IODIDE - not - IODINE cure for many diseases? (With Ray qoutes)

[Inaut]

How would it feel that much different from lugols though? Does Iodine have inhibitory effects on iodide?
Could it be because iodide could act as an electron donor?

Lugols - I never felt much when I took it (besides a weird throb in my throat which I assume was my thyroid). Sski seems to keep me warm

 

[Sitaruîm]

I don't like seaweed. It can often be contaminated with arsenic and other heavy metals.

Eat seaweed to obtain an adequate amount of iodine. Allow iodine to clean the arsenic found in the seaweed. ?

 

[Jing]

Thanks.

I've started taking notes last night on my spO2 drops, my frequency of urination, its volume, its pH, and on the presence of foam and froth, froth being more fine than foam. Also, continue to take regular bp readings.

Yesterday, Monday, I was at the baseline of taking 150mg iodide in SSKI. This will increase by 150mg each succeeding day so that by Thursday I will be at 600mg/day. I will be taking 1 capsule of 200mcg selenomethionine each day while at it. On Friday, I will go get my blood tested for CBC and ESR, which would be a week since I took my last tests, so I can compare them.

I'll probably continue with 600mg daily on Friday, and then find out whether I should continue taking SSKI at this dosage, or to reduce or to increase the dosage further. More likely, if there is no problem and I see some benefits, I will level off at 600mg/day.

The reason I'm at this accelerated rate of increasing dosage of SSKI is because I want to be able to have the same supplements taken while I increase SSKI dosage, such that the only variable that is changing is the dosage of SSKI.

I'm currently on this:

2 x 750IU Vitamin E using haidut's TocoVit for its high content of d-alpha tocopherol

3 x 325 mg Aspirin (Gericare brand having only cornstarch as the excipient)

3 x 25ml of Artemisia Annua alcohol extract I made myself

4mg K2-Mk4 from haidut's Kuinone

And my daily B-Vitamin Blend consisting of B1,B3. B2. with borax and glutamine


Since my supply of the artermisia annua alcohol extract will be exhausted in 5 days, I'm seeking to complete my SSKI experiment within this window.

I think the risk is not huge, given that I tolerated a year of daily 150mg SSKI intake, and given that my thyroid has been fine. I have a well-balanced nutritional lifestyle that is based on eating whole foods, and I have long ago shifted from relying on supplements to address dietary deficiencies. I had lived 16 years in the US, and realize the the food I get there requires me to take supplementation. I have made sure my internal buffers of vitamins and minerals are continually being replenished, and I have carefully avoided needless intake of PUFAS. I have also been able to maintain good acid base balance as well as optimal blood sugar regulation, together they are hallmarks of a body running on optimal mitochondrial metabolism. This, I believe, has enabled me to be more resilient even in the face of internal bacterial infection which over the years is the cause of a steadily increasing blood pressure condition.

Given the potential benefits of using potassium iodide, in the form of SSKI, to resolve my chronic inability to contain the internal bacterial infection, I think it is well worth the risk to do this. Especially with you already having your own experiments on yourself, on your wife, and other members of your family. I did not do the hard work here. So, Jam, thanks for laying the groundwork for this.

If I don't do this now, when? If it doesn't work, then I can move on to my next experiment in line - using suppositories infused with clove oil. But I'm hoping it stops here!

Are you still suffering from frequent urination? If so have you tried methyl b12 injections? I've had frequent urination for years and recently started taking methyl b12 and it helps my frequent urination by loads I hardly need to pee throughout the day now.

 

[yerrag]

Since you have stated that you have taken daily dosages ranging from `150mg to 1g of iodide in the form of SSKI in the past with no adverse consequences, I'm considering gradually increasing my dosage from the daily 150mg to 300mg to 450mg to 600mg,

Since iodide is anti-bacterial especially against periodontal bacteria, it may in itself bear the load of killing bacteria without the involvement of the immune system, while at the same time its creation of more HOI- instead of HOCl- ROS species with the MPO system of neutrophils may lead to less spillover ROS and less oxidative stress. I can probably compare its effects through collection of nightly graphs of spO2 drops vs time, and if the effects are real, I would see lower and lower spO2 drops as I increase the dosage of iodide.

