Intelligent People More Likely To Suffer From Mental Illness

haidut

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I have mentioned a few times on the forum that in the "psychiatric bible" DSM IV/V a good mental health is characterized by a mild to moderate delusion, while realism is characterized by a mild to moderate depression. Peat said a few times that people with high IQ have a hard time adjusting to the insanity around them and suffer from mental burnout/exhaustion/depression/anxiety more often than the general population of imbeciles. The imbeciles however, seem to enjoy a high rate of social success probably because of feeling at home in a sea of fellow imbeciles.
His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the... | Ray Peat Forum
"...His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the stereotype of bright people as being sickly or frail, but, contrary to his expectation, there was an association between maladjustment and higher I.Q.; the incidence of neurotic fatigue, anxiety, and depression increased along with the I.Q. The least bright of his group were more successful in many ways than the most bright."


This new study corroborates Peat's statement and other studies I have posted on his matter.
High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities - ScienceDirect
Having a High IQ May Lead to Increased Risk of Mental Illness - Thriveworks
"...There is a plethora of misconceptions and myths when it comes to the topic of mental illness. For example, some people believe that disorders like depression and anxiety are dramatic diagnoses for feelings of sadness. But this is certainly not the case—these conditions and those of the like are real and they’re harmful to those who suffer with them. Another common myth is that people with mental illness are stupid or less intelligent; but in reality, they’re just as smart as those of us who aren’t diagnosed with a mental disorder. In fact, they might even be smarter. A new study “High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities” published in Intelligence says that extremely intelligent individuals have a much greater risk of suffering from a range of psychological and physiological disorders.

"...The research team first came up with a “hyper brain/hyper body theory of integration,” which suggests that people with higher cognitive ability react with greater emotional and behavioral response to their environments. And because of their increased awareness, individuals with a high IQ then typically exhibit a hyperreactive central nervous system. For example, “a minor insult such as a clothing tag or an unnatural sound may trigger a low level, chronic stress response which then activates a hyper body response,” explains Dr. Nicole Tetreault, co-author of the study."


Combined with another study showing that altruistic people are also more likely to suffer from mental illness, this paints a bleak picture of the people around us - i.e. the brightest and nicest are also the saddest, while the dumb & selfish are blissful.
Altruistic People More Likely To End Up With Depression

What has this world come to...
 
Last edited:

Peatful

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I think, what if Howard Hughes or Van Gogh (or countless others of course) had access to current big pharma....what the world would have missed...
 

Dhair

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I have mentioned a few times on the forum that in the "psychiatric bible" DSM IV/V a good mental health is characterized by a mild to moderate delusion, while realism is characterized by a mild to moderate depression. Peat said a few times that people with high IQ have a hard time adjusting to the insanity around them and suffer from mental burnout/exhaustion/depression/anxiety more often than the general population of imbeciles. The imbeciles however, seem to enjoy a high rate of social success probably because of feeling at home in a sea of fellow imbeciles.
His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the... | Ray Peat Forum
"...His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the stereotype of bright people as being sickly or frail, but, contrary to his expectation, there was an association between maladjustment and higher I.Q.; the incidence of neurotic fatigue, anxiety, and depression increased along with the I.Q. The least bright of his group were more successful in many ways than the most bright."


This new study corroborates Peat's statement and other studies I have posted on his matter.
High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities - ScienceDirect
Having a High IQ May Lead to Increased Risk of Mental Illness - Thriveworks
"...There is a plethora of misconceptions and myths when it comes to the topic of mental illness. For example, some people believe that disorders like depression and anxiety are dramatic diagnoses for feelings of sadness. But this is certainly not the case—these conditions and those of the like are real and they’re harmful to those who suffer with them. Another common myth is that people with mental illness are stupid or less intelligent; but in reality, they’re just as smart as those of us who aren’t diagnosed with a mental disorder. In fact, they might even be smarter. A new study “High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities” published in Intelligence says that extremely intelligent individuals have a much greater risk of suffering from a range of psychological and physiological disorders.

"...The research team first came up with a “hyper brain/hyper body theory of integration,” which suggests that people with higher cognitive ability react with greater emotional and behavioral response to their environments. And because of their increased awareness, individuals with a high IQ then typically exhibit a hyperreactive central nervous system. For example, “a minor insult such as a clothing tag or an unnatural sound may trigger a low level, chronic stress response which then activates a hyper body response,” explains Dr. Nicole Tetreault, co-author of the study."


Combined with another study showing that altruistic people are also more likely to suffer from mental illness, this paints a bleak picture of the people around us - i.e. the brightest and nicest are also the saddest, while the dumb & selfish scum is blissful.
Altruistic People More Likely To End Up With Depression

What has this world come to...
Well this is depressing. :(
Is there a solution?
 

biggirlkisss

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if thyroid function is connected to intelligence didn't that statement counter these studies.
 

