[Interrelationship Between Manganese, Vitamin B1 And The Level Of Pyruvic Acid]

Discussion in 'Articles & Scientific Studies' started by paymanz, Nov 29, 2015.

  1. paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    [Interrelationship between manganese, vitamin B1 and the level of pyruvic acid]. - PubMed - NCBI

    Abstract

    Addition of manganese to the diets promotes an increase of the total thiamine content in the blood and the liver, heart and brain tissues. This trace element appreciably changes the correlation between different thiamine fractions. The free vitamin B1 level in the blood and tissues decreases, while the level of its bound form (pyrophosphatic) increases. All the administered manganese doses induced a statistically significant reduction of pyruvic acid concentration in the blood.


    -----------------------

    Manganese and Vitamin B1

    Manganese and Vitamin B 1
    BEFORE the annual meeting of the American Society of Experimental
    Physiology held in Toronto, 1939, was presented a report on Manganese
    and Vitamin B 1-. Experiments with animals have recently shown that an
    excess of vitamin B 1 may develop disturbances in lactation and maternal
    instinct associated with cannibalism. This phenomena was found to be
    due to a depletion of the manganese supply. It is' found that vitamin B 1
    and manganese are synergistic and an excess of vitamin B 1 uses up the
    manganese supply
    . On the other hand an excess of manganese brings about
    the exhaustion of vitamin B 1
    . Because of this when vitamin B 1 is rein-forced in the diet or is given in the form of thiamin chloride care must be
    taken to insure a sufficient supply of manganese.
     
  2. nograde

    nograde Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2013
    Messages:
    133
    Another Soviet era gem. Thank you!
    Anyone access to the full study?

    I get a dramatic diuretic effect from high manganese foods (mussels) within 3 hours followed with insatiable carb craving afterwards. It seems that without manganese a lot of carbs queue up without being metabolized. Thiamine also has a similar and very pronounced effect for me. A single 400mg dose heats me up and causes slight pressure in my head that I normally only get from too much bag-breathing. Another funny effect is that my skin on my head tightens up so dramatically that my facial expressions change considerably and I feel a strange hot tingling on my scalp. The first time I supplemented thiamine I had a childhood flashback when I felt again that slight pleasant burning sensation in my tummy after having a meal. I think thiamine considerably ramps up gastric acid production.
     
  3. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    i had good effects from both too.and with manganese my connective tissue quality improved also.
     
  4. narouz

    narouz Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    4,429
    How much thiamine and manganese to you take, typically?
     
  5. Stilgar

    Stilgar Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2013
    Messages:
    281
    Very interesting because I find yerba mate (a rich source of manganese) and b1 supplementation to be very similar for me in effect.
     
  6. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    about 30mg at start of supplementation.for 1-2 month i think i was on that dosage.now lesser.up to 10mg a day.i used hand made mn sulfate capsules.
     
  7. DaveFoster

    DaveFoster Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Messages:
    4,846
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Professional blogger, writer and entrepreneur.
    Location:
    Spokane, Washington
    Does anyone know what Peat says about manganese supplementation? He mentions it alongside iron as being potentially consumed in toxic amounts via supplements, but it seems to be important in the matrix of mineral supplementation.
     
  8. schultz

    schultz Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    1,719
    Wow, the Mn content of Yerba Mate is quite high! I used to drink it years ago. I may look into getting some as I remember enjoying it.

    From this study: http://link.springer.com/article/10.1385/BTER:78:1-3:271

    "Our results suggest that mate drinking could be a good dietary source of essential micronutrient manganese (total content 2223 ± 110 µg/g, 48.1%
    leached to the infusion)"

    2.2 mg per gram of leaves with 48% leached into the tea. Assuming 2g of tea in a bag, that's around 100% RDA.

    Yerba.jpg
     
  9. RayPeat123

    RayPeat123 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2015
    Messages:
    13
    I'm curious about this as well. My diet of low fat milk, cottage cheese, orange juice, carrots, eggs, crab and coconut oil is almost devoid of manganese (mostly from carrots and that is probably not absorbed at all). I wonder if it's actually a bit higher, and Cronometer just doesn't track it correctly.
     
  10. superhuman

    superhuman Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    1,124
    That is cool, im really looking for foods with diuretic effects since i have struggled with water retention.
    What foods are you using exept mussels that are high in manganese?
     
  11. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    updated the first post.
     
  12. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    I cant remember where he warns about manganese excess?!
     
  13. haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    16,446
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    I would be careful with manganese supplements. Just a few times above the RDA has been linked to a very dangerous and often lethal heart condition (endocarditis). The amount found in most supplements is often 8-10 times the RDA.
    Too much manganese may lead to fatal heart infection
     
  14. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    Thanks haidut,for the warning.

    An infection in heart is really nasty!
     
  15. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
  16. haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    16,446
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    It could be manganese taken as supplements. The one from food is probably OK as it balanced by other minerals.
     
  17. DaveFoster

    DaveFoster Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Messages:
    4,846
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Professional blogger, writer and entrepreneur.
    Location:
    Spokane, Washington
    He mentions it in a KMUD interview I believe. They talk about mineral supplements.
     
  18. OP
    paymanz

    paymanz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2015
    Messages:
    2,630
    Gender:
    Male
    I see, thanks!
     
  19. alywest

    alywest Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2017
    Messages:
    916
    Gender:
    Female
    This is interesting to read because I just started taking high levels of B1 and have really been craving cocoa and nutella which contains both cocoa and hazelnuts, both rich in manganese.
     
Loading...