And if there is less oxidative stress from reduced phagocytic activity (because of lower bacterial load mainly from antibacterial activity from increased iodide intake), I would also be able to note the salutary effects in the form of less urine production at night (even to the point of having straight unbroken sleep due to having no urine to unload, which would have been produced by the redox activity of oxidative stress being neutralized by antioxidants). Zero nighttime urination activity would confirm that the bacterial load has been successfully reduced by the iodine intake.

Apart from the two metrics I mentioned, spO2 drops and urine production, I can also note improvements in the reduction of blood pressure, which would indicate that less albumin is being used to neutralize the spillover ROS of heavy neutrophilic phagocytic activity. With less albumin being oxidized and urinated and lost, more albumin can be conserved and allowed to build up in my blood, enabling my blood volume to increase. With the increase in blood volume, a corresponding decrease in blood pressure would result - as less pressure is needed to provide for adequate perfusion of my body tissues and organs, as adequate blood volume makes increased blood pressure unnecessary.

What do you think of this plan?

It is exactly the plan that I would suggest to my brother, or mother, were they to suffer from a similar predicament. If you did not suffer adverse events from 150mg, it means you are among the 99% of the population who can take gram-sized dosages without negative consequences. In those with current or past thyroid trouble, such as clinical hypo- or hyper-thyroidism, Grave's, etc., care must taken.

I have had almost every single person of my extended family on SSKI and/or Lugol's for the females, including mother, aunt, cousin, wife, and all have seen only benefits, validated by blood testing. It is almost always the case, as can also be gleaned from the literature, that TSH inevitably shoots up during the first few weeks, but it always drops back down to baseline, or lower.

For the record, I consider pharmacological dosages of up to a gram to be safer than aspirin.

I stopped my experiment earlier than planned, I had increased the daily dose of SSKI from 150mg on day 1 to 300 on day 2 to 450 on day 3. I wasn't able to go on day 4 with the 600 mg daily dosage though, and instead took that day as a break. I felt very exhausted waking up that day, and I felt that my immune system was doing a lot more work that night, although my sleep patterns did not not change from day 1 to 3.

I was waking up to urinate 4x each night with a full bladder. Including my morning urine, that counts towards 1250ml of urine each sleep I get. I was taking my bp, my urine pH, and saliva pH each time I woke up. All these nights, my saliva was consistently acidic, which meant there was a lot of acid being produced during my sleep. I think that it's because of the high parasite load I have, and my immune system was on double duty trying to kill the parasites, and a lot of acid and accompanying oxidative stress to boot. This would explain the high urination, from the high redox activity in my antioxidants stores being continually used to neutralize the oxidative stress from ROS spillover from both phagocytosis as well as eosinophils spraying loads of ROS on the parasites.

My spO2 drops per hour ( a drop being counted as one when it exceeds 4%), were small on day 1 and 2 at 2.4, but it increased on day 3 to 3.4. Even when I stopped taking any iodide, on day 4, the drops still increased to 4.1. So, it is hard to say what effect the dosage of iodide really had on my spO2 drops. I suspect that the increased iodide intake was helping kill the parasites, but that it was also increasing the acid load on my system at a high dosage of 450mg/day, and for a system still reeling and trying to restore its acid base balance, it was making me feel exhausted.

7 months since my high-dose SSKI experiment, which I aborted because I was getting very acidic and my heart was racing as a result, I finally am able to hypothesize on why that happened. This was after observing my response to a day of taking a 3 x 150mg dose of SSKI -

- the large drops in spO2 during sleep occurred once again during my sleep
- my bp stayed as high as previous days, so no improvement or worsening
- both urine and saliva pH became more acidic, and my breath rate increased from 14 to 16 breaths/min (indicate increased serum acidity)

But most notable is that there was an inversion in the pH of urine and saliva. What this means is that usually the pH of urine is lower than that of my saliva. But this time it wasn't the case. The pH of urine became higher than that of my saliva.

Normally, this inversion is taken as a bad sign, as in a classic sense this meant that the body was in an extreme case of acidity such that the H+ ions in blood would be exchanged for the K+ ions in cells in order to lower the acidity in blood, and since there would be no H+ ions available to make ammonium (NH4+) from ammonia (NH3), the salts excreted by the kidneys via urine would not be acidic but alkaline as the salts to be excreted would be potassium salts (or magnesium, or calcium).

