Instructions on How to Supplement With Glandular Thyroid

[ilovethesea]

I recently started taking THYROID from Erfa, 30 mg in the morning on an empty stomach and later added 15 mg an hour after eating lunch. I chew the THYROID and swallow with water. I take the THYROID on an empty stomach as directed by my doctor. He prescribed THYROID at my request after I informed him I did not want to take the Synthroid he prescribed. I'm not sure how familiar my doctor is with THYROID so my question is do I continue taking THYROID on an empty stomach or do I take THYROID with food as Ray Peat and others do with their thyroid medication. The Erfa website is not helpful. Thanks.

You can take Erfa with food or sublingually, it doesn't have to be on an empty stomach like T4 meds.

 

[Jib]

Update: I recently increased my dose to 1/4 tablet once a day. I was very sensitive even to 1/8 tablet once a day as I mentioned earlier, but after a few weeks or so the spacey, heart-racing and dissociated feelings seem to have died down.

I recently ordered some magnesium glycinate in bulk and have been taking around 400mg a day in addition to taking epsom salt + baking soda baths on a regular basis. I don't know how this interacts with thyroid supplementation, but it's definitely been helping me feel more relaxed.

We'll see how the thyroid supplementation goes in the long-term. But for the time being I'm glad I stuck it out so far, because after the initial adaptation period of a month or so I seem to be responding better.

P.S. I've also been having urges to exercise again. I got a new punching bag and have been getting back into practicing karate/boxing and doing push ups, pull ups and some kin-shi-hai-do routines (Google it if you get a chance -- very cool stuff). I'm trying to be careful to only exercise when I really feel like it, because a lot of my problems came from doing low-carb for a year in combination with intermittent fasting and not eating enough calories in general, *and* over-exercising doing extremely intense things like sprinting regularly. *AND* living almost exclusively on nuts and seeds for days at a time.

My morning temperatures still seem to be stuck around 97.3 F or so, and I still have a lot of anxiety and stress, but I'm having spurts where I feel pretty good and pretty stable, and they seem to be lasting longer. The patience has been paying off, and I feel a lot better than I did when my morning temperatures were around 96.0 F.

 

[charlie]

Jib, thats great news!

I make 1/16th pill adjustments now. I found that 1/8th or higher adjustments stress the body out too much.

 

[mother]

I recently started taking THYROID from Erfa, 30 mg in the morning on an empty stomach and later added 15 mg an hour after eating lunch. I chew the THYROID and swallow with water. I take the THYROID on an empty stomach as directed by my doctor. He prescribed THYROID at my request after I informed him I did not want to take the Synthroid he prescribed. I'm not sure how familiar my doctor is with THYROID so my question is do I continue taking THYROID on an empty stomach or do I take THYROID with food as Ray Peat and others do with their thyroid medication. The Erfa website is not helpful. Thanks.

You can take Erfa with food or sublingually, it doesn't have to be on an empty stomach like T4 meds.

Thanks for your reply ilovethesea.

Even before I started nibbling on my Erfa tablets as per RR just a couple of days ago I am still feeling weepy and very sensitive to other peoples comments and my thinking is very pessimistic.
This has happened since starting Erfa July 8th. Today I am feeling very drained. I have only nibbled about 30mg and do not think I'll do the other 15mg today. My temperature seems to have gone up since starting Erfa but I have difficulty taking my pulse. I am eating and drinking as per RP as best as I can given my lack of assess to farmers markets and the like. Your comments are welcomed. Thanks.

 

[ilovethesea]

Thanks for your reply ilovethesea.

Even before I started nibbling on my Erfa tablets as per RR just a couple of days ago I am still feeling weepy and very sensitive to other peoples comments and my thinking is very pessimistic.
This has happened since starting Erfa July 8th. Today I am feeling very drained. I have only nibbled about 30mg and do not think I'll do the other 15mg today. My temperature seems to have gone up since starting Erfa but I have difficulty taking my pulse. I am eating and drinking as per RP as best as I can given my lack of assess to farmers markets and the like. Your comments are welcomed. Thanks.

Were you on thyroid medication before or is this your first time taking it?

If you're just new to Erfa it could be the brand. There is a poster on the Peatarian site called Shanti who mentioned there are some people who have problems with it after it being reformulated. http://peatarian.com/13546/canadians-wh ... egnenolone. Maybe you can ask her about this. I haven't had any issues myself but I wasn't taking it in the old days.

Otherwise if you're completely new to taking thyroid it is most likely that you're not at the right dose yet. This is Broda Barnes protocol:
Starting dose : The size of a proper starting dose of thyroid will vary with the age and size of the patient. Usually a child under 3 years will not need more than one-quarter grain daily. By the age of six, one-half grain may be used in the beginning. A teenager or adult may safely be started on one grain daily. For a particularly large man or woman, two brains may be used - but no more than that at the beginning.
Further dosage : The starting dosage should be maintained for about two months. After that, if necessary, the dosage may be increased.

