Insulin: The Wrongly Accused Hormone

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A clear and insightful overview of an important topic.
 

wavelength123

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Blood sugar only goes too high when glucose production in the liver (not dietary glucose) exceeds glucose uptake in the cell.

This is all that it’s about. People eat too many calories and too little nutrients. Cue metabolic syndrome.

You should discuss how insulin resistance is a necessary physiological response to avoid toxicity within the cell from all kinds of excesses.

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Insulin Resistance as a Physiological Defense Against Metabolic Stress: Implications for the Management of Subsets of Type 2 Diabetes

Insulin resistance is a cellular antioxidant defense mechanism

Insulin resistance – the body’s defence against caloric intoxication?

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/01.atv.0000122852.22604.78

You wanna reduce cellular oxidation (and all kinds of degeneration from acne to hair loss to cardiovascular disease) of which insulin resistance is nothing but a consequence; eat less calories and more nutrients and in balance
 

CLASH

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This is all that it’s about. People eat too many calories and too little nutrients. Cue metabolic syndrome.

You should discuss how insulin resistance is a necessary physiological response to avoid toxicity within the cell from all kinds of excesses.

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Insulin Resistance as a Physiological Defense Against Metabolic Stress: Implications for the Management of Subsets of Type 2 Diabetes

Insulin resistance is a cellular antioxidant defense mechanism

Insulin resistance – the body’s defence against caloric intoxication?

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/01.atv.0000122852.22604.78

You wanna reduce cellular oxidation (and all kinds of degeneration from acne to hair loss to cardiovascular disease) of which insulin resistance is nothing but a consequence; eat less calories and more nutrients and in balance

I dont think its the eating of too many calories. Poor nutrients status is definetly involved. Obesity is more related to PUFA consumption and metabolic endotoxemia, I dont think calories in/ calories out in the mainstream sense has much to do with it. Many obese people chronically under eat and have low metabolic rates in my experience.

PUFA and endotoxin both directly impair mitochondrial function and inhibit the conversion of food to energy. This is where the idea of calories in/ calories out from the generally accepted point of view and "if it fits your macros" become laughable concepts. Using an arbitrary value like calories for determining the cause of chronic disease can only ever be associative.
 
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Hans

Hans

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This is all that it’s about. People eat too many calories and too little nutrients. Cue metabolic syndrome.

You should discuss how insulin resistance is a necessary physiological response to avoid toxicity within the cell from all kinds of excesses.

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Insulin Resistance as a Physiological Defense Against Metabolic Stress: Implications for the Management of Subsets of Type 2 Diabetes

Insulin resistance is a cellular antioxidant defense mechanism

Insulin resistance – the body’s defence against caloric intoxication?

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/01.atv.0000122852.22604.78

You wanna reduce cellular oxidation (and all kinds of degeneration from acne to hair loss to cardiovascular disease) of which insulin resistance is nothing but a consequence; eat less calories and more nutrients and in balance
I agree with Clash and will add that there develops a problem in the mitochondria first, and then energy production starts to suffer. That's why the body is increasing the transport of glucose and fat into cells for breakdown, because it senses that there isn't enough energy in the first place. So instead of reducing calories, rather fix the mitochondria. If you're going to reduce food intake, then the body will just further increase lipolysis, protein breakdown and gluconeogenesis, because it needs that extra fats, glucose and protein.
If you can fix the ETC and glucose oxidation, then a lot of issues can be resolved.
 

Zigzag

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The point is for many people "fixing mitochondria" will make them even fatter than before. That's why people go for hardcore fasting, low carb, keto diets etc. They want results within a couple of months not years.
 
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Hans

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The point is for many people "fixing mitochondria" will make them even fatter than before. That's why people go for hardcore fasting, low carb, keto diets etc. They want results within a couple of months not years.
Fixing mitochondria as in eating more?
 