But in my case, this was not borne out of an extreme imbalance in the general system, but from what I suspect to be the iodide becoming available, due to the megadosing, to phagocytize microbes at deeper tissue levels. Thus, there would be spillover ROS as usual released, and this would be a source of acidity that would be manifested in higher acidity in saliva.

While this is a good thing, the oxidative stress from the spillover ROS still would need to be relieved by the oxidation of endogenous antixodants, and it seems that albumin is the antioxidant of choice. Oxidized albumin does not get recycled, and is released via urination. Serum albumin is reduced, and blood volume as well. And this causes high blood pressure to compensate for the lower blood volume.

At this point, if I were to use SSKI, my only choice would be to use it sporadically, cycling its usage while I use other substances in my SSKI-off days.

I have a few substances in mind but I still have to research them further as to their suitability.

 

[yerrag]

@Jam What do you think if I tried using Lugol's. as this has iodine instead of iodide. Perhaps iodine will not be used for phagocytosis but will directly kill the pathogen. This could be the reason why iodine is recommended for cancers, because iodide does not relieve the acidic condition that favors cancer growth.

 

[Jam]

@Jam What do you think if I tried using Lugol's. as this has iodine instead of iodide. Perhaps iodine will not be used for phagocytosis but will directly kill the pathogen. This could be the reason why iodine is recommended for cancers, because iodide does not relieve the acidic condition that favors cancer growth.

I would definitely try Lugol's, which does also contain iodide btw, just not nearly as much, obviously. Travis had some doubts about the I2 reaching tissues intact, as it would immediately react with anything on its path (like sodium) through the upper digestive tract. I don't think the pharmacokinetics of I2 have been established very well yet, but it does work especially well for cancer and other dis-eases, in a different manner to KI alone.

 

[Jam]

I did look into this a bit, and molecular iodine (I₂) was indicated for breast cancer by Brownstein and crew based on the results of in vitro cell studies. But there is a problem with this: Molecular iodine will react with vitamin C, be reduced by thiols, and can add to unsaturated fatty acids—meaning its most likely absorbed mostly as iodide (I⁻) and small amounts of iodinated lipids. The Brownstein & Flechas party line is that we should buy overpriced Lugol's tablets because 'we need both forms' and that 'the breast needs iodine,' but I am fairly certain that any ingested or topical I₂ will never reach the breast as such—based on pharmacological studies and other considerations.

It's actually quite easy to understand why I₂ works on isolated breast cancer cell lines and I⁻ does not. Molecular iodine (I₂) will add to any double bond, including arachidonic acid. This would result in iodinated arachidonic acid that cannot form prostaglandin E₂. Now besides ornithine decarboxylase and polyamines, the №2 cancer inducer in isolated cells can probably fairly be taken to be the eicosanoids. Both prostaglandin E₂ and leukotriene B₄ appear to be carcinogenic, and go on to activate PPARs and various G protein‐coupled receptors—shifting the transcriptome in a way which ends in cellular proliferation. This has been consistently demonstrated in very many studies; some of the best come from David Rose:
Rose, David P. "Dietary fatty acids and cancer." The American journal of clinical nutrition (1997)
Rose, David P. "Differential expression and regulation of cyclooxygenase-1 and-2 in two human breast cancer cell lines." Cancer research (1996)

The iodide ion (I⁻) does not inhibit cancer to the same extent as iodine (I₂) because it's incapable of adding to the lipid double bond.

So I think that molecular iodine (I₂) can only work locally, and should only be particularly useful for accessible tumors; this is simply too reactive to diffuse very far (note the skin discoloration and disappearance thereof). I also think that limiting linoleic acid would be helpful for the same reason reason that molecular iodine would be: to reduce eicosanoid production. But I don't think taking I₂ internally would be any better than simply taking potassium iodide or kelp (I have taken all three), although I₂ is probably safe in moderation (but can be expected to form numerous side products whenever it reacts with a double bond, even cyclic ones). The thyroid has a high capacity for the I⁻ ion and can only hold so much, and too much can actually increase lipid peroxidation which could potentially lead to decreased thyroid hormone synthesis in the long run. Peripherally: iodide (I⁻) can probably be expected to help displace any stray bromide (Br⁻) or fluoride (F⁻) ions but it appears to act like a general anesthetic in its own right, just like bromide and fluoride—only weaker. All general anesthetics appear to work by intercolating into microtubules and disrupting Förster resonance energy transfer through quenching, slowing nerve velocity as do opiates yet through a different mechanism (which work through dopamine regulation). Iodide (I⁻) is certainly important but I think Brownstein & Flechas exaggerate a bit because they have patents and can be considered iodine salesmen in a way. Ray Peat seems to take a hyperconservative approach—perhaps to distance himself from the other two—and recommends essentially the same low amount that the IOM does. I think the Japanese prove that something around one milligram of iodide (I⁻) per day is safe, but anything above this could perhaps overload the thyroid and slow nerve conduction.. .