Fractality

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And the modern notion of "mental illness" is how society/culture systematically isolates many intelligent people.
 

DavidGardner

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"...The research team first came up with a “hyper brain/hyper body theory of integration,” which suggests that people with higher cognitive ability react with greater emotional and behavioral response to their environments. And because of their increased awareness, individuals with a high IQ then typically exhibit a hyperreactive central nervous system. For example, “a minor insult such as a clothing tag or an unnatural sound may trigger a low level, chronic stress response which then activates a hyper body response,” explains Dr. Nicole Tetreault, co-author of the study."

Based on personal experience, I totally agree. Throughout middle school and high school I was considered by my peers to be one of the smartest kids in our class. Now thirty years old, I haven't been as successful as many of them. Plus, much of my adult life was marred by severe mental illness and alcohol abuse. I've always been so self-aware that it's an impediment to normal functioning. Only in the past year have I gotten to the point where I feel grounded (i.e., worked out my sh**).
 

Integra

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Peater Piper

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Intelligence is an awfully broad term. IQ tests measure it to a degree, but they're limited. Many of the very intelligent people I know are eccentrics. I think if you take a pool of people in STEM jobs, you're going to find many who have high spatial intelligence, along with social awkwardness and a degree of Asperger like symptoms. Or you can look at creative artists, who seem to be prone to bipolar like behavior. Then there's people that are amazing in social situations. They can read body language, sway opinions, manipulate people's feelings to their whim, clearly they're displaying social intelligence, something that won't show up on an IQ test.

I don't think "smart" people are too smart to be happy, I think the mechanisms that allow them to excel in certain fields also make them maladjusted to live a typical life. Look at synesthesia. The exact mechanism isn't known, but there's hyperconnectivity in their brains and alterations in neurotransmitters (same for Aspergers) that can offer significant advantages, but disadvantages as well. You can probably "normalize" their brains, and you'd potentially be taking away something that makes them unique in the process.

Of course I'm generalizing here. One of the most intelligent people I know is my aunt, and she's incredible in social situations, but most people have obvious strengths and weaknesses, and the reason for their strengths may often be the reason for their weaknesses. Geniuses are at the extreme end, frequently showing incredibly strange behavior (lopping off an ear, falling in love with a pigeon, etc.).
 

Regina

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Chicago
I have mentioned a few times on the forum that in the "psychiatric bible" DSM IV/V a good mental health is characterized by a mild to moderate delusion, while realism is characterized by a mild to moderate depression. Peat said a few times that people with high IQ have a hard time adjusting to the insanity around them and suffer from mental burnout/exhaustion/depression/anxiety more often than the general population of imbeciles. The imbeciles however, seem to enjoy a high rate of social success probably because of feeling at home in a sea of fellow imbeciles.
His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the... | Ray Peat Forum
"...His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the stereotype of bright people as being sickly or frail, but, contrary to his expectation, there was an association between maladjustment and higher I.Q.; the incidence of neurotic fatigue, anxiety, and depression increased along with the I.Q. The least bright of his group were more successful in many ways than the most bright."


This new study corroborates Peat's statement and other studies I have posted on his matter.
High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities - ScienceDirect
Having a High IQ May Lead to Increased Risk of Mental Illness - Thriveworks
"...There is a plethora of misconceptions and myths when it comes to the topic of mental illness. For example, some people believe that disorders like depression and anxiety are dramatic diagnoses for feelings of sadness. But this is certainly not the case—these conditions and those of the like are real and they’re harmful to those who suffer with them. Another common myth is that people with mental illness are stupid or less intelligent; but in reality, they’re just as smart as those of us who aren’t diagnosed with a mental disorder. In fact, they might even be smarter. A new study “High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities” published in Intelligence says that extremely intelligent individuals have a much greater risk of suffering from a range of psychological and physiological disorders.

"...The research team first came up with a “hyper brain/hyper body theory of integration,” which suggests that people with higher cognitive ability react with greater emotional and behavioral response to their environments. And because of their increased awareness, individuals with a high IQ then typically exhibit a hyperreactive central nervous system. For example, “a minor insult such as a clothing tag or an unnatural sound may trigger a low level, chronic stress response which then activates a hyper body response,” explains Dr. Nicole Tetreault, co-author of the study."


Combined with another study showing that altruistic people are also more likely to suffer from mental illness, this paints a bleak picture of the people around us - i.e. the brightest and nicest are also the saddest, while the dumb & selfish scum is blissful.
Altruistic People More Likely To End Up With Depression

What has this world come to...
TGFLisuride. Phew
 

Travis

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His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the... | Ray Peat Forum
"...His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the stereotype of bright people as being sickly or frail, but, contrary to his expectation, there was an association between maladjustment and higher I.Q.; the incidence of neurotic fatigue, anxiety, and depression increased along with the I.Q. The least bright of his group were more successful in many ways than the most bright."
I had read that article. Thinking about this always makes me think of this Nirvana song.