One grain is 60 mg so if you're only on 15 that's not much.

Another reason for the low moods can be high estrogen. Are you taking Progest-E?

 

[Padmaaa]

I just wanted you to know about a new thyroid that I am testing. It is the Nutri-Meds Borvine Thyroid Capsules. I had been on the Armour and the Cytomel. I was finding that my pulse was getting a bit high. Anyway, Clint Mongan tuned me in to this thyroid and I am finding that I am getting great results from it. My temps are high and my pulse doesn't get to wacky. I spoke to the owner of the company and he said that this is pure bovine thyroid tissue. There is nothing else added to this. I asked him how this compared to other thyroid supplements ( like Armour) and he said it is like comparing orange juice to vitamin C supplements. I am also doing some pure fructose,B1, and gelatin that Clint is testing and I am seeing that I am having fantastic results with this. it just feels better. I was so excited about this thyroid supplement that I went and put it in my e store. It is worth checking out. It is available and not expensive. Also, it is easy to reach the owners of the company to ask questions. Here it is if you are curious. I am taking this now. http://www.arkofwellness.com/shop/produ ... -capsules/

Hi ARK

In October 2012 you wrote that you started taking Nutri-Meds Brovine Thyroid Capsules. How it is working?

 

[mother]

[highlight=#ff80ff]

Thanks for your reply ilovethesea.

Even before I started nibbling on my Erfa tablets as per RR just a couple of days ago I am still feeling weepy and very sensitive to other peoples comments and my thinking is very pessimistic.
This has happened since starting Erfa July 8th. Today I am feeling very drained. I have only nibbled about 30mg and do not think I'll do the other 15mg today. My temperature seems to have gone up since starting Erfa but I have difficulty taking my pulse. I am eating and drinking as per RP as best as I can given my lack of assess to farmers markets and the like. Your comments are welcomed. Thanks.

Were you on thyroid medication before or is this your first time taking it?

If you're just new to Erfa it could be the brand. There is a poster on the Peatarian site called Shanti who mentioned there are some people who have problems with it after it being reformulated. http://peatarian.com/13546/canadians-wh ... egnenolone. Maybe you can ask her about this. I haven't had any issues myself but I wasn't taking it in the old days.

Otherwise if you're completely new to taking thyroid it is most likely that you're not at the right dose yet. This is Broda Barnes protocol:
Starting dose : The size of a proper starting dose of thyroid will vary with the age and size of the patient. Usually a child under 3 years will not need more than one-quarter grain daily. By the age of six, one-half grain may be used in the beginning. A teenager or adult may safely be started on one grain daily. For a particularly large man or woman, two brains may be used - but no more than that at the beginning.
Further dosage : The starting dosage should be maintained for about two months. After that, if necessary, the dosage may be increased.

One grain is 60 mg so if you're only on 15 that's not much.

Another reason for the low moods can be high estrogen. Are you taking Progest-E?

[/highlight]

ilovethesea, I just seen your replied to my post - thank you.
I did take a thyroid medication for a couple of months 12 years ago to boost the effects of an antidepressant I was taking at that time. I can not recall the name of the thyroid I was prescribed, but I felt terrible taking it and all the other meds I was on at the time. In In 1976 I took a thyroid medication for about 3 months - I wish I knew the name of that thyroid medication because I felt the best I ever felt in my life. I moved away and the new doctor I was seeing wouldn't prescribe thyroid meds, as my tests did not show that I required it. So 37 years later I am looking for a thyroid med that will have me feeling "the best I ever felt in my life" again. I've slowly increased my Erfa back up to 30mg; nibbling it through out the day with food. I read that Charlie started out with a larger dose and found out he needed to scale back to just a nibble or two. I can not recall which thyroid med he is on, but I do not think it is Erfa. I asked RP about my reaction to Erfa and his reply was: "That kind of reaction suggests very low thyroid, it takes some time for the liver to respond to thyroid, and to regulate the other hormones, and you should be able to tell the right amount by the way you feel." So my plan is to continue with Erfa, slowly increasing it until I feel good. If the Erfa fails me, then I will need to find a way to get thyroid from Mexico- this maybe difficult for a Canadian. I read Shanti's post, she seems to have lucked out with her Canadian doctor; which hasn't been the case with me. I have just received my Pregnenolone and am hesitant; should start taking it now or wait till I get my Erfa figured out. Originally when I asked RP about taking Pregnenolone, he said that most women over 40 could benefit from it. When I asked him today if I should go ahead, knowing that I was still not stable with my Erfa dosing, he did not answer that part of my email. I am not taking Progest E. Do you think it would be of benefit for me as a postmenopausal woman to take Progest E? I have also access to DHEA if I need it. So any suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you.