 

[yerrag]

I would definitely try Lugol's, which does also contain iodide btw, just not nearly as much, obviously. Travis had some doubts about the I2 reaching tissues intact, as it would immediately react with anything on its path (like sodium) through the upper digestive tract. I don't think the pharmacokinetics of I2 have been established very well yet, but it does work especially well for cancer and other dis-eases, in a different manner to KI alone.

Thanks. Lugols is worth trying. As I only can get my hands on the 2%, and bases on Walter Last's guidance, I'm going to try a day of 3 X 50 drops of Lugol's and study if its effect differs from my trial of SSKI.

I haven't calculated how much I2 and I- I'm dosing but I'll do it just to get an idea before proceeding with it.

 

[yerrag]

This doesn't make a good case for Lugol's but who knows, I'll still try it out just the same.

Thanks for posting Travis' thoughts on this.

 

[Jam]

Thanks. Lugols is worth trying. As I only can get my hands on the 2%, and bases on Walter Last's guidance, I'm going to try a day of 3 X 50 drops of Lugol's and study if its effect differs from my trial of SSKI.

I haven't calculated how much I2 and I- I'm dosing but I'll do it just to get an idea before proceeding with it.

Lugol's Iodine calculator

Easily calculate iodine in Lugol's drops

dropulator.com

 

[yerrag]

Lugol's Iodine calculator

Easily calculate iodine in Lugol's drops

dropulator.com

Great!

So it's 50mg iodine and 125mg I-.

I'm all set then.

 

[yerrag]

@Jam 2 days after taking the 450mg of SSKI, I am still experiencing the effects. The inversion of the relative relationship of urine pH to saliva pH still continues. My urine has become close to transparent and has a pH of 7.4, and my saliva has become very foamy (probably oxidized albumin) and has a pH of 6. And my bp is higher than usual. But knowing (I hope it is) what is going on, I'm sitting this one out today and not taking any supps (except for the isopathic remedies of Enderlein) before I take the Lugol's.

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

So it's 50mg iodine and 125mg I-.

Doesn't 50 drops of lugols 2% equal 50mg of iodine & 75mg iodide (Total of 125mg)?
x3 = 150mg iodine and 225mg iodide (Total of 375mg)?

And please update us on how its going.

 

[yerrag]

Doesn't 50 drops of lugols 2% equal 50mg of iodine & 75mg iodide (Total of 125mg)?
x3 = 150mg iodine and 225mg iodide (Total of 375mg)?

And please update us on how its going.

Thanks. You are absolutely correct. Was relying on my memory on that and that failed me too lol. I even forgot to multiply by 3.

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

Thanks. You are absolutely correct. Was relying on my memory on that and that failed me too lol. I even forgot to multiply by 3.

No probs yerrag. love reading everything you post. Btw I know you probably have lot's of work and maybe no time but I've listened and read about something almost too good to be true (But I will probably try it very soon and report results).

It's called Nano Soma or Metadichol , it's nano policosanol.
Haidut posted a study not so long ago.

So basically I've been listening to an interview from this Indian scientist who patented this product and published like 30+ studies on it's benefits. It's been fascinating to me for the simple reason on it's apparent effects on VDR (Vitamin D receptor). I also found interesting the way he explained the reason why VDR is impaired and I am sure it might be of interest to you as well.

He also talked about how ALL of the participants in his study normalized their blood pressure in a matter of 4 months (Or even earlier if I'm not mistaken).
So you can listen only the part where Dr. P.R. Raghavan is speaking which is from 11:36 - 42:39.

It's like I said, too good to be true but he has all the science and all the study he's done to back it up.

