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[Interrelationship Between Manganese, Vitamin B1 And The Level Of Pyruvic Acid]

paymanz

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[Interrelationship between manganese, vitamin B1 and the level of pyruvic acid]. - PubMed - NCBI

Abstract

Addition of manganese to the diets promotes an increase of the total thiamine content in the blood and the liver, heart and brain tissues. This trace element appreciably changes the correlation between different thiamine fractions. The free vitamin B1 level in the blood and tissues decreases, while the level of its bound form (pyrophosphatic) increases. All the administered manganese doses induced a statistically significant reduction of pyruvic acid concentration in the blood.


-----------------------

Manganese and Vitamin B1

Manganese and Vitamin B 1
BEFORE the annual meeting of the American Society of Experimental
Physiology held in Toronto, 1939, was presented a report on Manganese
and Vitamin B 1-. Experiments with animals have recently shown that an
excess of vitamin B 1 may develop disturbances in lactation and maternal
instinct associated with cannibalism. This phenomena was found to be
due to a depletion of the manganese supply. It is' found that vitamin B 1
and manganese are synergistic and an excess of vitamin B 1 uses up the
manganese supply
. On the other hand an excess of manganese brings about
the exhaustion of vitamin B 1
. Because of this when vitamin B 1 is rein-forced in the diet or is given in the form of thiamin chloride care must be
taken to insure a sufficient supply of manganese.
 
Last edited:

nograde

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Another Soviet era gem. Thank you!
Anyone access to the full study?

I get a dramatic diuretic effect from high manganese foods (mussels) within 3 hours followed with insatiable carb craving afterwards. It seems that without manganese a lot of carbs queue up without being metabolized. Thiamine also has a similar and very pronounced effect for me. A single 400mg dose heats me up and causes slight pressure in my head that I normally only get from too much bag-breathing. Another funny effect is that my skin on my head tightens up so dramatically that my facial expressions change considerably and I feel a strange hot tingling on my scalp. The first time I supplemented thiamine I had a childhood flashback when I felt again that slight pleasant burning sensation in my tummy after having a meal. I think thiamine considerably ramps up gastric acid production.
 

paymanz

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nograde said:
Another Soviet era gem. Thank you!
Anyone access to the full study?

I get a dramatic diuretic effect from high manganese foods (mussels) within 3 hours followed with insatiable carb craving afterwards. It seems that without manganese a lot of carbs queue up without being metabolized. Thiamine also has a similar and very pronounced effect for me. A single 400mg dose heats me up and causes slight pressure in my head that I normally only get from too much bag-breathing. Another funny effect is that my skin on my head tightens up so dramatically that my facial expressions change considerably and I feel a strange hot tingling on my scalp. The first time I supplemented thiamine I had a childhood flashback when I felt again that slight pleasant burning sensation in my tummy after having a meal. I think thiamine considerably ramps up gastric acid production.

i had good effects from both too.and with manganese my connective tissue quality improved also.
 

narouz

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paymanz said:
i had good effects from both too.and with manganese my connective tissue quality improved also.

How much thiamine and manganese to you take, typically?
 

Stilgar

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Very interesting because I find yerba mate (a rich source of manganese) and b1 supplementation to be very similar for me in effect.
 

paymanz

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narouz said:
post 111758
paymanz said:
i had good effects from both too.and with manganese my connective tissue quality improved also.

How much thiamine and manganese to you take, typically?
about 30mg at start of supplementation.for 1-2 month i think i was on that dosage.now lesser.up to 10mg a day.i used hand made mn sulfate capsules.
 
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DaveFoster

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Does anyone know what Peat says about manganese supplementation? He mentions it alongside iron as being potentially consumed in toxic amounts via supplements, but it seems to be important in the matrix of mineral supplementation.
 

schultz

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Very interesting because I find yerba mate (a rich source of manganese) and b1 supplementation to be very similar for me in effect.

Wow, the Mn content of Yerba Mate is quite high! I used to drink it years ago. I may look into getting some as I remember enjoying it.

From this study: http://link.springer.com/article/10.1385/BTER:78:1-3:271

"Our results suggest that mate drinking could be a good dietary source of essential micronutrient manganese (total content 2223 ± 110 µg/g, 48.1%
leached to the infusion)"

2.2 mg per gram of leaves with 48% leached into the tea. Assuming 2g of tea in a bag, that's around 100% RDA.

Yerba.jpg
 

RayPeat123

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Does anyone know what Peat says about manganese supplementation? He mentions it alongside iron as being potentially consumed in toxic amounts via supplements, but it seems to be important in the matrix of mineral supplementation.

I'm curious about this as well. My diet of low fat milk, cottage cheese, orange juice, carrots, eggs, crab and coconut oil is almost devoid of manganese (mostly from carrots and that is probably not absorbed at all). I wonder if it's actually a bit higher, and Cronometer just doesn't track it correctly.
 
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superhuman

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I get a dramatic diuretic effect from high manganese foods (mussels) within 3 hours followed with insatiable carb craving afterwards

That is cool, im really looking for foods with diuretic effects since i have struggled with water retention.
What foods are you using exept mussels that are high in manganese?
 

paymanz

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Does anyone know what Peat says about manganese supplementation? He mentions it alongside iron as being potentially consumed in toxic amounts via supplements, but it seems to be important in the matrix of mineral supplementation.
I cant remember where he warns about manganese excess?!
 

haidut

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www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7376556

Abstract

Addition of manganese to the diets promotes an increase of the total thiamine content in the blood and the liver, heart and brain tissues. This trace element appreciably changes the correlation between different thiamine fractions. The free vitamin B1 level in the blood and tissues decreases, while the level of its bound form (pyrophosphatic) increases. All the administered manganese doses induced a statistically significant reduction of pyruvic acid concentration in the blood.


-----------------------

Manganese and Vitamin B1

Manganese and Vitamin B 1
BEFORE the annual meeting of the American Society of Experimental
Physiology held in Toronto, 1939, was presented a report on Manganese
and Vitamin B 1-. Experiments with animals have recently shown that an
excess of vitamin B 1 may develop disturbances in lactation and maternal
instinct associated with cannibalism. This phenomena was found to be
due to a depletion of the manganese supply. It is' found that vitamin B 1
and manganese are synergistic and an excess of vitamin B 1 uses up the
manganese supply
. On the other hand an excess of manganese brings about
the exhaustion of vitamin B 1
. Because of this when vitamin B 1 is rein-forced in the diet or is given in the form of thiamin chloride care must be
taken to insure a sufficient supply of manganese.

I would be careful with manganese supplements. Just a few times above the RDA has been linked to a very dangerous and often lethal heart condition (endocarditis). The amount found in most supplements is often 8-10 times the RDA.
Too much manganese may lead to fatal heart infection
 

paymanz

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haidut

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It could be manganese taken as supplements. The one from food is probably OK as it balanced by other minerals.
 

DaveFoster

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I cant remember where he warns about manganese excess?!
He mentions it in a KMUD interview I believe. They talk about mineral supplements.
 

alywest

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This is interesting to read because I just started taking high levels of B1 and have really been craving cocoa and nutella which contains both cocoa and hazelnuts, both rich in manganese.
 

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