I think you can be happy and creative-intelligent simultaneously, but not happy and intelligent like Sigmund Freud or Isaac Newton. There's a certain amount of seriousness, or gravity involved in thinking about along those lines. Perhaps that definition should be refined as mental discipline, or some such thing. I think the IQ test has a few math components, which are weighed heavily. Perhaps the main finding of such studies is that the people who designed the IQ tests themselves were generally unhappy and engineered the test accordingly: people who had climbed to the top of the authoritarian ψ–educational field and expect all future students to be similarly disciplined. There is an element of seriousness behind all of that, making sure—or atleast maintaining the impression—that students must not make mistakes. Without the element of importance, most of the kids would just play and mock the teacher.

But perhaps it can be largely-reduced to opiates and neurotransmitters? Cholinergic drugs always increase word recall and reaction time, while opiates generally interfere; Dopamine is usually seen as good, while serotonin not so much. Glutamate accelerates microtubule formation—the structures that probably are short-term memory. The longer-term, more ingrained nerves get myelinated microtubules. These things are getting built-up and broken-down all of the time, and many drugs interfere or accelerate this process. So choosing the right diet, environment, and habits are probably the smartest thing you can do—everything else could just follow from that. The only genetic defect that I've read about which interferes with IQ is Down's Syndrome, and this is actually from an enzyme polymorphism which leads to high homocysteine. This is also one of the most common findings in Alzheimer's. So . ..simply having a high-methionine and low B₆ diet could perhaps give anyone either subclinical Alzheimer's or subclinical Down's Syndrome—depending on severity. Of course, it would technically be called hyperhomocysteinuria; but the main agent is the same in both cases. The epidemiological results are so consistent that many cases of dementia (but not maybe not Alzheimer's)* could be renamed as age-related hyperhomocysteinuria, but this name implies obvious an inexpensive treatment modalities so it will never be formally-classified as such. In the same way, Down's Syndrome could just as easily be called cystathionine β-synthase-related homocysteinuria. Again, this implies an easy treatment and nobody in the Medical Establish can sell you the things you can do at home or buy from Amazon.com.

*Alzheimer's was originally defined histologically. Many cases of so-called "Alzheimer's" are really just Alzheimer's Presumed. The disease's founder, Alois Alzheimer, had diagnosed it based-on characteristic neurofibrillary tangles. Injecting rabbits with aluminum does the very same thing, and seems be the only way to create these in a short time period. Theoretically, lipid peroxidation in general could form similar tangles; homocysteine does this because it can form a stable free radical, but aluminum does this as well by displacing iron in addition to physically-crosslinking the highly-phosphorylated and microtubule-stabilizing τ-protein.
 
Last edited:

Regina

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Aug 17, 2016
Messages
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Location
Chicago
I had read that article. Thinking about this always makes me think of this Nirvana song.

I think you can be happy and creative-intelligent simultaneously, but not happy and intelligent like Sigmund Freud or Isaac Newton. There's a certain amount of seriousness, or gravity involved in thinking about along those lines. Perhaps that definition should be refined as mental discipline, or some such thing. I think the IQ test has a few math components, which are weighed heavily. Perhaps the main finding of such studies is that the people who designed the IQ tests themselves were generally unhappy and engineered the test accordingly: people who had climbed to the top of the authoritarian ψ–educational field and expect all future students to be similarly disciplined. There is an element of seriousness behind all of that, making sure—or atleast maintaining the impression—that students must not make mistakes. Without the element of importance, most of the kids would just play and mock the teacher.

But perhaps it can be largely-reduced to opiates and neurotransmitters? Cholinergic drugs always increase word recall and reaction time, while opiates generally interfere; Dopamine is usually seen as good, while serotonin not so much. Glutamate accelerates microtubule formation—the structures that probably are short-term memory. The longer-term, more ingrained nerves get myelinated microtubules. These things are getting built-up and broken-down all of the time, and many drugs interfere or accelerate this process. So choosing the right diet, environment, and habits are probably the smartest thing you can do—everything else could just follow from that. The only genetic defect that I've read about which interferes with IQ is Down's Syndrome, and this is actually from an enzyme polymorphism which leads to high homocysteine. This is also one of the most common findings in Alzheimer's. So . ..simply having a high-methionine and low B₆ diet could perhaps give anyone either subclinical Alzheimer's or subclinical Down's Syndrome—depending on severity. Of course, it would technically be called hyperhomocysteinuria; but the main agent is the same in both cases. The epidemiological results are so consistent that many cases of dementia (but not maybe not Alzheimer's)* could be renamed as age-related hyperhomocysteinuria, but this name implies obvious an inexpensive treatment modalities so it will never be formally-classified as such. In the same way, Down's Syndrome could just as easily be called cystathionine β-synthase-related homocysteinuria. Again, this implies an easy treatment and nobody in the Medical Establish can sell you the things you can do at home or buy from Amazon.com.