 

[charlie]

My dose is only half a pill at this time. I started my dad out on 1/16th a pill, and he had quick results. He is now on 1/8th a pill a day and going good. I think most of us probably take too much in the beginning and should start out much lower. If any of my family members were to ask how much to take I would suggest starting at 1/16th a pill is the way to go.

Pregnenlone also increases metabolism, so if you take it with thyroid be prepared to lower your dosage.

I am constantly adjusting thyroid dose. Between sun, stress, and what have nots, the dose requirement is constantly changing.

 

[mother]

Charlie, are you back taking Pregnenolone? When and how are you dosing with it?

 

[charlie]

Yes, about 10mg in the morning after breakfast with some orange juice.

The problems I was having with pregnenolone before is that it was pushing up my metabolism too fast causing a stress response. I have worked through that now and found small doses are much better for me, and making sure to get plenty of fuel before I take it.

 

[Padmaaa]

Hi All,

I'm currently taking 3 tablets of Nutri-Meds Granular Thyroid and 1/2 Cynomel (in 4 small dosage), but I'd like to switch to a Cynoplus and Cyonmel combo, but I don't know how much T3 and T4 is in Nutri-Meds.

I wrote to the company asking about the amount of T3 and T4 in Nutri-Meds but they didn't want to give out any information about this.

Does any of you have any experience with Nutri-Meds and how it compares to Cynoplus or Armour or other NDT?

Thanks

 

[tomisonbottom]

Jib, thats great news!

I make 1/16th pill adjustments now. I found that 1/8th or higher adjustments stress the body out too much.

Hi Charlie,

Does the stress response cause a long term problem or is that something someone could "push through" and keep taking thyroid and it would correct itself? Or would it cause more damage?
Just wondering if it's kinda like ripping the band off or if it's just a plain bad idea. I get calm and warmer with thyroid but I started out and 1/5 to 1/4 of Cynomel right off the bat. I sometimes get stressed but I just keep taking my temp and trying to regulate it with salt, Progest E and thyroid. What are your thoughts on that? Thanks!

 

[charlie]

The stress response does level out. Thats why I push up the dose slowly so the stress response wont be so intense. I let it level out, then push up again.

 

[jaa]

I kept my Thiroyd pills in the freezer for a week. The bottle has almost 1000 pills. Are they worthless now or can I salvage some benefit from them?

 

[ilovethesea]

ilovethesea, I just seen your replied to my post - thank you.
I did take a thyroid medication for a couple of months 12 years ago to boost the effects of an antidepressant I was taking at that time. I can not recall the name of the thyroid I was prescribed, but I felt terrible taking it and all the other meds I was on at the time. In In 1976 I took a thyroid medication for about 3 months - I wish I knew the name of that thyroid medication because I felt the best I ever felt in my life. I moved away and the new doctor I was seeing wouldn't prescribe thyroid meds, as my tests did not show that I required it. So 37 years later I am looking for a thyroid med that will have me feeling "the best I ever felt in my life" again. I've slowly increased my Erfa back up to 30mg; nibbling it through out the day with food. I read that Charlie started out with a larger dose and found out he needed to scale back to just a nibble or two. I can not recall which thyroid med he is on, but I do not think it is Erfa. I asked RP about my reaction to Erfa and his reply was: "That kind of reaction suggests very low thyroid, it takes some time for the liver to respond to thyroid, and to regulate the other hormones, and you should be able to tell the right amount by the way you feel." So my plan is to continue with Erfa, slowly increasing it until I feel good. If the Erfa fails me, then I will need to find a way to get thyroid from Mexico- this maybe difficult for a Canadian. I read Shanti's post, she seems to have lucked out with her Canadian doctor; which hasn't been the case with me. I have just received my Pregnenolone and am hesitant; should start taking it now or wait till I get my Erfa figured out. Originally when I asked RP about taking Pregnenolone, he said that most women over 40 could benefit from it. When I asked him today if I should go ahead, knowing that I was still not stable with my Erfa dosing, he did not answer that part of my email. I am not taking Progest E. Do you think it would be of benefit for me as a postmenopausal woman to take Progest E? I have also access to DHEA if I need it. So any suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you.

RP will never tell you to do or not do something, he can't give specific advice. Also,he's already written his views about progesterone for post menopausal women. http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/pr ... ries.shtml

 

[smuthie]

I kept my Thiroyd pills in the freezer for a week. The bottle has almost 1000 pills. Are they worthless now or can I salvage some benefit from them?