Let me know what you think if you feel like :)

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

He also talked about how ALL of the participants in his study normalized their blood pressure in a matter of 4 months

It's actually 3 weeks not 4 months :)

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

Well I'm sorry to bother you all since this is a bit off topic but I found even better interview where this scientist talks about all the slides (which he didn't do in the previous interview). It's so beyond amazing that I'm skeptical but I'm definitely trying it very soon :)

 

[Dr. B]

No probs yerrag. love reading everything you post. Btw I know you probably have lot's of work and maybe no time but I've listened and read about something almost too good to be true (But I will probably try it very soon and report results).

It's called Nano Soma or Metadichol , it's nano policosanol.
Haidut posted a study not so long ago.

So basically I've been listening to an interview from this Indian scientist who patented this product and published like 30+ studies on it's benefits. It's been fascinating to me for the simple reason on it's apparent effects on VDR (Vitamin D receptor). I also found interesting the way he explained the reason why VDR is impaired and I am sure it might be of interest to you as well.

He also talked about how ALL of the participants in his study normalized their blood pressure in a matter of 4 months (Or even earlier if I'm not mistaken).
So you can listen only the part where Dr. P.R. Raghavan is speaking which is from 11:36 - 42:39.

It's like I said, too good to be true but he has all the science and all the study he's done to back it up.

Let me know what you think if you feel like :)

UG, could you describe what that does to the VDR exactly and also what makes it different from regular policosanols extracted from sugarcane wax.
Also i remember you had a very negative experience with D3, how did you resolve that issue? Would you mind dming me regarding the D3 or other stuff too

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

UG, could you describe what that does to the VDR exactly and also what makes it different from regular policosanols extracted from sugarcane wax.
Also i remember you had a very negative experience with D3, how did you resolve that issue? Would you mind dming me regarding the D3 or other stuff too

First of all I would definitely recommend just watching these 2 interviews I've shared - They are just beyond amazing. Too good to be true but it's good to be hopeful sometimes. Especially when it's about health. Because I actually think some changes can happen in this area. So it is not a wishful thing you can only fantasize about.

In short. He said that microbes, bacteria, viruses etc in order to survive bind to the VDR, because they know that will ensure their survival. By doing that they will knock down innate immune response against them and therefore all other invaders. He mentioned that HIV people have high mortality because the virus knock down 100% of the VDR. When that happens, VIT D cannot do it's job and it cannot bind to the VDR. He demonstrated that this policosanol nano particle knocks out the virus out of the VDR and replaces its position - therefore restoring VDR to it's original function. That, if true, will have immense consequences on the state of the organism and the way immune system function. It will make ALL the changes in the world. And the cases and studies he presented are really, really beyond belief.

I am at the moment in a bad state of health, Actually it all started downhill after I supplemented VIT D and then K2+E. I never recovered from that completely. So, at the moment my immune system is totally messed up. I have inflammation in different parts of the body etc. All in all not good. If you are interested the last thing that didn't work for me was glycine and gelatin. Glycine side effects. Could someone explain?

 

[Dr. B]

First of all I would definitely recommend just watching these 2 interviews I've shared - They are just beyond amazing. Too good to be true but it's good to be hopeful sometimes. Especially when it's about health. Because I actually think some changes can happen in this area. So it is not a wishful thing you can only fantasize about.

In short. He said that microbes, bacteria, viruses etc in order to survive bind to the VDR, because they know that will ensure their survival. By doing that they will knock down innate immune response against them and therefore all other invaders. He mentioned that HIV people have high mortality because the virus knock down 100% of the VDR. When that happens, VIT D cannot do it's job and it cannot bind to the VDR. He demonstrated that this policosanol nano particle knocks out the virus out of the VDR and replaces its position - therefore restoring VDR to it's original function. That, if true, will have immense consequences on the state of the organism and the way immune system function. It will make ALL the changes in the world. And the cases and studies he presented are really, really beyond belief.

I am at the moment in a bad state of health, Actually it all started downhill after I supplemented VIT D and then K2+E. I never recovered from that completely. So, at the moment my immune system is totally messed up. I have inflammation in different parts of the body etc. All in all not good. If you are interested the last thing that didn't work for me was glycine and gelatin. Glycine side effects. Could someone explain?

would regular policosanols still have those benefits youre mentioning?
how long did you use vitamin D and K2/E for and what dosages?
what happens from using 10,000 IU D3 daily for several years?