn’t be used to treat hypothyroidism.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA5D4qzgejs



View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3danCfUydM


He specifically mentions even taking more than twice the RDA of iodine can trigger thyroiditis/antibodies... as I said there is a big difference between simply talking about what you are doing, giving out your own advice, sharing your own experiences, compared to saying that Ray is okay or agrees with what youre doing. this is just two videos but there are 15 or more videos including many on danny roddys podcast where they have discussed iodine. and when they were referring to iodine they meant both iodide and iodine, there was no distinction of one or the other being safer or okay to supplement in large doses.

 

[DonLore]

Totally agree. But instead of making a custom combo, I just normally take a few drops of each (Lugol's and SSKI), depending on needs. In my opinion, Nascent iodine is probably a scam, being nothing more than sodium iodide or some such.

Any problem with using 1-5mg of potassium iodide (KI) instead lugols? And do you know why some people (rarely) get negative effects from iodine? I havent gotten a clear answer from my readings