Did they get moisture on them from condensation? Are they dry? I think if they are dry you might still use them, even if they are a little less potent from the temperature change. Do any of the experts here know for sure? A thousand pills is a lot to lose. I think if it was mine, I'd use them anyway. Then when it was time for a new batch, being sure not to change or increase the dose for a couple of weeks to smooth over any increase in potency from the old batch to the new.

 

[smuthie]

The doctor at the walk-in clinic I use was not comfortable increasing my synthroid even though she recognized I probably need more than the 25 mcg I've been on. She insists I see an endocrinologist but I do not have the $150 visit + $250 lab work fee = $400 which must be paid up front since I have no insurance. My TSH is just under 2 so I'm controlled just fine according to them, but my symptoms are as if the TSH was higher. I want to feel better.

So, I ordered Thiroyd to use on my own. I am using it as an adjunct to the levothyroxine prescription. Since I have learned how to read my blood results and seem to understand them better than that clinic's last 3 doctors, I am just going to use the clinic for getting the regular testing done and keeping the T4 prescription filled.

I have learned the hard way that I'm a sensitive responder, so am taking it very slow. To save money I changed from the $83.95 Synthroid to the $10 generic by Mylan. That affected me much more badly than I expected and it took me a month to get used to the different strength. The Mylan is weaker but the next batch could be stronger, so am getting all 3 months worth at one time so at least for three months at a time I can predict the next pill's potency. I'm now adding the Thiroyd which at first tried to add in 1/8 pill but after a few days decided to go for a whole 1/4. After about two weeks I could tell a small but definite improvement in just not being quite as tired all the time.

I decided the Thiroyd being 1000 pills is better to base my treatment on than the 90 pills of T4 at a time, because changes are harder on my system and take longer to get used to than I'd like. So I started taking only half the T4 when I increased the Thiroyd to 1/2 pill. This took me down a bit on the total T4 amount but up a bit on the T3. I seem to feel more energy sooner with the Thiroyd than with the synthetic. For the first week I took it 1/4 in a.m. with the T4, and the other 1/4 in the early afternoon. Then to simplify things I took the whole 1/2 in the morning with the T4 after the first week.

I thought I could feel more energy by a day or two after the change. After a week there had to be objective improvement (not all in my head) because both my daughter and my mother commented about me having more energy and looking like I'm feeling better. My daughter noticed my bones aren't popping so much in the morning and I haven't been saying, oh my back hurts, when I get up. I have noticed the bottoms of my feet do not hurt as much! They always feel like they've been caned, or I sleep-walked on rocks or something.

I started having middle-of-the-night sweats again, but my temperature is usually around 96.6 to 96.8 and I'm shivering cold while it's going on. Then I wake up toward morning feeling too hot and like a warm sweat, and my temp is 97.0 or 97.1 when it feels to me like it should be over 99 or 100! so it seems like just a phase on the path toward normal. I may just be going a little bit too fast upping the Thiroyd in my eagerness to get my energy and health back.

I am next upping the Thiroyd to 3/4 pill, keeping the T4 on the 1/2 pill. I think I will keep it there for a month before deciding if I need to go up another 1/4. I am using my daytime maximum average temperature as a guideline. Right now it's up to 97.7 so I don't have that much farther to go! I do feel a million times better. If I was only dosing on how I feel I might stop and hold where I am, but I want to see what optimum is like. When my temps are 98.6 or if I get any hyper symptoms I will stop or go back down 1/4 on the Thiroyd.

I am looking forward to a holiday season where I actually feel like enjoying it instead of having a nap during all my spare time. Naps are great but I'm sad at missing out on so much of the fun all the time. At this rate, I'll be feeling just fine and dandy at Christmastime!!

 

[charlie]

I am now waiting at least 4-6 weeks after changing my dose to decided if I need to raise or lower it. Those middle of the night sweats could be from estrogen, which could be from possibly raising too fast, or just too much thyroid for what your body can handle right now.

 

[smuthie]

I am now waiting at least 4-6 weeks after changing my dose to decided if I need to raise or lower it. Those middle of the night sweats could be from estrogen, which could be from possibly raising too fast, or just too much thyroid for what your body can handle right now.

Thanks, Charlie! Maybe I should wait another couple of weeks to make any change. I'll work on getting more carrots in and the other guidelines to help counteract too much estrogen. That makes sense because of what phase my cycle is in, too. One thing is, I haven't been as good lately about eating enough, or all the right things, distracted since I just got a new job (p/t, but yay!). So I need to re-focus on making sure that department is taken care of. It's so easy to just forget to eat all day, then eat something convenient, thinking I'll do better tomorrow. :)

 

[superhuman]

4peatssake: what is your current thyroid regime in terms of cynoplus and cytomel and when did it start making an effect? ive tried both but never noticed anything from T3 only or both