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Hans

Hans

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Yes that's what I meant. Eating more pufa free, quality, nutrient dense food.
Last time I logged 4L of low fat milk and 2L of orange juice I got 2750 calories, which isn't even that much for the amount of food it is. But I agree, people do eat more high carb, high fat, low protein food and gain a lot. I'd rather focus on nutrient dense foods such as low fat milk, eggs, oysters, organ meat and nutrient dense fruit which will quickly increase vitamins and minerals without increasing calories all that much.
Then I'd add in things to support the ETC, such as CoQ10, vitamin C, vitamin E, succinic acid and vitamin K2, none of which has been shown to make people fat. I'd also add in methylene blue if someone tolerates it.
 

Zigzag

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I definitely agree. People just don't understand that after years of terrible diet and lifestyle it might take a little bit longer to get back on tracks. They get discouraged very quickly.
 
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Hans

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I definitely agree. People just don't understand that after years of terrible diet and lifestyle it might take a little bit longer to get back on tracks. They get discouraged very quickly.
True, and sadly, by jumping on the low carb IF lifestyle might make things even worse.
 

Broken man

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This is all that it’s about. People eat too many calories and too little nutrients. Cue metabolic syndrome.

You should discuss how insulin resistance is a necessary physiological response to avoid toxicity within the cell from all kinds of excesses.

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Insulin Resistance as a Physiological Defense Against Metabolic Stress: Implications for the Management of Subsets of Type 2 Diabetes

Insulin resistance is a cellular antioxidant defense mechanism

Insulin resistance – the body’s defence against caloric intoxication?

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/01.atv.0000122852.22604.78

You wanna reduce cellular oxidation (and all kinds of degeneration from acne to hair loss to cardiovascular disease) of which insulin resistance is nothing but a consequence; eat less calories and more nutrients and in balance
Most africans eat corn only and are healthy.
 

wavelength123

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I dont think its the eating of too many calories. Poor nutrients status is definetly involved. Obesity is more related to PUFA consumption and metabolic endotoxemia,

I dont think calories in/ calories out in the mainstream sense has much to do with it. Many obese people chronically under eat and have low metabolic rates in my experience.

This is where the idea of calories in/ calories out from the generally accepted point of view and "if it fits your macros" become laughable concepts.

Using an arbitrary value like calories for determining the cause of chronic disease can only ever be associative.

Good thing you mention those, and I’m sorry if I didn’t make it clear, but I wasn’t talking about just calories.

I said too many calories AND too little nutrients. Or if you prefer, too many calories relative to the nutrition profile of a food. Chicken breasts. Pasta. Bagels. Modern fruit picked up unripe somewhere across the world. That kind of stuff.

If you eat 1200kcal a day of rice and safflower oil, your body still ain’t getting any nutrition.

This is why I share peer reviewed studies (to explain how insulin resistance is always physiological), alongside my recommendation of eating less empty calories and more nutrient dense foods.
 

CLASH

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Good thing you mention those, and I’m sorry if I didn’t make it clear, but I wasn’t talking about just calories.

I said too many calories AND too little nutrients. Or if you prefer, too many calories relative to the nutrition profile of a food. Chicken breasts. Pasta. Bagels. Modern fruit picked up unripe somewhere across the world. That kind of stuff.

If you eat 1200kcal a day of rice and safflower oil, your body still ain’t getting any nutrition.

This is why I share peer reviewed studies (to explain how insulin resistance is always physiological), alongside my recommendation of eating less empty calories and more nutrient dense foods.

I understand, however, I dont think calories have so much to do with it, nor do I think nutrients take center stage. I think those are proxies for the real issue which is a drastic increase in the consumption of PUFA in conjunction with the consumption of endotoxin/ dysbiosis inducing foods.

Many of the industrial processed foods are indeed associated with obesity, and are indeed high in calories, however I think the calories are associative factors. Much of the industrial foods are laden with PUFA and refined components. The PUFA overtime induces insulin resistance and some of the refined components induce dysbiosis and endotoxemia which also induces insulin resistance. These factors lead to the pathology of metabolic syndrome which includes more than obesity. I dont think obesity is merely a problem of eating too much. It goes hand in hand with heart disease, diabetes etc., indicating an underlying problem beyond purely eating too much.