*Alzheimer's was originally defined histologically. Many cases of so-called "Alzheimer's" are really just Alzheimer's presumed. The disease's founder, Alois Alzheimer, had diagnosed it based-on characteristic neurofibrillary tangles. Injecting rabbits with aluminum does the very same thing, and seems be the only way to create these in a short time period. Theoretically, lipid peroxidation in general could form similar tangles; homocysteine does this because it can form a stable free radical, but aluminum does this as well by displacing iron in addition to physically-crosslinking the highly-phosphorylated and microtubule-stabilizing τ-protein.
:idea: Neat!
 

lexis

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Jan 25, 2014
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I have mentioned a few times on the forum that in the "psychiatric bible" DSM IV/V a good mental health is characterized by a mild to moderate delusion, while realism is characterized by a mild to moderate depression. Peat said a few times that people with high IQ have a hard time adjusting to the insanity around them and suffer from mental burnout/exhaustion/depression/anxiety more often than the general population of imbeciles. The imbeciles however, seem to enjoy a high rate of social success probably because of feeling at home in a sea of fellow imbeciles.
His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the... | Ray Peat Forum
"...His work [Lewis Terman] contradicted the stereotype of bright people as being sickly or frail, but, contrary to his expectation, there was an association between maladjustment and higher I.Q.; the incidence of neurotic fatigue, anxiety, and depression increased along with the I.Q. The least bright of his group were more successful in many ways than the most bright."


This new study corroborates Peat's statement and other studies I have posted on his matter.
High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities - ScienceDirect
Having a High IQ May Lead to Increased Risk of Mental Illness - Thriveworks
"...There is a plethora of misconceptions and myths when it comes to the topic of mental illness. For example, some people believe that disorders like depression and anxiety are dramatic diagnoses for feelings of sadness. But this is certainly not the case—these conditions and those of the like are real and they’re harmful to those who suffer with them. Another common myth is that people with mental illness are stupid or less intelligent; but in reality, they’re just as smart as those of us who aren’t diagnosed with a mental disorder. In fact, they might even be smarter. A new study “High intelligence: A risk factor for psychological and physiological overexcitabilities” published in Intelligence says that extremely intelligent individuals have a much greater risk of suffering from a range of psychological and physiological disorders.

"...The research team first came up with a “hyper brain/hyper body theory of integration,” which suggests that people with higher cognitive ability react with greater emotional and behavioral response to their environments. And because of their increased awareness, individuals with a high IQ then typically exhibit a hyperreactive central nervous system. For example, “a minor insult such as a clothing tag or an unnatural sound may trigger a low level, chronic stress response which then activates a hyper body response,” explains Dr. Nicole Tetreault, co-author of the study."


Combined with another study showing that altruistic people are also more likely to suffer from mental illness, this paints a bleak picture of the people around us - i.e. the brightest and nicest are also the saddest, while the dumb & selfish scum is blissful.
Altruistic People More Likely To End Up With Depression

What has this world come to...

Too alert means running on stress hormones.
 

mujuro

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Nov 14, 2014
Messages
695
Based on personal experience, I totally agree. Throughout middle school and high school I was considered by my peers to be one of the smartest kids in our class. Now thirty years old, I haven't been as successful as many of them. Plus, much of my adult life was marred by severe mental illness and alcohol abuse. I've always been so self-aware that it's an impediment to normal functioning. Only in the past year have I gotten to the point where I feel grounded (i.e., worked out my sh**).

I have bipolar, and whilst I did excel very well at school, I really tanked my last 2 years before graduation and barely scraped through, mostly due to the bipolar taking effect. I saw plenty of my peers reach milestones of early adulthood while I lived at home and went nowhere. It was hard, and I thought it would never get better. I'm in my late 20s and only just settling into a field of work I consider both challenging and rewarding. I decided that I am not the type of person who lives to work - I just work so that I can live. I tried a scientific discipline at university but I couldn't stand the dogmatism of academia. That experience is actually what drove me to find Peat's work, when I began looking at coconut oil and how it stimulates metabolism.
 

Gadsie

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Jun 19, 2016
Messages
191
Perhaps when you're intelligent there is a higher chance that you overanalyse everything and this can cause certain realizations that are depressing. However, you could also argue that a truly smart person would understand that life is absurd and unexplainable, so you might as well be happy.

mental health is characterized by a mild to moderate delusion

I'd say that anything "depressing" is just as much of an delusion as something uplifting. So a rational person would just choose the uplifting delusion over the depressing one.

I'm not preaching, I suffer from OCD and anxiety myself, but this is just a thought.
 
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