Insulin-Like Substances In Korean Red Ginseng (Adenosine And Pyro-glutamic Acid)

[High_Prob]

https://www.researchgate.net/public...Insulin-Like_Substances_in_Korean_Red_Ginseng

Korean red ginseng powder was found to contain adenosine and an acidic substance which inhibited epinephrine-induced lipolysis and stimulated insulin-mediated lipogenesis from glucose (3, 4). In the present experiment, the chemical structure of this acidic substance is determined to be pyro-glutamic acid. Pyroglutamic acid exhibits selective modulations toward the opposite metabolic pathways in rat adipocytes; it inhibits the lipolysis but rather stimulates the lipogenesis. Based on these results, we suggest to call these substances (adenosine and pyro-glutamic acid) "selective modulators".

 

[LCohen]

Thanks for sharing.

Peat doesn't recommend those "ginsengs" but that looks great. I will search for this korean red ginseng.

 

[High_Prob]

He seems to be favorable toward them here:

http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/1975/pdf/1975-v04n03-p189.pdf

And

https://www.toxinless.com/ray-peat-the-generality-of-adaptogens.pdf

 

[Inaut]

@High_Prob thanks for posting. I especially liked this part on succinic acid from the second link posted above.

"Filatov found that stressed tissues of both plants and animals produce protective and stimulating substances, which can be extracted for medical use. He identified succinic acid as a component of his extracts. Szent- Gyorgyi found that succinic acid stimulates respiration, which might explain why it promotes synthesis of pregnenolone and related steroids. It and fumaric acid are now considered to be adaptogens. Since succinic acid safely chelates toxic heavy metals out of mitochondria, it might also safely carry copper into the mitochondria. Succinic acid is also closely associated with GABA metabolism (gamma-amino butyric acid is converted to succinic semialdehyde in a transamination reaction), and so is probably complementary to the GABA analogs GHB (gamma-hydroxy butyrate) and its lactone (which has anti-viral activity). GABA analogs are now one of the most actively studied classes of adaptogens. GABA has a wide range of stress - blocking actions, including neural inhibition, progesterone promotion, and blood sugar regulation."

 

[Lokzo]

Careful with Korean Red Ginseng, it is INSANELY warming and definitely ups the metabolism and fight/flight Neurotransmitters. It can very quickly deplete your YIN if you're not prepared.

 

[Sativa]

Ah, pyroglutamic acid, also found in Haidut's pro-ATP products.
it's structure forms the basis of the Racetam family, of cognitive enhancers ('smart drugs') & general neuro-modulators. Interesting bunch, my favorite was Piracetam, but now much prefer using the more 'natural' pyroglutamic acid molecule.
Here is what Sodium Pyroglutamate looks like.
I just made some actually! (via 5g bicarbonate + 5g PGA in warm water. I made sure I breathed in the carbon dioxide as it was formed)

 

[Sativa]

<^>

 

[Lokzo]

Ah, pyroglutamic acid, also found in Haidut's pro-ATP products.
it's structure forms the basis of the Racetam family, of cognitive enhancers ('smart drugs') & general neuro-modulators. Interesting bunch, my favorite was Piracetam, but now much prefer using the more 'natural' pyroglutamic acid molecule.
Here is what Sodium Pyroglutamate looks like.
I just made some actually! (via 5g bicarbonate + 5g PGA in warm water. I made sure I breathed in the carbon dioxide as it was formed)
View attachment 15779

That's so cool.

What effects did you notice?

 

[Sativa]

That's so cool.

What effects did you notice?

Since i've briefed myself on all of the related pharmacological involved, I knew what to look for.
I am quite attune to my in vivo pharmacology.
In brief - cognitive enhancement/neurogenesis via AMPA PAM (which results in BDNF release) also metabolic enhancement/support via ATP boosting, as described by Haidut in detail in his Cardenosine thread:
Cardenosine - Liquid Product For R&D

Note: AMPA activation increases BDNF (aka neurogenesis)
AMPA 'positive allosteric modulation' (PAM) is the mechanism of piracetam, a molecule based on the core structure of pyroglutamic acid.
pyroglutamic acid = 5-oxo-pyrrolidine-2-carboxylate -- picture of PGA molecule:

piracetam = 2-oxo-pyrrolidine acetamide -- picture of piracetam molecule:

 

[Sativa]

Ketamine (like piracetam & pyroglutamic acid) also works via AMPA & BDNF...

...the antidepressant effects of ketamine are, in part, mediated by an increase in AMPA activity

...the crucial involvement of AMPA in mediating the antidepressant effects of ketamine.
Studies in rodents show that ketamine produces a rapid and transient rise in glutamate release and cycling in the medial prefronal cortex (mPFC), which in turn leads to the acute activation of AMPA receptors, properties proposed to mediate the rapid antidepressant effects of ketamine.

Cherry on the confirmation cake - an AMPA 'blocker' prevents the ketamine induced pro-neurogenesis effects:

...consistent with the role of AMPA in the actions of ketamine, the ketamine-induced increases in mTOR, BDNF and GluR1 levels can be prevented by pretreatment with the AMPA antagonist NBQX

Instead of ketamine, which is illegal etc, why not just use similar things...like pyroglutamic acid, agmatine, salicylic acid or theanine? all v peaty...

 

[Momado965]

Careful with Korean Red Ginseng, it is INSANELY warming and definitely ups the metabolism and fight/flight Neurotransmitters. It can very quickly deplete your YIN if you're not prepared.

Ashwagandha as well .

 

[Broken man]

Ketamine (like piracetam & pyroglutamic acid) also works via AMPA & BDNF...


Cherry on the confirmation cake - an AMPA 'blocker' prevents the ketamine induced pro-neurogenesis effects:


Instead of ketamine, which is illegal etc, why not just use similar things...like pyroglutamic acid, agmatine, salicylic acid or theanine? all v peaty...

I tried agmatine sulphate but it didnt go well with my gut

 

[johnysummer]

Careful with Korean Red Ginseng, it is INSANELY warming and definitely ups the metabolism and fight/flight Neurotransmitters. It can very quickly deplete your YIN if you're not prepared.

Can you elaborate on what you mean prepared ? I used it last year to get through a very stressful time and I remember it completely eliminated the stress at start and greatly improved mood and cognitive function, but after a while it gave me a kind of anxiety whenever I used it. The cognitive effects persisted tho. I used it for 3-4 months without cycling. Should it be cycled ?