I'd also like to clarify here that there are differences to being overweight, and being obese. There are also differences in weight distributions. This is important to delineate, because certain types of weight gain (the types attributed to actually eating too much) aren't associated with metabolic syndrome, while other types of weight gain are (central adiposity marked by increased visceral fat).

Even beyond this, the quantification of foods as calories and then extrapolation of calories as a variable with which determine the effects of foods on disease states is ridiculous in and of itself. The only thing a calorie tells us about food is an obscure reference to the foods amount of "energy" (this value obtained by determining how much heat is produced when the food is literally burned). For example, compare the metabolic effects of 1000 calories of alcohol to 1000 calories of bananas or even 1000 calories of milk. The metabolic effects are significantly different. Beyond an obscure quantification of food for convenience purposes, I think looking at calories as associative for disease is a fools errand.

As far as nutrients go, its a blanket argument. Populations across the world have eaten nutrient poor diets for extended periods of time, for example as has been seen with pellagra in rice eating countries, among others. Obesity was not a major issue in these situation and many of the other situations. Obesity is clearly a modern western disease, that spreads to non-western countries everytime they adopt portions of the western diet. Besides to claim "nutrients" doesnt really answer much. What nutrients? There are numerous nutrients and for the majority of them obesity isn't neccesarily a side effect of thier deficiency. The next question is of relationships of varying amounts of different nutrients, but too my knowledge I haven't seen any hypothesis or reseaech claiming specific nutrients or thier relationships or causal or highly associative. Plus, do we even know if the obese are suffering from a nutrient deficiency due to not intaking enough nutrients or is thier pathologic state inducing a shortage of nutrients?

Lastly, the next question is what about childhood obesity? Have young children really has enough time to overeat by massive amount of calories to put on as much bodyweight as they do? I'd argue, no they most definetly havent.

Overall, it seems to me that there is a pathologic state in metabolic syndrome in regards to the conversion of food to cellular energy. The two most likely culprits considering thier known metabolic effects, effects on insulin sensitivity overtime and thier presence in the obese seem to be endotoxin (a direct inhibitor of mirochondrial function and inducer of cortisol which induces the fat distribution of obesity) and PUFA's that directly damage the mitochondria, liver, vasculature, hormonal systems, lipid system etc.
 

Texon

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Last time I logged 4L of low fat milk and 2L of orange juice I got 2750 calories, which isn't even that much for the amount of food it is. But I agree, people do eat more high carb, high fat, low protein food and gain a lot. I'd rather focus on nutrient dense foods such as low fat milk, eggs, oysters, organ meat and nutrient dense fruit which will quickly increase vitamins and minerals without increasing calories all that much.
Then I'd add in things to support the ETC, such as CoQ10, vitamin C, vitamin E, succinic acid and vitamin K2, none of which has been shown to make people fat. I'd also add in methylene blue if someone tolerates it.
Would love to take inosine or cytoflavin too but how does one avoid gout?
 
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Hans

Hans

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Would love to take inosine or cytoflavin too but how does one avoid gout?
Have you tried them before with bad results?
Carbs (fruit), vitamin B1, B2, folate and calcium, magnesium, zinc, selenium, etc., can help against gout.
 

Texon

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Have you tried them before with bad results?
Carbs (fruit), vitamin B1, B2, folate and calcium, magnesium, zinc, selenium, etc., can help against gout.
Thanks for the suggestions. I tried inosine years ago before knowing about the benefits of some of these vitamins and minerals. Doc says I don't have gout, but my uric acid is consistently about 5.9, and I've heard that you really don't want anything over 5.0. It also could be something called pseudo gout. I have somewhat elevated homocysteine, and I found that I cannot tolerate methyl folate at all so I have to make do with hydroxocobalamin b12, tmg, p5p b6 and such. I have found tart cherry juice extract to be very beneficial also. I'm just trying to find a good way to optimized ATP and mitochondria, etc. At my age of 68 every little bit can be an edge. I think zinc may be needed as well. Thanks again.
 

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